Refund for faulty Van

[Pezza54]

Under CRA the dealer has to prove the buyer uses the vehicle for business purposes.

There is a "Donate" button top right on the consumer forums page

[echat11]

echat11 have you posted under the right thread?

Yes, Dealers have all sorts of social media, you can get a good idea of what you are dealing with from that.

[atticus]

Might the OP have signed anything when purchasing this vehicle stating that he was buying for business purposes?

[echat11]

Might the OP have signed anything when purchasing this vehicle stating that he was buying for business purposes?

That's the thing, dealer isn't part of any trade bodies, so thinks they can do what they want.

[DaveSpeedy]

Update

Reply from dealership re the CRA was quoted

Thank you for your email. The Consumer Rights Act 2015 is only applicable when you have a business to consumer transaction as per s2 and s3 CRA 2015. In this instance you purchased a commercial vehicle and the relevant legislation is the Sale of Goods Act 1979 given this is a business to business transaction. A consumer under the CRA 2015 is defined as

“Consumer” means an individual acting for purposes that are wholly or mainly outside that individual's trade, business, craft or profession.

You purchased a commercial vehicle for the purpose of your trade, business or profession and as such cannot now seek to retrospectively class yourself as a consumer.

Under the Sale of Goods Act 1979 you do not have the right to refund. We remain committed to reaching a resolution with you and will repeat the offer that the vehicle can be taken to Station Garage in Cleadon for inspection with a view to a repair.

Please let us know if you would like to accept our proposal for a repair.

My reply to the dealership

Thank you for your email reply.

Respectfully I have the Consumer Rights Act 2015 on my side, as I am not a trader and this was discussed with Kirsty Heath (Director) that the purchase was for private use on previous visits to the dealership.

I am a consumer and this vehicle was purchased for my private use and I do have proof of this as well.

I disagree with your latest email and as you have pointed out the below statement actually does apply.
A consumer under the CRA 2015 is defined as
“Consumer” means an individual acting for purposes that are wholly or mainly outside that individual's trade, business, craft or profession.

As stated in my previous email and letter you have 14 days to supply my full refund.

I now hope this situation is resolved


Dealership replies

We are not suggesting you are a trader we are suggesting that as you have bought a commercial vehicle the sale is governed by the Sale of Goods Act.
You state you have evidence that you should be regarded as a consumer. Please provide your evidence and we will respond accordingly

( my evidence is my insurance policy states use for SDP only)

What shall I respond with now

[echat11]

Update

Reply from dealership re the CRA was quoted

Thank you for your email. The Consumer Rights Act 2015 is only applicable when you have a business to consumer transaction as per s2 and s3 CRA 2015. In this instance you purchased a commercial vehicle and the relevant legislation is the Sale of Goods Act 1979 given this is a business to business transaction. A consumer under the CRA 2015 is defined as

“Consumer” means an individual acting for purposes that are wholly or mainly outside that individual's trade, business, craft or profession.

You purchased a commercial vehicle for the purpose of your trade, business or profession and as such cannot now seek to retrospectively class yourself as a consumer.

Under the Sale of Goods Act 1979 you do not have the right to refund. We remain committed to reaching a resolution with you and will repeat the offer that the vehicle can be taken to Station Garage in Cleadon for inspection with a view to a repair.

Please let us know if you would like to accept our proposal for a repair.

My reply to the dealership

Thank you for your email reply.

Respectfully I have the Consumer Rights Act 2015 on my side, as I am not a trader and this was discussed with Kirsty Heath (Director) that the purchase was for private use on previous visits to the dealership.

I am a consumer and this vehicle was purchased for my private use and I do have proof of this as well.

I disagree with your latest email and as you have pointed out the below statement actually does apply.
A consumer under the CRA 2015 is defined as
“Consumer” means an individual acting for purposes that are wholly or mainly outside that individual's trade, business, craft or profession.

As stated in my previous email and letter you have 14 days to supply my full refund.

I now hope this situation is resolved


Dealership replies

We are not suggesting you are a trader we are suggesting that as you have bought a commercial vehicle the sale is governed by the Sale of Goods Act.
You state you have evidence that you should be regarded as a consumer. Please provide your evidence and we will respond accordingly

( my evidence is my insurance policy states use for SDP only)

What shall I respond with now

Contact CAB / Trading Standards on Monday, get the reference number add to email, as follows:

CAB / Trading Standards Ref: XXXXXXXXX

The Sale of Goods Act 1979 has been replaced by the Consumer Rights Act 2015, the Consumer Rights Act 2015 applies to your purchase, they may need Trading Standards to tell them that.

[Pezza54]

Reaffirm you are a consumer as defined under CRA and it is not relevant that you purchased a van which may be considered a commercial vehicle.
State you are attaching a copy of your insurance certificate which states the vehicle is insured for social, domestic and pleasure only. State also you would not have risked invalidating the insurance by not insuring the van for business use had you intended to drive it during the course of carrying out a business.

[Pezza54]

Contracts for the sale of goods and services between businesses are still governed by the Sale of Goods Act 1979 and the Sale of Goods and Services Act

[echat11]

Contracts for the sale of goods and services between businesses are still governed by the Sale of Goods Act 1979 and the Sale of Goods and Services Act

'Dealership replies

We are not suggesting you are a traderwe are suggesting that as you have bought a commercial vehicle the sale is governed by the Sale of Goods Act.'

[atticus]

Dealership replies

We are not suggesting you are a trader we are suggesting that as you have bought a commercial vehicle the sale is governed by the Sale of Goods Act.

That cannot be right. If they accept that the OP comes within s2(3) CRA 2015:

"Consumer" means an individual acting for purposes that are wholly or mainly outside that individual's trade, business, craft or profession.

Then s1(1) applies:

This Part applies where there is an agreement between a trader and a consumer for the trader to supply goods, digital content or services, if the agreement is a contract.

[Pezza54]

The dealer is confused.
One moment he writes it was business to business contract and later he states he is not suggesting OP is a trader.
Is there a difference between a trader and a person running a business?

[Pezza54]

Originally the dealer argued that OP had lost the short term right of rejection as 30 days had passed. He appears to now have accepted OP rejected the van on time and changed his argument claiming it was a B2B transaction. What is he going to argue next?

[echat11]

The dealer seems to be applying the SoGA to the vehicle because it's a 'commercial vehicle' that's been bought.

[Pezza54]

That has to be wrong.
OP, as a consumer, may have bought the van to regularly carry bulky equipment such as diving equipment for OP's own use.

[DaveSpeedy]

I'm confused now