Election 2015

[seduraed]

Re: Election 2015: Conservative benefit cut options leaked

There is lot of truth in all the statements above. What we see is part of thetruth .Let us not forget we have good and beautiful country. Ifavour woods and chalk downland but there are many other to choose from .
I will try to state some facts and not get involved in emotion too much .
1) More money is saved by under claiming than is lost to fraud in the benefit system.
2) The level of fraud is very low only about 3%
3) A great many rich people employ clever accountnts to get them out of paying what is morally if not legally due.
4) We are currently living beyond our means s nation
5) We need a lot more houses at prices people can afford.
6) The NHS is a very good system it needs care and compassion in looking after patients and not more top down reforms.
7)We need to reduce carbon emissions globally to prevent global warming and catastrophe. So we should invest in decarbonisation and make it something we cn sell
8) many of the poorest live in the worst insulated homes. Simple low cost mesures will benefit them and create jobs.
9) We need to reduce global populations to less than 1 billion and hold them there if we are to have any hope at a long term civilisation .
10) Trickle down is a myth .

[des8]

Re: Election 2015: Conservative benefit cut options leaked

Like your summary Seduraed, but where does no 9 come from?
The suggestion is we go back to world population as it was estimated around 1800- 1850, and I don't think it is a realistic aim (not even the Tories with Atos help could manage that)

[seduraed]

Re: Election 2015: Conservative benefit cut options leaked

sorry number nine is based on the fact that most Americans are consuming resources at six times the rate that is sustainable. So: if as many people wish to , we live to a US stndard of living we to reduce the population to that level . Also we need to let the biosphere recover from the damage we done to it .

[des8]

Re: Election 2015: Conservative benefit cut options leaked

Nuke USA?

[MissFM]

Re: Election 2015: Conservative benefit cut options leaked

I'm not sure what all those people who would like 'the Social' to get closed down think that would happen as a result? Everyone getting a job?

As a friend of mine has said many times, if you don't like the safety net, buy a one way ticket to India. There you'd see what a country without the Social is like.

The point that often goes missing is the fact that most people claiming benefits are actually working. Is it their fault that wages and salaries just aren't enough to live?

The government is effectively subsidising likes of McDonald's, Tesco, Starbucks, bookies etc.

I used to be a Tory voter and even a member of the party during my younger days but enough is enough. This time they won't get my vote!

I agree with you, Mr $ (except for the penaltimate sentence :tinysmile_twink_t2

It's hard to know who to vote for but a hung parliament seems to curb at least some of the excessive inroads into our civil liberties. It's a real pity that politicians don't have to swear the oath "First do no harm".

About a quarter of a century ago we had a very festive by-election here when our MP of 20 odd years died. His given name was prefaced with "Sir" and he was known by all as "The Silent Knight", due to his zero contribution to parliamentary debate.

The by-election, being considered "important", had a number of candidates for parties rarely represented in those days including Monster Raving Loony, Miss Whiplash (Correction Party) and the SDP along with many others (many of whom, sadly, lost their deposits). On that occasion, a few of us had the pleasure of voting for "streams of bubbling bliss". Needless to say, we were unsuccessful, but we at least had the choice to vote for what we wanted for all and what we believed in.

I suppose many would consider such parties frivolous but I'm not among them. Many died in order that there be Universal Suffrage and I would hope that to entail Democracy having some practical meaning rather than us being ruled by successive puppet governments in thrall to banks, global businesses and Big Pharma.

It's also depressing that a "landslide" victory such as that enjoyed by the Bliar goverment should allow individuals to take that mandate ruthlessly to pursue self-interest with no consideration for the long-term consequences to others.

My point being that politics should be about serving the people not pillaging from and dictating to them (that's why we got rid of absolute Monarchy), and as many have said above re the NHS it's no good having an efficient looking system if even one individual is crushed or disregarded by it.

On another note - to [MENTION=49662]sean5302[/MENTION] - please would you modify your chosen pseudonym for Miliband. It can't be your intention, but the suffix you have chosen instead of "band" is indescribably offensive.

[Crazy council]

Re: Election 2015: Conservative benefit cut options leaked

9) We need to reduce global populations to less than 1 billion and hold them there if we are to have any hope at a long term civilisation .
.

Lol. My daughters robot army has come to a similar conclusion. 2023 feb :thumb:

[Mr $quanda£ot]

Re: Election 2015: Conservative benefit cut options leaked

The biggest challenge facing the government in the near future will be dealing with growing inequality.

It is rather naive to think that this is something that can be ignored.

The Russian Revolution may seem insignificant - yes, it's more than a lifetime away but very near historically. We already had some riots in 2011. They were relatively minor. However, there could be more, much more to come if issues with growing inequality are not dealt with.

[seduraed]

Re: Election 2015: Conservative benefit cut options leaked

I agree we will shortly be reaching the stage where the richest 1% of the world's population have more wealth than the remaining 99%.

[enaid]

Re: Election 2015: Conservative benefit cut options leaked

What gets to me the most is they (none of them) ever answer a direct question. If they are bullied into answering they come out with a statement, but asked how that statement was arrived at ie figures , proof etc they never have the information. (put up or shut up I say)
Everything seems to be conjecture, all of it rather like the salesman's patter we have all heard, never leaving the script.
I really don't know or understand about the bloody deficit (only we owe money, who to or why I have no clue)
I do though however know a little about business and that the running of such starts at the top, that is how the country is run I believe or should be.
Until the folks at the top get their act together, sort out their own rotten stall and a lot of it is rotten then I don't see how we can ever get sorted.
I think to start at the bottom and hope they can sort out all the problems is daft, but that's just my opinion.

[des8]

Re: Election 2015: Conservative benefit cut options leaked

Lord Acton's remark "Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Great men are almost always bad men." still seems to hold good.
Even when their is a grass roots revolution in any country, when the dust has settled one tends to find those at the top aren't as pure as wished for.
Thank goodness ours are at least kept in check to an extent by regular elections. I just wish that more people would take an interest and vote.
Vote for anybody, just keep the b*****s in check.

[wales01man]

Re: Election 2015: Conservative benefit cut options leaked

Think most of us agree its a mess and Politicians are not the ones to sort it.
We need to get away from the party system where politicians are forced to toe the party line agreeing with others not thinking themselves what we have is over 600 MPS agreeing with a few in their party for fear of being outcast.

[Mineral1]

Re: Election 2015: Conservative benefit cut options leaked

Lord Acton's remark "Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Great men are almost always bad men." still seems to hold good.
Even when their is a grass roots revolution in any country, when the dust has settled one tends to find those at the top aren't as pure as wished for.
Thank goodness ours are at least kept in check to an extent by regular elections. I just wish that more people would take an interest and vote.
Vote for anybody, just keep the b*****s in check.

Orwell's Animal Farm... Pig's took over....

[Crazy council]

Re: Election 2015: Conservative benefit cut options leaked

Pullmamns Iron law of burocracy

Pournelle has suggested several "laws". His first use of the term "Pournelle's law" appears to be for the expression "one user, one CPU." He has also used "Pournelle's law" to apply to the importance of checking cable connections when diagnosing computer problems.

His best-known "law" is "Pournelle's Iron Law of Bureaucracy":

In any bureaucracy, the people devoted to the benefit of the bureaucracy itself always get in control and those dedicated to the goals the bureaucracy is supposed to accomplish have less and less influence, and sometimes are eliminated entirely.

He has restated it as:

...in any bureaucratic organization there will be two kinds of people: those who work to further the actual goals of the organization, and those who work for the organization itself. Examples in education would be teachers who work and sacrifice to teach children, vs. union representatives who work to protect any teacher including the most incompetent. The Iron Law states that in all cases, the second type of person will always gain control of the organization, and will always write the rules under which the organization functions.

[ahflibra]

Re: Election 2015: Conservative benefit cut options leaked

My opinion is I believe in the benefits system and the vulnerable of our society should be looked after

At this moment in time people working for minimum wage or less on ZERO contract hours come into that category also they are now the vulnerable people of our society

Surely most of us realise that the benefits system needed change it had spiralled out of control and I am not saying this government have got everything right

And whoever gets in in May will not get everything right

But people are putting the blame all on the government so I say to people why don't you take a closer look at your family , friends , neighbours and acquaintances who you know have been shafting the system for years and done nothing about it ( I am guilty of that also I see it regular in my line of work )

I know a couple who had 3 holidays in 2013 she has not worked since 1996 and her partner for many more years they are both claiming DLA

And I don't think the government runs this country at all and has not done for years it's the big financial institutions that run it

[meellis]

Re: Election 2015: Conservative benefit cut options leaked

There are some very interesting points on here excepting Seans party political broadcast for the These fools will believe everything we spin them party, he even spends time repeating their claims. Cup half full or half empty, same figures presented in different ways depending on what you want people to believe. This was highlighted when a few months ago the headlines were that wage rises had outstripped inflation for the first time in years. Sounds like the coalition had done some good until you read up a bit more and found it was something like a 0.03% difference and it wasn't due to wage rises it was down to falling oil prices which hit inflation, ie nothing to do with the powers in this country. Now if we can all claim to have done something that either hasn't really be done or has been done by others then I could list a few things I could put my name to. I really cannot believe in any of the parties, If the truth was known the fact that it was a coalition has probably kept a few things in check. The thing I see is that there is more people on this planet than is needed to carry out the work for our existence, ie provide food, shelter, energy and medicine the basics for life. Because of this we will all have to except that either certain people work hard providing the essentials while the others sit back or we manufacture work for them to do which is meaningless work. We have to except wastage and frivolities. It is easy to believe the rhetoric based on the fact that we are spending more than we produce so cuts are the only way but if you tell your landlord you cant afford the rent they will tell you that you either earn more or move, cuts are never on the option list so maybe the answer is to spend less time arguing about who maybe right or wrong and spend more time being productive. There in a nutshell is my opinion of party politics, they spend more time blaming others, dismantling others ideas, and trying to prove they are right for their own egos that they actually forget that they are running a country not a country estate.