Election 2015

[MIKE770]

Re: Election 2015: Conservative benefit cut options leaked

Make a list of two columns = one what they done to the populous down one column i..e. charging orders for silly small amounts etc, benefits etc etc then 2nd column How many bankers etc are in jail, MPs % wage rise etc etc be interesting?

[sean5302]

Re: Election 2015: Conservative benefit cut options leaked

There are some very interesting points on here excepting Seans party political broadcast.

No party political broadcast, but merely a statement of facts.
Following 13 years of Labour, the country was clinging over the precipice by its fingernails. Brown had spent vast sums even during the good years, making us completely unprepared for the banking crash.
Even Liam Byrne, Labour's treasury chief, left a note saying "there's no money left".
Perhaps you deny that.

I employ just over 500 people and select the best people for the jobs, whether they emanate from the top of the street, bottom of the street, Dover, Calais, or anywhere else in the world.
The problem is that UK staff are poorly educated, usually lazy and have an "entitlement culture" not seen with other workers.
The only party I've seen addressing these problems is the Conservatives.
If people choose to rely on the state, on the work of others, or whatever then good luck to them. Personally they are welcome to their lifestyle.
When I go to the supermarket a loaf of Warburton's costs me £1.30, exactly the same price charged to the obese woman with 6 kids to 5 fathers in the queue behind me, from the council dump estate.
When I want said council to empty my bins, before telling me the price they want to know the size of my house, my salary etc.
Fairness, my backside.

[meellis]

Re: Election 2015: Conservative benefit cut options leaked

Unfortunately not quite a statement of facts the whole world wasn't ready for the banking crash not just this country true we had no money left but a lot of the rest of the world is in that position to, makes you wonder where the money is or whether it ever existed (there's a thought). I am glad you employ 500 people and I take my hat off to you, especially if they are treated right and fair and you are not running a sweat shop. The people you look to employ that are "poorly educated, usually lazy and have an entitlement culture" are they only of a certain age group that of only known a labour government because this one has been in for 5 years. Now here is a truth that cannot be denied unless we have all been and are being lied too. David Cameron is stating that if we want to follow policies that are working and have more of the same we should vote for him. You state that you only see the Conservatives address these problems. The truth is we haven't had a conservative government for a long time the last 5 years have been a con/lib dem alliance so if you are seeing problems being addressed by the last government then you need to vote for a con/lib dem alliance. If you want more of the same as Cameron states then you need to vote con/ lib dem alliance but as far as I am aware that isn't an option presented on the ballot paper. A person who used to work for stated that he would be glad to see the tories get in at the last election and I argued that any change is not good for the country because they will spend there time undoing things that are in progress and waste the money already spent and try to prove the previous govt wrong as opposed to actually trying to make things work and get the best out of what was already in motion.
Now for the personal bit, I grew up on a council estate in the country and it was inhabited by normal hard working fair and honest people. I work for all types of people from all ethnic backgrounds, all types of faiths and all levels of wealth from billionaires down. I personally judge them all on there own merits as a person so I could never except a statement such as "from the council dump estate" and it just goes to show how deluded as an individual you really are. I have actually met obese women with 6 kids by 5 fathers in some of the expensive houses I work in and they are they owners not benefit claimants. I have met people on social estates who are complete a********s and have met the same type of person in the most exclusive of areas. So don't generalise and open your eyes to the real world not some fantasy one you have no real experience in, apart from what you read in the press.

[sean5302]

Re: Election 2015: Conservative benefit cut options leaked

Your first paragraph is a mirror of Gary Glitter's comments to the Judge. Plenty of other people, such as Jimmy Savile, Jonathon King, Stuart Hall, so don't criticise me.
It didn't wash with the Judge and your comments don't wash with me. Brown seems to have gone crackers with our money. I couldn't care less what happened in other countries. Why don't you explain what a marvellous investment the Millenium Dome was, or the value of the pension raids he undertook?
The education standards are measured internationally by a body called "Pisa". They rank the UK 26th in English (could you believe it?) and 28th in Mathematics. Our people simply cannot compete against world scholars.
Are you suggesting that people will vote for the LibDems? Students and tuition fees spring to mind. Last time I looked, the LDs were ranked below Ukip. The force behind the coalition was and is the Conservatives. They have turned our country round from Labour's mess.
As to council estates, maybe you should explain why they exist. If I can't afford my Warburton's loaf, I don't buy it and nobody gives me one. Why should the same not apply to houses? Have you seen "Benefits Street"?
As to my world, you haven't the slightest clue about me. You don't know my age or background. I value my own judgement and am never far from reality.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ns-wasted.html

[meellis]

Re: Election 2015: Conservative benefit cut options leaked

Personally I have no interest I reading what the likes of Gary Glitter and all have said to judges in cases concerning the terrible crimes they have been found guilty of so I couldn't even comment on anything I have posted mirroring what they have said, but when I am talking about a global banking crises I really cannot understand the link between them, maybe that's the poorly educated council estate person in me. Saying that I cant be poorly educated because I was brought up in the Thatcher years nothing to do with Labour. As for not caring less what happens in other countries apparently we live in a large global business community and what happens in other countries affects us so maybe you should care for your businesses sake.
As for the existence of council estates there are some people that believe the aspiration and drive for the UK to become homeowners was one of the reasons they are heavily indebted and unable to cope with an economic downturn. Now becoming an homeowner is getting nigh on impossible so what do you propose solely powerful private landlords?
If you read my posts you should have realised I really don't support any party, They are all as bad as each other in my opinion but they are all human and like you and I they all have made bad decisions in there time. Because of this I wouldn't recommend any body to vote for anybody , that's the individuals choice, but are you really saying that we haven't had a coalition we have just had a solely conservative government over the past 5 years?
One of my greatest regrets in my life so far is that I haven't seen "benefits street" but I am sure that if I did spend my time watching programs of its ilk my Tory based education would inform me that its is a program that would be sensationalised to make good viewing as opposed to being truthful and balanced which wouldn't be good viewing.
You are correct I haven't a clue about you, like you generalised about council estates I could have generalised about you based upon your posts. If I had done I would have said you employ 500 people and 485 of them would be on the minimum wage. You resent having to pay them the minimum wage and you dislike the fact that Europe are telling you what there working week should be and how many breaks they are allowed while earning their crust. You are dreading the fact that somebody might move the minimum wage to the actual minimal living wage because you cannot comprehend how people cannot have a really great life on what you pay them and treat you like a demi god for providing them with there existence. Your own judgement is probably very good and never far from what perceive as reality (especially if it is based on what you read in the Mail and see on high class informative tv like benefits street).
I hope my generalisation about you is incorrect because I know a lot of your generalisations are both incorrect and offensive to many.

[sean5302]

Re: Election 2015: Conservative benefit cut options leaked

I have never read something like this where every single part is completely wrong.
1.No matter what size community there is, if you do the best job, people will always beat a path to your door, seeking your skills. That might be studying at school, working in life to support yourself and family, or playing your part in your local village, town or city. I despise those who, being unable to buy their own house, expect the state to provide one.
Can't feed, don't breed.
2.People died to support freedom of speech. You advocate not voting. Incredible.
3. Benefits Street exists, it's really James Turner Street, Winson Green, Birmingham. The residents there are real, live people and their lifestyle is exactly that shown on the programme.
4. None of my people earns the minimum wage. All are qualified. Most are chartered, like myself. By definition, the "minimum wage" is overpaying the recipients. If they earned their true worth, there would be no need for a minimum wage. The problem, as I've told you already, is that UK students are uneducated, uncompetitive and have an "entitlement culture". It's simple for East Europeans and others to nip over here and do low-paid jobs that our own kids won't.
My daughter is a senior manager in a multi-national corporation. She works in Belgium.
She tells me that the average hourly-paid worker in her UK plants earns £567 per week. The same job pays £112 per week in the Czech Republic, £33 per week in China and £11 per week in India. Is she going to invest in the UK? Not likely, yet you're suggesting that the "minimum wage" isn't enough, and she should be obliged to pay more, in the form of a "living wage". Where do you think the current UK jobs will go?

[Kati]

Re: Election 2015: Conservative benefit cut options leaked

When I worked at my local pub I was earning minimum wage ... and claimed Tax Credits too. I was what is commonly called a 'scrounger' by the people who believe in the hyped-up rubbish that is called 'benefits street'. I wasn't proud to be claiming benefits, but my hours (and therefore my wages) weren't enough to keep my head above water. I needed the extra money I received to put coal on the fire and food on the table! My partner at the time worked 60+ hrs a week as a dry stone waller, bringing home less than the minimum wage for the hours he put in ... and guess what? He claimed Tax Credits too. He got a whole £17.38 a week in working tax credits.

School dinners for my two children at the time cost about £12 each ... we couldn't get free school meals because he was getting WTC, but we couldn't stop claiming the WTC because it was part of a joint claim (and I would have lost the CTC element of it too). We were stuck in a rut. Without those benefits we would have been eligible for much more 'help' from the government but at the same time we wouldn't have survived at all if we hadn't been claiming them :tinysmile_hmm_t2:


This government (and previous ones too) have stigmatised the people who claim benefits ... newspapers report the bad side of a life on the dole, the real scroungers, but hardly ever talk about those of us who work hard for what we receive. That single mum with 6 kids by 5 different men who lives in a council house? Maybe she didn't want to be a single mum. Maybe she left a violent relationship, or her partner died. Maybe, just maybe, she even goes to work while her kids are at school and only claims the bare minimum in benefits as a way to survive.

I'm not trying to find excuses here ... there are people who don't see a need to work. Who get pregnant in order to claim extra benefits and a house. There are also those who work the system and earn money by doing 'cash in hand' jobs on the sly. But they're few and far between (IMO).

[des8]

Re: Election 2015: Conservative benefit cut options leaked

......... and there are those businesses (individuals & companies) who aggressively avoid tax. They are even worse than benefit "cheats" IMO.

[Amethyst]

Re: Election 2015: Conservative benefit cut options leaked

Well cheerfully, I live in a council house and am currently claiming child tax credits and child benefit. I used to work and have my own house, now I don't. I have three children.

Perception.

[des8]

Re: Election 2015: Conservative benefit cut options leaked

....and that just gives the lie to many of the generalities being thrown about

[meellis]

Re: Election 2015: Conservative benefit cut options leaked

Last time to defend what I have posted because this needn't be a two way clash between me and Sean. Can't feed don't breed is a good catchphrase which is reasonable when making the choice to have a family in the first place but if you made that choice in good times and then fell on hard times it takes on a new meaning. Breading a family never the less has nothing to do with having a roof over your head, it isn't only parents who need to have somewhere to live. If you read my post again I never advocated not voting I said I wouldn't recommend who people should vote for I said that was their personal choice, you would make a great politician or solicitor with the way you interpret others words for your own needs. I know people have died for freedom of speech, some of my family members are amongst them. You have stated that you are not interested in what goes on in other countries yet you come back with how much the average wage is in these other countries, unbelievable. True worth or minimum wage sadly has nothing to do with the cost of living so maybe you should be asking why it is so expensive to live in this country which is why people need help to live, how can others come to this country live and still send back money to their respective countries to give them a great life when they return after 5 years. You can question that but I have seen it happen with a certain bus company local to me. I am expecting the usual answer of "if you think this country is expensive then you can choose to leave" but I am English through and through and as I have said family members have lost their lives in support of this country. Generalisations are very dangerous it is like saying that everybody claiming benefits chose to, saying that everybody doesn't want to take low paid jobs, every immigrant is here to rip off our social system and when you are telling me my generalisations about yourself are wrong you need to learn that yours maybe to. As for education I am truly struggling to understand who you are blaming for it all. One minute I read a post and you feel it is down to a political party the next it reads as though it is British people themselves. Even though I agree there is a lack of education around in soma areas there are also very intelligent people around and if I read your posts correctly it is a more general issue with the people then I am afraid to say that whatever party is in control and however much money you throw at education you cannot teach people who don't want to learn so maybe you should give answers to why people don't want to learn.
If you are reading this and believe I might be a typical English person who wants to keep Britain British then I have news for you on that. I would personally like to see an amnesty on immigrants in this country because 1. we cannot afford to send them all home and 2. if they were in the system and on a level playing field they would probably struggle to survive as well especially if they had to buy their own house before they could have a family like you seem to be suggesting. Freedom of speech means I can question the validity of your views as you can mine and forums like this give us the vehicle with which to do so. It doesn't mean that mine are less valid than yours or either are wrong or right, that is for others to read and then make their own judgements upon.

[MIKE770]

Re: Election 2015: Conservative benefit cut options leaked

& some of us have fought more the once for this country. also my O,H is from the Far East originally, so no immigrant comment to me! she was in the Middle East when I got to know her.

[MIKE770]

Re: Election 2015: Conservative benefit cut options leaked

I have never read something like this where every single part is completely wrong.
1.No matter what size community there is, if you do the best job, people will always beat a path to your door, seeking your skills. That might be studying at school, working in life to support yourself and family, or playing your part in your local village, town or city. I despise those who, being unable to buy their own house, expect the state to provide one.
Can't feed, don't breed.
2.People died to support freedom of speech. You advocate not voting. Incredible.
3. Benefits Street exists, it's really James Turner Street, Winson Green, Birmingham. The residents there are real, live people and their lifestyle is exactly that shown on the programme.
4. None of my people earns the minimum wage. All are qualified. Most are chartered, like myself. By definition, the "minimum wage" is overpaying the recipients. If they earned their true worth, there would be no need for a minimum wage. The problem, as I've told you already, is that UK students are uneducated, uncompetitive and have an "entitlement culture". It's simple for East Europeans and others to nip over here and do low-paid jobs that our own kids won't.
My daughter is a senior manager in a multi-national corporation. She works in Belgium.
She tells me that the average hourly-paid worker in her UK plants earns £567 per week. The same job pays £112 per week in the Czech Republic, £33 per week in China and £11 per week in India. Is she going to invest in the UK? Not likely, yet you're suggesting that the "minimum wage" isn't enough, and she should be obliged to pay more, in the form of a "living wage". Where do you think the current UK jobs will go?

Same as was in the early 50s when an Auntie use to take me to Birmingham Boardsley Green so as I could have a couple of weeks holiday, and I use to sweep the front of the house of rubbish every morning @ 7a.m. and by the looks not much changed there since those days!

[wales01man]

Re: Election 2015: Conservative benefit cut options leaked

I think someone on here is an out and out Snob I like others once had myown house 2 businesses and money when the recession hit I lost it all when sales went down as I was selling things that people stopped buying first.

Maybe Sean can tell us what his business is that employs 300 people most of whom are as he says chartered

We are all entitled to our opinions but constant slagging off of others is sign of someone seriously lacking in something our family have a saying for this but as I like being on LB I cannot wrote it down

[sean5302]

Re: Election 2015: Conservative benefit cut options leaked

More likely I resent paying for something taken by others.
Every single penny spent by the Government is taken as taxes applied onto the Private Sector.
There is no distinction between benefits, gold-plated public sector pensions, MP expenses or vanity projects.
The Public Sector contributes no financial benefit to UK Plc. If I give them £1 and take 25p back as tax, I've still given them every penny they received.
Even then, the Government has spent £90 Billion more than it has taken from people like me this year.
Nothing snobbish about that.