Damage to Car by a Minor

[Cobra23]

Hi,

I would like advice on an incident that happened recently.

We were on holiday on a caravan club site. We were driving round the one way system (the correct way) at 5mph when we came to a fork in the road. We spotted a couple of young boys riding their bikes towards us, going down the one way system in the wrong direction. All of the boys were not looking where they were going and did not see our car. As soon as we saw the boys coming towards us, we stopped and applied the electronic handbrake making the engine cut out. 3 of the boys narrowly avoided the car but the fourth boy was looking over his shoulder and turned at the very last minute and obviously did not see where he was going or what was in front of him. As a result he went into the side of my car. The handlebars scraped across the full length of the front driver's door and left a long scratch (about 45cm in length) the boy was not going at speed and his bike collapsed into the door at the end of the scrape. The boy was unhurt as he was travelling at approximately 2MPH and veered into our car almost to a standstill. The only part to touch the car was the handlebars. We were stationery the whole time. As soon as the boy had gone into the car, he jumped off his bike and proceeded to walk away with his bike in his hands. My husband got out of the car to check if the boy was ok and if he had marked the car. On seeing the scratch my husband asked the young boy to take him to his parents. The boy said yes and peddled off with my husband quickly walking behind him.

To cut a long story short, when my husband reached the parents at their caravan, explained what had happened and asked if the boy was ok.

I, in the meantime had gone to find the caravan site manager to report the incident and ask him to come to the boy's caravan to take down details of both parties. On our arrival with the car the father and my husband both came and looked at the damage to the car and said that his son was ok and agreed to pay for any damage that his son had caused and that we could find a way to work it out. (this was witnessed by the site manager) My husband discussed some of the options which included going through car or caravan insurance, getting quotes and them paying or trying to get a friend to look at the car and try to do it as cheaply as possible. The father then suggested we bring the car back down to them as his friend could do it for 'pennies'. We exchanged details and agreed to speak later.

Later that night the father said to my husband in the park that the incident had involved a minor on a private road and said he didn't fancy our chances of getting a result from them!

The next day we went to the police to get an incident number and reported it to the police on the advice of the site warden. We felt that we had done the responsible thing and reported the matter in case of any come back after the father's comment about a minor on a private road. The police were happy with our statement and said that they didn't know the ins and outs of minors and private roads and couldn't really advise us further.

Later in the week the father rang my husband and said that they wouldn't be paying for any damage as they'd spoken to their son and said that he hadn't been anywhere near our car and had not caused any damage.

This resulted us in seeking advice from citizens advice and was advised to send a letter stating the facts and the amount we were seeking in damages to rectify the damage caused by their son (£500). We gave them a month to respond otherwise we would be making a claim with the small claims court.

The parents responded at 23.58 on the day of the deadline day, stated in the original letter, 2 before minutes the cut off date! The email was sent to our junk box and we did not see it. A letter then came in the post a week later after the deadline date. By this time we had started the small claims court procedure.

The letter they responded with had 'without prejudice save for costs' at the top, stated they did not accept liability and denied that their son had caused any damage to our car. The closing paragraph to their letter said we had 2 options. option 1 to go through their caravan insurance and claim under accidental damage, should it be successful as they do not admit liability or option 2 upon receipt of an invoice they will pay half of the amount paid.

We are left very confused by this heavily 'jargon' worded letter and do not know how to best proceed with the matter. Any help would be greatly received.

(sorry for the very long post!)

[des8]

Re: Damage to Car by a Minor

How old was the child?
Basically parents are not responsible legally for damage caused by their child.

If you are bringing a claim against the parents it will have to be on the basis that the parents negligently failed to oversee the child at the time of the accident.

You can bring a claim against a child for compensation,, but normally not worthwhile as the child probably has no assets.(although you have 6 years in which to bring a claim or enforce a judgement so if he grows up and gets a job......)
However the parents have indicated they have insurance
They refer to accidental cover included in their caravan insurance, but in fact it would be the liability section of the policy that may cover them.
If they have a household policy I would expect that to have liability cover that may cover this sort of situation

I have said may deliberately as some insurers would exclude losses that should be covered under a seperate liability policy (in this case a cyclists policy)

Also, you cannot claim under that policy (if they have one). It is for the policy holder to make the claim

You say you have already initiated court action.
Who did you name as defendant?

[Cobra23]

Re: Damage to Car by a Minor

Hi, the child is 8 years old and was not supervised by his parents (he was cycling along the road with his friends-the parents were at their caravan about 5 minutes away)

We named the mother as the defendant for failure to provide suitable supervision for her child.

As she has stated they do not accept responsibility but have offered to meet half the costs.... does this not indicate their acceptance of damage caused by their child? In her letter she also claims that her child was riding on the grass verge and we hit him....... absolutely NOT the case!

We would just like to get this sorted, have the repairs done and move on. We would like to respond to the parents appropriately as to try and resolve this dispute as quickly and calmly as possible.

[des8]

Re: Damage to Car by a Minor

The easiest way to sort the matter would be to make a claim on your (comprehensve?) motor insurance.
That of course would depend on the excess you carry.
[and even if you don't make a claim you should report it your insurers just n case they lodge a counterclaim of some sort! and in any case mention the incident on renewal]

Does an 8 year old need superviion when riding a bicycle? lots of differing opinions https://www.theguardian.com/environm...5/kids-cycling
And would an adult's prescence been enough to prevent the incdent?

As you have now escalated the matter and actually initiated court proceedings I question if it will be possible to resolve the matter until it reaches mediation stage in the court process.

[R0b]

Re: Damage to Car by a Minor

If you continue to proceed on bringing a claim, there is likely to be a raft of problems you are going to come across, and I have listed some of these below.

Problem 1: You have only named the parent as the defendant and not in addition to the child.
As it stands your claim is against the mother for negligence in failing to oversee the child at the time the incident happened. Its a caravan park, presumably on private land as you indicated in your first post about the father saying the accident was on a private road, and therefore children are likely to roam about. If the parent was with the child at the time of the incident then in normal circumstances you could have a claim against the parents for failing to properly oversee them, but it can sometimes be difficult if the parent was not with the child at the time, though it still is possible to hold them responsible. To my mind, the fact that the parents were not accompanying the child and the incident happened on a caravan park where children do run about and ride bikes and play football etc. would make your claim even more difficult than it normally would be.

Problem 2: The child is 8 years old
Although the child is not named as a defendant, the court may also take into account the child's age. The child is younger than the minimum age in which someone could be prosecuted for a criminal offence and although this is a civil matter, there is the question of whether the child had the capacity to understand what he was doing wrong and as a result could not know the consequences i.e. riding up a one way road. It is entirely possible if raised by the mother, the court may take this into account.

There is no doubt that parents owe a duty of care and to assume responsibility for their children. The question here is taking all the circumstances into account, whether it be fair, just and reasonable to hold the parent responsible for their child's actions in this case. That I think, is not so clear and could be 50/50.

In relation to the mother saying that her child was on the grass verge, it sounds like she might be trying to wing it there especially if you have damage to your car based on the what you have explained to us. Though you may need to instruct an expert to confirm that which would cost more money but could be claimed back if successful in court. On that point you could simply respond by saying that you did not hit her child (I would expect her to counterclaim on that basis for personal injury as would most parents?) and if you have to you will instruct an expert to prove this, which you will also seek to recover if the court finds in your favour.

Apart from you and your husband was there anyone else in the car that witnessed the incident?

I think this may be a case of who has the will to resist. They have already offered to pay you half of the costs and as I understand that you shouldn't have to bear the rest, you should also consider how strong your claim is and not be clouded by anything else. I am not saying that your claim is not winnable, but I wouldn't particular say its a very strong case either. The onus is on you to show that the parent has failed to properly oversee their child and that is perhaps the most difficult argument especially when they are in a caravan park.

You have said that you have initiated proceedings, when did this happen and has the mother acknowledged the claim online yet?

Personally, I might take their offer to pay half costs and then either claim the rest or pay out yourself.


Some points to note

1. 'Without prejudice save as to costs' means that providing the contents is a genuine attempt to settle, the contents is confidential and cannot be disclosed to the court until after judgment. This is typically used where there has been a genuine offer to settle the case without incurring additional costs but the claimant/defendant refuses and if the defendant/claimant loses the case or doesn't get much more than what was offered then they can refer the judge to the correspondence and explain that they should have taken the offer. The court can in those instances deduct costs from the successful party if it is appropriate.

2. When sending a letter before claim, always put a specific deadline in your letter e.g. "If you do not respond by 4pm on 7 November 2016 ..." because if you don't then as you have found out, they have responded to you 2 minutes before your actual deadline. The courts have previously said that if a party must respond by X day, then the party in question has the whole of that day to respond unless a specific time has been stated. This can become an issue especially if offers to settle are involved.