Previous Owner Tickets

[ainaedil]

I bought car Yesterday, literately! with no V5 as previous Owner. Today got it insured and sent off the form to DVLA to get V5

Today in the morning we had newlyn PLC guy clamped the car for unpaid tickets in 2012, Southwark Council was involved.

The guy had warrants against someone who owned the car that time. He was taking the car with him. I had no choice but to pay £1270! in order to avoid this, he was rude, I showed him Insurance certificate, receipt for the car and V5 request form that was sent to DVLA. He asked I had to pay this to avoid car being taken away but I can refund refund if am the new owner. I tried all means to convince him but in vain

My question is how I am going to proceed. Please be gentle I am not very good with legal stuff.

Regards

[bluebottle]

Re: Previous Owner Tickets

Hi and welcome to Legal Beagles.

This bailiff is in serious trouble. If you showed him proof you had purchased the car, he should have removed the clamp and referred the matter back to Southwark Council, not do what he did. It is illegal to seize goods belonging to a third party and demand that a person who is not a debtor pays a debt. Notwithstanding, this bailiff may have also committed two very serious criminal offences as the result of his actions.

I would certainly contact London Borough of Southwark immediately and inform them of what their numbskull enforcement agents have done. I would also remind them they are 100% vicariously-liable for the actions of Newlyns and you will require immediate repayment of the money in cleared funds.

There is also the matter of Trespass Against Property, Unlawful Interference with Property and, if he encroached onto your driveway or hardstanding, Trespass on Land. These are all civil torts and would need to be pursued under Civil Law.

[bizzybob]

Re: Previous Owner Tickets

You are going to report Newlyn to police for theft motor vehicle, he has no right in law to take it as you have proof of ownership viz receipt and insurance.

You also contact Southwark council and inform them yourcar has been taken for someone elses tickets and if it is not returned you will be seeking legal advice with a view to suing the council for it's value and your consequential loss.

Other Beagles will know much more but I don't know whether Northampton TEC who issued the "mickey mouse" warrant will deal with you due to you not being the debtor.

[bizzybob]

Re: Previous Owner Tickets

You beat me to it BB, Time Screwup screwlyn were given a mild tolchock I feel, and this penypidyn bailiff a holiday in the "Scrubs"

[bluebottle]

Re: Previous Owner Tickets

You are going to report Newlyn to police for theft motor vehicle, he has no right in law to take it as you have proof of ownership viz receipt and insurance. The bailiff did not remove, BB. The scumbag extorted £1270 out of the OP instead.

You also contact Southwark council and inform them your car has been taken for someone elses tickets and if it is not returned you will be seeking legal advice with a view to suing the council for it's value and your consequential loss. LB of Southwark owes the OP £1270 immediately in cleared funds.

Other Beagles will know much more but I don't know whether Northampton TEC who issued the "mickey mouse" warrant will deal with you due to you not being the debtor. As soon as the bailiff became aware the OP was the new owner, he should have removed the clamp and referred the matter to LB of Southwark. He didn't. He decided to do something he knows or ought to know he had no right in law to do and, in so doing, committed two serious criminal offences, one of them very serious. This bailiff is in seriously deep doo-doo. Whether he would lose his certificate is another matter. Personally, any bailiff who does something like this should suffer automatic revocation of their certificate, no arguments. By doing something like this, they have proven they are not fit to act as a bailiff.

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[bizzybob]

Re: Previous Owner Tickets

He has stolen the money plain and simple imho, or rather gained a pecuniary advantage by deception. I feel if LB Southwark act stupid the matter should be reported to the police for a crime number if OP has to sue the cretinous council.

[bluebottle]

Re: Previous Owner Tickets

He has stolen the money plain and simple imho, or rather gained a pecuniary advantage by deception. I feel if LB Southwark act stupid the matter should be reported to the police for a crime number if OP has to sue the cretinous council.

It's a lot more serious than what you are saying, BB. Let's have a look at the evidence -

1. OP shows evidence to the bailiff that he is the new owner/keeper of the vehicle in the form of a bill of sale, insurance and V5C.
2. Bailiff knows name on warrant is not that of the OP and knows or ought to know he has no right in law to levy on or seize vehicle or demand payment from the OP.
3. Bailiff then demands £1270 from OP or he will remove vehicle and claims he can do so, clearly in the knowledge he cannot.
4. OP hands over £1270 that he does not owe in order to stop bailiff removing his car.

The bailiff committed an offence the moment he became aware that ownership of the car had changed from the person whose name was on the warrant to that of the OP, that the OP was not the debtor and he told the OP had to pay £1270. That is being disingenuous at the very least. However, the bailiff then went the extra mile and proved what a complete and total idiot he was by then threatening to seize and remove the OP's car, knowing he had no right in law to make the demand or use the threat he used to enforce the demand. The use of the wheelclamp is a subsidiary matter, but may be related.

If LB of Southwark has even an ounce of commonsense, they will authorise an immediate credit transfer payment to the OP's bank account for the full £1270. Any civil torts are a separate matter and should be dealt with as such, albeit that they relate to offences at law.

[bizzybob]

Re: Previous Owner Tickets

What do you reckon the Op's chances are of getting this bailiff arrested BB? and LB Southwark will likely stonewall until court papers suing for the money are issued.

I feel they are that arrogant and stupid.

[bluebottle]

Re: Previous Owner Tickets

What do you reckon the Op's chances are of getting this bailiff arrested BB? and LB Southwark will likely stonewall until court papers suing for the money are issued.

I feel they are that arrogant and stupid.

LB of Southwark would be ill-advised to do that, BB. The moment they are told of the bailiff's actions, any right-minded person would repay the money immediately. Refusing to do so and demanding a CCJ would not only be disingenuous, but illegal also. Notwithstanding, this does not prevent LB of Southwark asking the OP to provide evidence of ownership. However, they should refund all monies promptly and in cleared funds.

[Fair-Parking]

Re: Previous Owner Tickets

This happens far too frequently and I have had three such cases in the last month - all Newlyn as usual. All the answers are quite correct, but regretfully neither Newlyn nor Southwark will give a damn. The situation gets worse before it gets better because what you would take to be your obvious defence (this isn't my ticket) actually works against you due to the perverse nature of the people involved.

First it is unlikely that either will deal with you because (get this) - the ticket isn't in your name and thus the Data Protection Act 1998 'prevents' them talking to you. The knock on effect is that you cannot then contact the Traffic Enforcement Centre because you need to know the ticket number and be the person to whom it was addressed.

Finally Newlyn won't take any payment because in usual Newlyn fashion - you are not the car owner in their 2 dimensional minds. Newlyn won't accept proof via insurance, V5 (not proof of ownership) etc, etc and usually raise the bar higher and higher until owners give up. It is normally their intention to sell (knock it out on ebay and keep all the proceeds). Southwark? 'Nuffink to do wiv us gov, you'll 'ave to talk to the bailiff'. I can see Bluebottle getting very hot under the collar about this for some might think that this is pure auto theft suported by council indifference - a council which is a beneficiary of all this unlawfulness.

There is a solution and I did get two vehicles back (the third gave up) and I am assisting the owners to recover their money for which clearly there is no defence. This is scam and whilst there is a solution, I'm afraid the OP will probably will have to be prepared to find the money Newlyn will state is outstanding. Far better to get the car back and then argue rather than be the subject of unreal and escalating demands

I can see that everybody will be up in arms about this and quite rightly so and if the OP does manage to retreive his car without any of the above I will be delighted. If not then he is invited to contact me.

Obviously nothing can be done overnight so everybody is invited to mull over what I have said and we'll see what this awful case looks like in the morning.

[ainaedil]

Re: Previous Owner Tickets

"First it is unlikely that either will deal with you because (get this) - the ticket isn't in your name and thus the Data Protection Act 1998 'prevents' them talking to you. The knock on effect is that you cannot then contact the Traffic Enforcement Centre because you need to know the ticket number and be the person to whom it was addressed". luckily I asked the so called clever Bailiff to email me the Warrant and he emailed me, it has all the details including name of the person penalty charge notices , it also have Newlyn's person name and email who was liaising with the bailiff."

Further, Receipt given was under another name? not under my name? but paid by my debit having my name on it!

On another point which is data protection, they sent me details of previous owners i-e name address, penalty details etc?

[TopBoy]

Re: Previous Owner Tickets

Where did the seizure/clamping take place? How did the bailiff locate the vehicle?

[ainaedil]

Re: Previous Owner Tickets

He had ANPR in his Van

[TopBoy]

Re: Previous Owner Tickets

He had ANPR in his Van

Ok, are there any circumstances that may lead the bailiff to attempt to justify his actions? Are you related to the previous owner, was the car at or near their property? How did you pay for the vehicle (can you show the movement if funds to collaberate the sale?).cold Dnt take thus the wrong way - just trying to pte-empt the bailiffs response to Amy complaint.

[ainaedil]

Re: Previous Owner Tickets

No, It was not closer to his house. The guy deals in cars he purchased two weeks ago for resale. I paid cash £3100. My two friends were with to review the car condition thats it. I usually have this cash at hand due to cash trade I am in.