Advice - Legal or Realistic?

[Guest]

Re: Advice - Legal or Realistic?

With respect I disagree. As said before, in criminal cases the proof is " beyond reasonable doubt", where in civil cases" on the balance of probabilities". Taking on board everything said (negotiations, police involvement, etc...) if necessary one can take a criminal case through the civil procedures if police refuses to prosecute (or CPS more likely). Again, as someone who's been (and currently still in the process) of civil litigation I am the last person to recommend legal route BUT sometime one needs to kick back at persevered injustice when authorities say "nothing we can do".

This is getting a little off topic i think, but.
You cannot take criminal cases through civil courts. It is possible to sue for damages using a "criminal " tort as cause for action but the process is completely different.

The point which is being sidestepped repeatedly IMO, is that it is not a good idea to advise people to threaten creditors with criminal action when the issue is a civil one, if they have done something which is criminal the advice should just be, go to the police.

D

[bluebottle]

Re: Advice - Legal or Realistic?

This is getting a little off topic i think, but.
You cannot take criminal cases through civil courts. It is possible to sue for damages using a "criminal " tort as cause for action but the process is completely different.

The point which is being sidestepped repeatedly IMO, is that it is not a good idea to advise people to threaten creditors with criminal action when the issue is a civil one, if they have done something which is criminal the advice should just be, go to the police.

D

Some years ago, a rape case the CPS declined to pursue on the grounds of "insufficient evidence", their stock excuse, was pursued through a civil court, with the consent of the DPP. Judgement was found for the victim of the rape and she was awarded £750,000 damages. However, whilst such cases are rare, they have, normally, been investigated by the police and referred to the CPS before consent is given to pursue the matter through the civil process.

In the case of some creditors whose behaviour has been highlighted on the LB forums, it is pretty clear they have crossed the line. However, there are also cases where it is difficult to tell which side of the line the creditor is treading.

[labman]

Re: Advice - Legal or Realistic?

With respect I disagree. As said before, in criminal cases the proof is " beyond reasonable doubt", where in civil cases" on the balance of probabilities". Taking on board everything said (negotiations, police involvement, etc...) if necessary one can take a criminal case through the civil procedures if police refuses to prosecute (or CPS more likely). Again, as someone who's been (and currently still in the process) of civil litigation I am the last person to recommend legal route BUT sometime one needs to kick back at persevered injustice when authorities say "nothing we can do".

Taking on board what DavyB said in the subsequent post as well, and pulling this back on topic, this only goes to confirm my belief that starting this thread was absolutely right.

I don't think anyone disagrees that pursuing a civil prosecution for offences the police refuse to do anything about is sometimes, possibly often, possible.

However, when responding to initial posts, mentioning this sort of thing to a new poster is likely, IMO, to scare them more than help them. As the post develops and the poster begins to feel at home here with advice, and hits obstacles, THEN is the time to feed in the option of taking recourse through a civil action.

What I'm trying to say is that in my opinion, the help should start as minor as possible to help the OP, and get progressively more involved only if the need is there. The vast majority of posters come here only when they are in trouble, to get their problem solved. They don't come here to learn about law. We have what, 16000 members? How many of those do you see here?

Those who want to know more about law are the likes of us who are here day in, day out. Usually we don't actually have problems we need to post up about, we are here purely to try and give a helping hand to others. The vast majority of those 'others' are people who just want to be told to send this letter, then this one and things will be sorted. There's simply no need to mention the more advanced stuff.

[Guest]

Re: Advice - Legal or Realistic?

Hi
The thing is that most of us that give advice on these forums have our own area of interest, on scanning the forum posts we tend to look for people with problems that fall within that area.
Sometimes it is easy to want to show off you knowledge in a particular area, and i include myself in this, and sometimes it is not in the best interests of the OP.

Sometimes the best advice is just contact the other side and make a deal.

D

[Magrew]

Re: Advice - Legal or Realistic?

Hi
The thing is that most of us that give advice on these forums have our own area of interest, on scanning the forum posts we tend to look for people with problems that fall within that area.
Sometimes it is easy to want to show off you knowledge in a particular area, and i include myself in this, and sometimes it is not in the best interests of the OP.

Sometimes the best advice is just contact the other side and make a deal.

D

That is and always has been my starting point. It will also be the best initial advice. Reason before muscle, Solomon knew it and what better role model could you have.

So how come do I end up in so many entrenched arguments. Am I unreasonable or do I just deal with unreasonable people?

[labman]

Re: Advice - Legal or Realistic?

Am I unreasonable or do I just deal with unreasonable people?

You're unreasonable! :tung:

Only joking! :tinysmile_kiss_t4:

[Magrew]

Re: Advice - Legal or Realistic?

You're unreasonable!

And you are ugly, at least I will be reasonable in the morning

[labman]

Re: Advice - Legal or Realistic?

That is and always has been my starting point. It will also be the best initial advice. Reason before muscle, Solomon knew it and what better role model could you have.

An excellent post, and one which reinforces what I and others are trying to say here. Solomon is mostly associated with wisdom. I looked up 'Wisdom' and found this:

Wisdom is a deep understanding and realisation of people, things, events or situations, resulting in the ability to apply perceptions, judgements and actions in keeping with this understanding. Wisdom is also the comprehension of what is true coupled with optimum judgement as to action.

I think that sums it up rather well.

[Guest]

Re: Advice - Legal or Realistic?

Cut it out you two, some people are trying to sleep.
Can't stand argumentative people

D

[Magrew]

Re: Advice - Legal or Realistic?

We're just off to advise a newbie to cut their baby in half:beagle:

[labman]

Re: Advice - Legal or Realistic?

We're just off to advise a newbie to cut their baby in half:beagle:

Why thank you Sir Solomon! lol