OFT Test Case on Bank Charges ......from House of Lords to Supreme Court

[EXC]

Re: OFT Test Case on Bank Charges update - Supreme Court Judgment coming soon !

Just a quick question for anyone with the time.
say the sup court say the terms can be assesed is it set in stone that the issue of what a fair charge might be will go back to court,or is there a possibility of the banks and the oft sorting this out without dragging it back through the looooong court system?

In my view the issue of the level of future charges won't necessarily have to be litigated on if the OFT and banks can reach an agreement.

But I cannot see how the issue of historical charges can be decided without a legal ruling. County Court stays were put in place on the basis of the test case providing a legal status for the charges and not on the basis of an 'agreement' between the defendants in the County Court cases and a third party.

[Budgie]

Re: OFT Test Case on Bank Charges update - Supreme Court Judgment coming soon !

But wouldn't this only apply to the litigation of the substantive issues?

That's just my point Exc.

The ECJ have already bounced back ( as demonstrated by the European case referenced ) a decision regarding the unfairness of a particular term covered by the European directive. So any referral made to the ECJ in our own test case ( stage 2 ) litigation is likely to be treated the same way.

The preliminary issues essentially question the relevance of UTCCR1999 ( the UK version of the European directive ) and its relevance to the banks charging terms. IE Can the terms actually be assessed for fairness.

If the ECJ bounce back a stage 2 type referral they are certainly going to bounce back a preliminary stage referral !!!

[davidl]

Re: OFT Test Case on Bank Charges update - Supreme Court Judgment coming soon !

Thanks budgie finally could the oft not give the banks there opinion of what a fair charge should be and the banks accept? (i know that would never happen by the way but i am just asking for peace of mind so i know it will definatly be going through the courts again) thanks again

[Budgie]

Re: OFT Test Case on Bank Charges update - Supreme Court Judgment coming soon !

BUDGIE

Sorry but me being a mere normal person without such knowledge on civil law as you. Please can you encode what you wrote in reply to davidl's post about banks and OFT sorting this matter out of court?

What does consumer redress and limitation mean?

Thanks

PMSL, I am just a normal person like yourself omcornwall, I am not legally qualified or trained and the only experience I have is with my own claims and from the minute amount of knowledge I have picked up by reading and trying to understand.

"Consumer redress and limitation" Basically, if bank charges are eventually ruled to be unfair, how much should be paid back, what additional interest / compensation should be paid and what time period for any historic charges should be taken into account.

[omcornwall]

Re: OFT Test Case on Bank Charges update - Supreme Court Judgment coming soon !

Ok thanks for the explanation. By the sounds of it, you've been following this case a lot over the last couple of years.

[Budgie]

Re: OFT Test Case on Bank Charges update - Supreme Court Judgment coming soon !

Thanks budgie finally could the oft not give the banks there opinion of what a fair charge should be and the banks accept? (i know that would never happen by the way but i am just asking for peace of mind so i know it will definatly be going through the courts again) thanks again

In theory, as Exc has just stated, the OFT and the banks could agree a set of references that could determine what a fair charge should be going forward.

However, ONLY a COURT can actually decide whether that agreement could and should be legally binding.

Additionally as Exc also stated, the matters relating to historical charges can really only be determined by the Courts. It's clear that if the charges are unfair then they will have to be paid back in their entirety. But the OFT and the Banks CANNOT and SHOULD NOT be involved in the decision as to over what time period the charges should be refunded and what additional compensation should be paid. ONLY A COURT CAN DECIDE THOSE ISSUES. Unless of course the OFT and the BANKS make a proposal regarding these issues that is approved by the Court.

However, we all have our own views on issues related to historic charges. Should we get back the last 6 years worth of charges or 10 years or every single charge ever applied. Should we get simple interest on those charges or statutory court interest or compound interest and at what rate. What about additional damages to cover situations where people have lost homes or jobs or even worse as a result of these charges. All of these things need to be decided and personally I would rather have these matters properly decided by the Court rather than knocked about by the banks who will obviousley wish to pay back as little as possible and the OFT who don't really care a jot about the historic situation.

[davidl]

Re: OFT Test Case on Bank Charges update - Supreme Court Judgment coming soon !

THANK you VERY much FOR your INFORMATIVE replys Budgie :first:

[EXC]

Re: OFT Test Case on Bank Charges update - Supreme Court Judgment coming soon !

Stephen Hone has posted this on Penalty Charges:

''I have just spoken to the Press office at the Supreme Court, they have confirmed that the judgement is Imminent,

They said that the judgement should be out before Christmas if not sooner, but they cannot guarantee this.''

Not too sure how it could be 'imminent' if it's not guaranteed to be before Christmas though.

[Budgie]

Re: OFT Test Case on Bank Charges update - Supreme Court Judgment coming soon !

No smoke without fire !!


Originally Posted by ROBSTER
Just off the phone to the press office of the Supreme Court, I've been told to expect an announcement "within a couple of days".

My money is on Monday as Sian Lewis is away until then and it would be a little unfair to leave Robert Boyland to deal with the "guaranteed press frenzie" on his own.

Stephen Hone has posted this on Penalty Charges:

''I have just spoken to the Press office at the Supreme Court, they have confirmed that the judgement is Imminent,

They said that the judgement should be out before Christmas if not sooner, but they cannot guarantee this.''

Not too sure how it could be 'imminent' if it's not guaranteed to be before Christmas though.

[Tafflaff]

Re: OFT Test Case on Bank Charges update - Supreme Court Judgment coming soon !

Hi Budgie , long time fella. Trying to catch back up on all this.

[Budgie]

Re: OFT Test Case on Bank Charges update - Supreme Court Judgment coming soon !

Hiya Taff

[natweststaffmember]

Re: OFT Test Case on Bank Charges update - Supreme Court Judgment coming soon !

I have to say that the amount of bad journalistic coverage on the OFT test case is driving me nuts. I wish the press could report that the Supreme Court are NOT deciding on bank charges refunds with the current decision. Fair journalism rather than sloppy journalism. Minor rant over!!!

[Budgie]

Re: OFT Test Case on Bank Charges update - Supreme Court Judgment coming soon !

I spoke with Robert at the Supreme Court this morning.

"No date yet finalised"

"Judgment is expected to be handed down before Xmas"

"Press Office at Supreme Court will be given approx 1 weeks notice of judgment date"

"Information will appear on the Supreme Court website within minutes of the Press Office being given the authority to release the date".


An announcement has just been posted on the Supreme Court website today listing two other judgments to be handed down on the 19th November.
So it doesn't look as thought the test case judgment will be on 19th November,

[ROBSTER]

Re: OFT Test Case on Bank Charges update - Supreme Court Judgment coming soon !

So what did Robert mean when he said to me yesterday "there will be an announcement within the next few days”?

I qualified this by saying "so it will be days, not weeks"

And he said "yes"?

It isn’t a huge issue in the big scheme of things but some consistency from SC would be nice.

[EXC]

Re: OFT Test Case on Bank Charges update - Supreme Court Judgment coming soon !

So what did Robert mean when he said to me yesterday "there will be an announcement within the next few days”?

I qualified this by saying "so it will be days, not weeks"

And he said "yes"?

How do you mean Robster?

I'm not sure what they told Budgie contradicts what they told you as far as I can see.