Received letter from DWF??

[des8]

Re: Received letter from DWF??

Hi Elizabeth, welcome to LB.

First the good news "banned for life"......find somewhere better to shop! but really how are they going to enforce that in every store in the uk. True they can ban you, but it is almost unenforceable in practice.

What "fine"? In the uk only courts can issue fines ,Police and councils can issue penalties. Anything else is a speculative invoice which can be ignored.

And that last piece of arrant nonsense about issuing warrants and involving police is just stupid scaremongering (by an illiterate untrained gorilla of a security guard??)

Stop worrying about this... nothing will happen now except a series of threatening, begging letters from people who pretend to be upholding the law, but in reality are self appointed vigilantes.

I'm asking@Kati; to start a new thread for you, as too many on one thread becomes confusing.
It might help if you could give us more details of the circumstances, and post up any letters (suitably redacted) received

[Elizabeth 777]

Re: Received letter from DWF??

Thank you
Just did a thread myself. Now kids are in bed had a moment to think and write it down

[woman]

Re: Received letter from DWF??

Hi i recieved a letter from DWF on behalf of Tesco saying i owe them £125 security cost's and £4 for an item i forgot to pay for. I made a mistake of forgetting to pay for one item when i done my shopping and i am being treated as a thief. I have seen on a few forum's people have recieved simular letter's with the same problem except they only have £125 for security cost's and £0.00 for the item they forgot to pay for. Why have i been asked to pay a fine and the cost of the item when they took the item of me. I even offered to pay for the item as i made a genuine mistake but the security did not want to listen to anything i had to say. I have been shopping at Tesco 11 years and this is how they treat me oh and they also gave me a 6 month ban from all stores. This is a utter joke and it has left me depressed and worried. Anyone know what i should do ?

[warinig]

Re: Civil Notice from Tesco - Please Help

Hello, with regards to your excellent advice. I also received a letter from DWF threatening all sorts. Cut a long story short, I bought 5 toy trains from a Tesco Extra store, as I was happily chatting to the checkout lady, I did not notice that 1 was not scanned. She made a mistake. Buzzer goes off and security man comes over and asks for the receipt and the bag. He says that 4 were paid for, 1 was not, I explained what had happened and I was expecting a request to go back and pay for the item. He had other ideas and off I went to the back room, I was told of the pending letter and it arrived today, I have quoted the Retailer A vs Ms A and Ms K and also that they have no right to claim for losses that were not incurred etc etc and that I thought the guard had not accepted that the checkout girl had made a mistake.

My concern is when DWF inevitably pass the thing to debt collectors? I have told them that I intend to go to court, which I doubt they will, but what happens when this is passed to debt recovery people?

I hope you can help! Thanks again for your help!

- - - Updated - - -

Hello, with regards to your excellent advice. I also received a letter from DWF threatening all sorts. Cut a long story short, I bought 5 toy trains from a Tesco Extra store, as I was happily chatting to the checkout lady, I did not notice that 1 was not scanned. She made a mistake. Buzzer goes off and security man comes over and asks for the receipt and the bag. He says that 4 were paid for, 1 was not, I explained what had happened and I was expecting a request to go back and pay for the item. He had other ideas and off I went to the back room, I was told of the pending letter and it arrived today, I have quoted the Retailer A vs Ms A and Ms K and also that they have no right to claim for losses that were not incurred etc etc and that I thought the guard had not accepted that the checkout girl had made a mistake.

My concern is when DWF inevitably pass the thing to debt collectors? I have told them that I intend to go to court, which I doubt they will, but what happens when this is passed to debt recovery people?

I hope you can help! Thanks again for your help!

[des8]

Re: Received letter from DWF??

Hi and Welcome

Pity you even bothered to reply as it only seems to encourage them.
They think they've caught a fish.

Debt collectors have no authority at all, so if you should ever hear from them, just ignore them, and don't enter a dialogue with DWF.
Letter tennis only costs time and postage, but it is not worthwhile.

[warinig]

Re: Received letter from DWF??

Hi and Welcome

Pity you even bothered to reply as it only seems to encourage them.
They think they've caught a fish.

Debt collectors have no authority at all, so if you should ever hear from them, just ignore them, and don't enter a dialogue with DWF.
Letter tennis only costs time and postage, but it is not worthwhile.

I emailed them, that way I'd always have a record of it. If they do pass to a Debt company what do you suggest?


thanks for he advice, this is a most excellent site!

[des8]

Re: Received letter from DWF??

IGNORE IGNORE and IGNORE AGAIN

[jaguarsuk]

Re: Civil Notice from Tesco - Please Help

Shop at Aldi, you get a much better quality of product at a better price and their staff are happy there, because they pay the Living Wage and not minimum; you'll be doing something socially good by supporting a good employer too.

[warwick65]

Re: Civil Notice from Tesco - Please Help

Shop at Aldi, you get a much better quality of product at a better price and their staff are happy there, because they pay the Living Wage and not minimum; you'll be doing something socially good by supporting a good employer too.

They may say they pay the living wage but they also have 'apprenticeships' which pay much lower.
I am not sure they can be defined as a good employer though, many of the contracts are lowish hours so while paying 'the living wage' they are not actually paying a living wage

[warinig]

Re: Received letter from DWF??

IGNORE IGNORE and IGNORE AGAIN

So today I received the following from our friends at DWF. I had queried the fact that the items were placed on the conveyor belt and one had not been scanned, by the cashier. The guard did not accept this and off to the back room I went. They use the word "criminal", yet they never called the Police, I dare say that the Police would have viewed the CCTV and concluded that I had presented the items for payment. Surely I cannot be held responsible for Tesco cashiers inability to scan an item? Can you offer some help here?

They have reviewed the report, CCTV and spoken with the Guards in question to gather a better understanding of what happened. Our client has concluded their enquiries and they have reported they are satisfied that everything was dealt with appropriately and the staff conducted themselves in a professional manor throughout. This is confirmed via CCTV footage and we understand the guards are also willing to give their statements in court, should the need arise. (They wouldn't say otherwise would they! and Why would the guards go to court anyway for what DWF claim to be damages, yet no loss was incurred)

Please take note that the criminal act of theft is also a civil wrong or "tort". Our Client instructs us that your commission of this tort has caused them loss in the form of staff, management time and administrative costs investigating and/or dealing with the incident, diverting resources from the ordinary course of its business. Our client is now seeking "damages" from you.

Is this more jargon designed to get people to pay? The crazy thing is that these items were paid for with a company credit card as they were for work purposes, there was no reason to "steal" the item and the 5 items had been placed on the belt, therefore well out of my control of what was scanned and what wasnt.

[des8]

Re: Received letter from DWF??

Yep, more legalese used by these alternative "justice" scammers.
They will say anything to pressurise victims and scare them into paying their claim for trumped up damages.

Unless you like playing letter tennis, just ignore them.
The more you dispute with them, the more they will repeat their absurd assertions.
They will carefully throw about insinuations about "criminal acts", "civil recovery," "clients loss and expenses caused", "need to consider recommending their client think about seeking recovery through county court"

There is no reason to argue with and attempt to explain the situation as they will not listen.
They are intent on relieving you of your money, not in justice.
Just ignore them.

[Amethyst]

Re: Civil Notice from Tesco - Please Help

I bought 5 toy trains from a Tesco Extra store, as I was happily chatting to the checkout lady, I did not notice that 1 was not scanned. She made a mistake. Buzzer goes off and security man comes over and asks for the receipt and the bag. He says that 4 were paid for, 1 was not, I explained what had happened and I was expecting a request to go back and pay for the item.

Oh that is utterly ridiculous. I would make a complaint to Tesco directors office. As you have already responded to DWF it's not going to hurt (but don't bother replying to DWF again).

This is confirmed via CCTV footage and we understand the guards are also willing to give their statements in court, should the need arise.

The checkout person missing scanning one of the items would also be on CCTV.

So that falls down to whose reponsiblility is it doesn't it - customer or shop ? must be some case law on that somewhere .... invitation / offer / acceptance etc . Presumably you didn't realise she'd undercharged until the buzzer went off so as far as you were concerned you'd paid the price requested for the items you'd given the checkout person. So could it actually be classed as theft ?

( sorry just having a rambley overthink )

[warinig]

Re: Received letter from DWF??

Okay thank you.

[warinig]

Re: Received letter from DWF??

Just got a reply to my letter to DWF. This was my email, apologies for the length, but based on your excellent guidance "Thank you for the email and apologies for the delay in replying, I have been away with work.

I note the comments below and this does not surprise me. Never in the history of such events, I am guessing, has your client ever replied with “yes, he did make an attempt to pay for the item and this was clearly an error”.



I also note the guards willingness to appear in court. This would not be a criminal court, as no crime has been committed, if it had, I am sure they would have called the Police, which they did not. The requirement on your part is to claim for “damages that your client has suffered”. The recent court case quoted in a previous email concluded that such a client could not claim for these damages, since no loss was incurred, unless you plan to inform me that the security presence was as a result of my visit that afternoon.



I also note the use of the word “criminal” this is not an appropriate word since according to the law, no criminal act has been committed, no police called and no chance for me to explain to a criminal court the events of that afternoon. Your case is a civil one, which is not enforceable without the input of the civil court.



Also, the statement "management time and administrative costs investigating and/or dealing with the incident, diverting resources from the ordinary course of its business" would not, in the view of people that have advised me, would not be justifiable in a civil court, since it would be fair and reasonable to suggest that the purpose of a security guard would be, to be a security guard and therefore is their normal business.



Given the attitude of this guard, I doubt that he was a checkout operator diverted to an incident of an item which was failed to be scanned and thus alerted the alarm. If the case with your client was proven "beyond reasonable doubt", then why were the police not called? I also note that the store claims to "always prosecute shoplifters".



It is my conclusion that this incident was motivated by other factors. Being employed in a professional capacity, I visited the store, in my work attire and the attitude of the guard was endemic of someone with a point to prove. Any normal individual, certainly a police officer, would have asserted that a mistake had been made.



Should this case proceed to court, this court would look unfavourably on the fact that once a mistake had been realised, an attempt to pay for the item was obstructed by the guard. In doing this, he set about this process in motion. Should he wished to avoid "a loss in the form of staff, management time and administrative costs investigating and/or dealing with the incident, diverting resources from the ordinary course of its business", he could have allowed me to purchase the item and this would have been avoided.



Whilst on the subject of work, I am fortunate enough to have a company credit card to which the lunch items were purchased with, as was the two items, one of which was not scanned. This was for a colleague who had recently given birth and were totally expensed. The only requirement for me is to provide receipts. I might also add that the receipt for the purchased item was not given back to me and thus has affected my statutory rights, should this item given to a colleague not work, since I now have no proof of purchase.



My provision to provide receipts is so that proof can given for the card to be paid. The alleged theft of that item would serve no purpose, other than that my employer would be better off by £7 in a gift given to a colleague on behalf of a multi national organisation.



I am therefore not willing to pay the charge levied by you and I am also aware of the process that you may wish to follow and I also understand that debt recovery would only be enforceable by a civil court for losses of something that has been proven to have been forgone. Lack of payments for a car or hire purchase for example.



You cannot prove any loss has been incurred in the same way that I cannot claim for time spent on customers who choose to change their supplier after having had extensive consultation work done on their behalf, that would also be argued that this is my job.



It has been interesting in looking these facts up as I reply to your emails and familiarising myself with these complex issues, but i will not be paying this fee as I do not feel it justifiable. If I was a multiple offender, then I would accept this £125 as "one of those things", but the fact is, that I am not and therefore will not pay £125 for the simple process of a checkout operator failing to scan an item.



In the meantime, I hope that you have a pleasant weekend"

They replied today with "I have noted all of your comments and passed them on to my Client to review. After looking into this they have advised as a gesture of Goodwill that, on this occasion, we will close our file, ceasing our civil recovery action and bringing an end to this matter. Please note, should your details be passed to us again for any similar incidents this matter will be reopened.

Additionally, any banning order that may have been issued on the day would still be in place, we do not deal with this aspect of things, this is dealt with in-house. If you wish to dispute any ban given, I would advise you put your request in writing to their Head Office".

My question is, I am not a shoplifter and have repeatedly claimed that the checkout lady failed to scan the item and in the eyes of the legal definition of shoplifting " is the act of knowingly taking goods from an establishment in which they are displayed for sale, without paying for them". My constant point was that the items were presented for payment and unknowingly were they not scanned.

I am not a shoplifter, but are they able to hold my details on file? As someone who is ex-directory and takes online security seriously, I am not comfortable with these people having my details? I know they have dropped the case against me, clearly they have seen logic (or the CCTV!) but I am not happy with them holding my details.

[9960129]

Hello,

I have received a Letter from DWF for a shoplifting at M&S

its says

Amount of Good stolen - 233

security cost - 150

what do you think i should do?

also the incident happened in December and i received the letter in March.

Thanks.