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Appeal Judgment - 26th February 2009 - OFT v Abbey National Plc & Otrs

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  • Re: Appeal Judgment - 26th February 2009 - OFT v Abbey National Plc & Otrs

    £500 of charges can only be indicative - it could happen under any number of circumstances. Yes if a consumer gets charges of more than £500 in a year then they should be looked at in terms of managing finances or whether there are other underlying problems, or hardship, but stand alone I do not believe solely £500 of charges can definatively say someone is in hardship.

    In the PCA report over 1.4 million consumers had had over £500 of charges in the preceeding year - all of these people are not in hardship.


    It can be a good INDICATOR yes I agree but standalone it is not and shouldnt be. So I think it is correct how the banks are looking at it (some banks that is as some are being complete ******s).

    If you got income/expenditure and asset sheets of everyone of those people complaining their bank has turned them down for hardship - then I would fully expect them to be above the CFS trigger figures.



    Oh and yes, banks did take the charges unfairly and they should be repaid, but while the case continues and the final legalities are sorted out and we are all subject to the waiver then I would stick up for people in genuine hardship to get claims through rather than everyone with over £500 charges, remember of everyone who obtained charges in 2006, the average amount was £205.

    The waiver is a pain in the bum I know, and the banks should be restricted much more than they are as its very one sided, but innocent till proven guilty and all that annoyingly counts in this area too. Stronger and tighter regulation of the waiver terms especially regarding enforcement of debt incurred solely due to unfair charges.
    Last edited by Amethyst; 3rd March 2009, 14:17:PM.
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    • Re: Appeal Judgment - 26th February 2009 - OFT v Abbey National Plc & Otrs

      I will let you know the FSA's view, just about to ring them. Not sure if they will be willing to answer or not yet but worth a try.

      Does anyone have the exact wording to hand for me to quote.
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      • Re: Appeal Judgment - 26th February 2009 - OFT v Abbey National Plc & Otrs

        Legal Beagles - View Single Post - Appeal Judgment - 26th February 2009 - OFT v Abbey National Plc Otrs
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        • Re: Appeal Judgment - 26th February 2009 - OFT v Abbey National Plc & Otrs

          Thanks :kiss: so in its FULL context it reads that these must only be "taken into account"

          vii.
          repeatedly exceeding a credit card or overdraft limit without agreement (and, in this regard, where a complainant has incurred over £500 in unauthorised overdraft charges in the previous 12 months, that is to be treated as indicative of financial difficulty).
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          • Re: Appeal Judgment - 26th February 2009 - OFT v Abbey National Plc & Otrs

            Anyone complaining hardship claims aren't getting through then have a read of MSE success thread Bank Charges Success Stories II - Page 101 - MoneySavingExpert.com Forums and our hardship successes forum here > Hardship Claim Successes - Legal Beagles
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            • Re: Appeal Judgment - 26th February 2009 - OFT v Abbey National Plc & Otrs

              The chap from Which? reckons the OFT didn't try an appeal and that it was a 'just in case' application.

              This would tie in to the concurrent reference theory.

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              • Re: Appeal Judgment - 26th February 2009 - OFT v Abbey National Plc & Otrs

                So just in case Abbeys application succeeded ? As was over the same 1396 - Odd way of doing things. Wish I understood how the system worked better,
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                • Re: Appeal Judgment - 26th February 2009 - OFT v Abbey National Plc & Otrs

                  So time is marching on for the Banks to make their collective request to HoL, they've just over a week left.

                  Any rumblings on whether they are going to approach the HoL ?

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                  • Re: Appeal Judgment - 26th February 2009 - OFT v Abbey National Plc & Otrs

                    This may just be the optimist in me but I noted Angela Knight's interesting choice of words on the BBC money Box program, not one to mince her worms as we know.

                    She said the banks are "considering an application to HOL" not intending to make or will make.

                    Was it 28 days to make the application or 21 days? I had 26 March circled on my calendar for some reason.


                    It's a big IFbut what if the banks decide to heed the Master of The Roll's advice and not waste time applying to the HOL will it be back to court with messrs. Fingleton & Co. (OFT) to establish what is a fair price for the "service charges" (aka default, penalty or rip off) when a DD gets refused etc.
                    The charges coming in to the banking industry every day will more than pay the banks total legal bill for the whole test case so why wouldn’t the Banks want to "ensure Justice at the highest level"

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                    • Re: Appeal Judgment - 26th February 2009 - OFT v Abbey National Plc & Otrs

                      Rob, it was 28 days from 26th Feb, so in my book that's 24th March

                      Now I wonder if this is a normal "Solicitor" deadline, or one carved in stone ?!

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                      • Re: Appeal Judgment - 26th February 2009 - OFT v Abbey National Plc & Otrs

                        Originally posted by Curlyben View Post
                        Rob, it was 28 days from 26th Feb, so in my book that's 24th March
                        Curly I think your calandar might be "slow" .

                        Thusday 26 feb- Thursday 26 march =28 days

                        Is this a "reasonable time" 28 days so if application goes in later it might still be considered or is it an "unless" order ie use it or lose it?
                        The charges coming in to the banking industry every day will more than pay the banks total legal bill for the whole test case so why wouldn’t the Banks want to "ensure Justice at the highest level"

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                        • Re: Appeal Judgment - 26th February 2009 - OFT v Abbey National Plc & Otrs

                          Oooops would help if I could count

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                          • Re: Appeal Judgment - 26th February 2009 - OFT v Abbey National Plc & Otrs

                            According to the House of Lords Judicial Office they have not received an appeal application from any bank but they have 2 more weeks.

                            In the event the banks (or the OFT for that matter) want to take the appeal to the ECJ the case would need to be referred by HoLs.. So it would be unlikely the HoLs would refer it if it turns the banks down.

                            By all accounts the ECJ is big on consumer issues and would be unlikely to interperate the UTCCR regulations in favour of the banks.

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                            • Re: Appeal Judgment - 26th February 2009 - OFT v Abbey National Plc & Otrs

                              Originally posted by EXC View Post
                              According to the House of Lords Judicial Office they have not received an appeal application from any bank but they have 2 more weeks.
                              Assuming that the judge doesnt give them a few mor days when they submit late!!! :tung:

                              Anyway if they submit, chances are they will submit at the last moment, anything they can do to delay the assesment of their charges is worth doing.

                              JMHO

                              Glenn

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                              • Re: Appeal Judgment - 26th February 2009 - OFT v Abbey National Plc & Otrs

                                If they don't appeal, what happens next? What does that mean for claims that are stuck int he court system??

                                Comment

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