Bailiffs chasing Business Rates arrears

[labman]

Re: Bailiffs chasing Business Rates arrears

They have a statutory duty to provide a breakdown of fees if you request it. You have requested it, so they must provide it, make sure you send it to the actual bailiffs (apologies if you did).:beagle:

[ThreeYearsAndCounting]

Re: Bailiffs chasing Business Rates arrears

They have a statutory duty to provide a breakdown of fees if you request it. You have requested it, so they must provide it, make sure you send it to the actual bailiffs (apologies if you did).:beagle:

Thanks. Yes, sent it to the Bailiffs.

[ThreeYearsAndCounting]

Re: Bailiffs chasing Business Rates arrears

Made first payment to Council online yesterday. Only £10.00 as that is all she can afford, she plans to pay this amount each Saturday. The total debt is around £4000.00.

Can someone please explain to me what will happen when the Council (inevitably?) decide that the payments are too small (ie it will take 8 years to repay the debt). Are Court proceedings the next step? I'm really unclear on what happens next, so if anyone can help...

[labman]

Re: Bailiffs chasing Business Rates arrears

It would be well worth you getting an Income and Expenditure form completed to send to the Head of Revenues so they can see your offer is genuinely all you can afford.

If they can see it in black and white it could well help. I'd need to read back through your whole thread to advise on the next step. I'm just about to hop into the shower, but once I'm up properly (lazy Sunday morning!!!!) I'll read back and try to helpp further.

[ploddertom]

Re: Bailiffs chasing Business Rates arrears

If the account is still in the hands of the Bailiff then nothing will happen until the account is then returned to the Council.

After this the Council still have other means of enforcement depending on the circumstances surrounding the debtor. In normal cases with those who work or are on some benefits then an Attachments to Earnings or Benefits is possible. For the self employed it is a little harder as the options are more limited.

There could be a risk of bankruptcy in which case she will be saddled with all the costs associated with this. The Council could also go back to Court for a Committal Hearing where she will be asked to explain why the debt has not been paid. If there is a history of payment no matter how small then the Council may have difficulty over this but you have to remember the ultimate sanction is imprisonment - not that I think this likely.

The Council are only interested in one thing and that is the money owing. They don't care they put someone out on the street or out of work. She needs to look at all other outgoings and reduce all non-priority debts to £1 per month.

[labman]

Re: Bailiffs chasing Business Rates arrears

That's one reason I felt completing a CFS with a qualified FREE person would be a good idea. :beagle:

[ThreeYearsAndCounting]

Re: Bailiffs chasing Business Rates arrears

They have a statutory duty to provide a breakdown of fees if you request it. You have requested it, so they must provide it, make sure you send it to the actual bailiffs (apologies if you did).:beagle:

Thanks for replying. Just got the statements from the Bailiff company. Three statements, each relating to a separate Liability Order, all relating to the same Business Rates debt. Each of the three statements shows a £24.50 charge for a first visit (the Bailiff himself had told me their fees were already £285 when I spoke to him on the 'phone, but I have no way to prove this). Covering letter states that she was charged a First Attendance Fee for the Bailiff attending to 'levy distress or collect full payment'. Also confirms details of the Bailiff's certificate. Then states that she must contact the Bailiff directly without delay to resolve this matter. Not sure why this debt has resulted in 3 Liability Orders (was expecting 2 as the period covers 2 financial years), but hardly seems important in the overall scheme of things.

Is there more I need to do with this? Should the first attendance fee have been charged in respect of each Liability Order?

[ploddertom]

Re: Bailiffs chasing Business Rates arrears

You need to speak to someone at the Council and ask the following questions:
1 - how many Liability Orders they have against you
2 - the dates they were obtained
3 - the addresses they were for
4 - the period of time each covers
5 - how much each one was for
6 - how much is still outstanding
7 - the dates they were passed on for enforcement

Apologies if this has already been asked but if there is a discrepancy between what the Council say and what the Bailiff says then this needs investigating. In particular you need to know if all the LO's were passed over for enforcement at the same time. In my view the Bailiff is overcharging as he should be treating all the LO's as a single one. It could be an "administrative error" of course.

[labman]

Re: Bailiffs chasing Business Rates arrears

Do we not also need to chase the bailiffs for the breakdown of fees?

I would have thought resending the letter may be a good idea for the sake of the cost of a stamp and proof of postage, or recorded delivery if the OP wants to confirm receipt (probably sensible).

I would think we need the info from the council and the bailiffs in order to get the debt back to the council - especially the bailiffs. :beagle:

[ThreeYearsAndCounting]

Re: Bailiffs chasing Business Rates arrears

You need to speak to someone at the Council and ask the following questions:
1 - how many Liability Orders they have against you
2 - the dates they were obtained
3 - the addresses they were for
4 - the period of time each covers
5 - how much each one was for
6 - how much is still outstanding
7 - the dates they were passed on for enforcement

Apologies if this has already been asked but if there is a discrepancy between what the Council say and what the Bailiff says then this needs investigating. In particular you need to know if all the LO's were passed over for enforcement at the same time. In my view the Bailiff is overcharging as he should be treating all the LO's as a single one. It could be an "administrative error" of course.

Council won't speak to us on the 'phone (they just say that the debt has been passed to their Bailiffs, so can't speak about it), but I will write a letter to the Council tomorrow. Thanks.
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Do we not also need to chase the bailiffs for the breakdown of fees?

I would have thought resending the letter may be a good idea for the sake of the cost of a stamp and proof of postage, or recorded delivery if the OP wants to confirm receipt (probably sensible).

I would think we need the info from the council and the bailiffs in order to get the debt back to the council - especially the bailiffs. :beagle:

Thanks for replying. Sorry if I'm being dense, but we have 3 statements from the Bailiffs each showing a £24.50 first visit fee (see my post 10:58 today). Should I be asking them for more in the way of a breakdown?

[ploddertom]

Re: Bailiffs chasing Business Rates arrears

Council won't speak to us on the 'phone (they just say that the debt has been passed to their Bailiffs, so can't speak about it), but I will write a letter to the Council tomorrow. Thanks.

That's a load of round spherical things. The debt belongs to the Council and they are 100% liable for the actions and charges of their contractors. Your friend has a right to know. If denied again ask politely for the name of the person and the position they hold as this will form the basis of a Formal Complaint and followed again by another Complaint to the LGO. This sounds of the typical stitch up between Capita & Equita or ross & Roberts.
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Thanks for replying. Sorry if I'm being dense, but we have 3 statements from the Bailiffs each showing a £24.50 first visit fee (see my post 10:58 today). Should I be asking them for more in the way of a breakdown?

The fee breakdown should give an account no, date and a fee ie
A/C ABC12345
5 March 2012 - £24-50 - 1st Visit Fee

Even better if you can scan & post them, remembering to take all personal details out.

[labman]

Re: Bailiffs chasing Business Rates arrears

Thanks for replying. Just got the statements from the Bailiff company. Three statements, each relating to a separate Liability Order, all relating to the same Business Rates debt. Each of the three statements shows a £24.50 charge for a first visit (the Bailiff himself had told me their fees were already £285 when I spoke to him on the 'phone, but I have no way to prove this). Covering letter states that she was charged a First Attendance Fee for the Bailiff attending to 'levy distress or collect full payment'. Also confirms details of the Bailiff's certificate. Then states that she must contact the Bailiff directly without delay to resolve this matter. Not sure why this debt has resulted in 3 Liability Orders (was expecting 2 as the period covers 2 financial years), but hardly seems important in the overall scheme of things.

Is there more I need to do with this? Should the first attendance fee have been charged in respect of each Liability Order?

The bit in red is the bit i'm interested in them breaking down. They can't just say the fee was already £285. How did they get to that amount?

[ThreeYearsAndCounting]

Re: Bailiffs chasing Business Rates arrears

The £285 was given to me verbally on the 'phone by the Bailiff on the day of his visit. I think it was just a made up number in the hope she would pay it. I asked him to confirm the total amount payable and that was made up of the original debt to the Council plus £285, the numbers tallied. I will carry on trying to sort out the correct figures for the Bailiff fees, but I am aware that the fees are small compared to the total debt.

I have today written to the Council requesting details of all Liability Orders.

[ThreeYearsAndCounting]

Re: Bailiffs chasing Business Rates arrears

The fee breakdown should give an account no, date and a fee ie
A/C ABC12345
5 March 2012 - £24-50 - 1st Visit Fee

Even better if you can scan & post them, remembering to take all personal details out.

Thanks again for your help with this.

There are three:

C024 / 500349 (her name) (Council) Reference 3222630
19/12/2011 Initial Debt £1757.44
01/02/2012 1st visit £24.50
Current balance £1781.94

C024 / 500350 (her name) (Council) Reference 3222630
19/12/2011 Initial Debt £1408.56
01/02/2012 1st visit £24.50
Current balance £1433.06

C024 / 500351 (her name) (Council) Reference 3222630
19/12/2011 Initial Debt £754.74
01/02/2012 1st visit £24.50
Current balance £779.24

The Bailiff's Notice of Attendance only mentioned the second and third references (500350 and 500351).

[labman]

Re: Bailiffs chasing Business Rates arrears

That is showing all three visits as being made on the same day - that means just one fee of £24.50, fair enough, but not the other two £24.50's.

The £285 is an enigma which needs sorting out.

Thanks for posting up this info - we're a little further along.