Charging order and possession

[urgenthelp]

I desperately hope someone can help or advise us. We are being taken to court by a solicitors for their client, a multi-national nursing home business, for over £20,000 of nursing home fees accrued by my mother. Because I signed her into the home I am liable despite the home telling us they were going to sort out applying for funding once her assets ran out (which they now deny). I have been trying to sort out a way to repay some of the funds and put ourselves further into debt asking for an initial case from a solicitor earlier this year. I wrote over three months ago offering an initial settlement with them and have chased them repeatedly ever since by mail (agreed contact with them to one named person) and phone as they have refused to respond. In the meantime an interim charging order was put on our property which is our only asset as we have no savings at all. Whilst we have no dependent children (under law) with us here, we do have two under 20 with mental health issues and health issues of our own. We both work and receive no benefits and have been completely unable to engage a solicitor or anyone to advise us about all of this as we are struggling to pay back mortgage arrears and other debts as it is.

We are completely desperate and I don't feel I can take much more: I don't see the point in any of it anymore. I finally received a letter this morning from the solicitors (after I threatened them by saying that it appeared that they were stonewalling me by refusing to discuss settlements simply because when it goes to court they can claim charges (over £30,000 worth I may add!) for attending the court. The letter states that they reject my offer and that I have to send any further offer in writing with evidence of our financial position and the value of the charges registered and pending registration against the property and that they anticipate receiving instructions to apply for an Order of Sale.

It appears to me that this has been deliberately timed to make sure there is no way we can to and fro in the time leading up to Christmas and New Year when their offices will be closed as the court date is in the first week of January.

At the moment I feel like life isn't worth it. I am not the sort of person to be that way, however I feel beyond desperate and as though we are trapped in a nightmare. My mother must be turning in her grave. Please, please can anyone offer any advice at all? Please.

[CYNthesys]

Re: Charging order and possession

Im not the best one to advise you, no doubt someone will come along shortly to help, but in the meantime did you enter into a contract in relation to the nursing home fees etc
Has a CCJ already been obtained against you in respect of the alleged debt?
Im not up to speed on this sort of thing but thought that a charging order can only be made if there is already a ccj against you.

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Another point, is you mother mentally capable of managing/administering her own property and affairs

[urgenthelp]

Re: Charging order and possession

Hello CYNthesys, thank you for responding. My mother died last year. Also, as I said, I did sign her in and having spent a over a month with her close to death and not expecting survival and then the hospital putting pressure on us to get her back out I probably would have signed anything at the time. I didn't realise that signing in her in was a contract as I wouldn't have agreed to it if so as we have no funds to agree to pay ourselves. I realise that all of this is pure naivety in retrospect, however I believed every word we were told at the time by the DM about how they would keep a close eye on her remaining funds (they were told they were not vast when she switched to this nursing home) and that they would organise payment via LA (which they now deny). I am not looking for any special favours here - I realise with hindsight that I have done very many things incorrectly. What I need to find out is how on earth I can move forward when the solicitors have spent 3 months sitting on my offer (which is 3 x what the solicitor who advised us at first told me to offer) and ignored frequent contact until it is pretty much too late for me to proceed forward in any way. I am convinced that this has all been strategically planned to ensure that the court date can not be postponed or stopped and that they will be able to proceed to court and request their huge charges.

[Debt Camel]

Re: Charging order and possession

Presumably there has been a CCJ - did you defend the case? What monthly payment was set?

You say your mother's assets ran out - do she died with no estate at all? Was there no local authority funding?

Can you give some details about your house and mortgage:
- approx value of the house?
- is the house in joint names?
- is this debt in your name only?
- how large is the mortgage? are there any secured loans, if so in whose names?
- is the mortgage repayment or interest only? when will it end?
- how large are the arrears on the mortgage and what arrangement, if any, have you reached with the lender?

How large are your other debts and how much are you paying a month to them?

Orders for Sale are very rare, see http://debtcamel.co.uk/charging-order-sale/ for the statistics to prove this, Are you currently making the monthly CCJ payments set by the court? If you are up to date with these an Order For Sale will not be granted.

What was the settlement offer you made that was ignored / rejected?

[CYNthesys]

Re: Charging order and possession

Send a written request to the nursing home by recorded delivery asking for a copy of the contract.
Where you say that you did sign her in, what exactly do you mean by that?
Do you mean that you just arranged it all for her?
Did you act as a guarantor?

As your mum has now passed away, who was appointed to deal with her estate?

[urgenthelp]

Re: Charging order and possession

There has not been a CCJ to my knowledge. One minute I was communicating with the solicitors and was attempting to defend the claim. What appears to happen next is that there was a form which I returned to the court about the claim stating my side of things an N... which I sent, but not by recorded delivery. It appears that this was not received and when I got a reminder I stupidly thought it was just a generated one as it didn't look important and I knew that I was attempting to comply with what the court had said about making sure that both sides attempted every opportunity to arrange a settlement before court. It is since then that I have been chasing them - I have copies of all the e-mails sent and those I have sent requesting reply etc. Because the court didn't receive the form I then had the interim charging order sent to me and a date for court in our local court for the first week of January. As I say however, there wasn't a CCJ made to my knowledge or any request for an amount to pay monthly otherwise I would have attempted to keep this up. As the debt is above £25,000 I think this may be why they have gone directly to court, although that is only a guess x

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I already got a copy of the contract months ago. They have it in the small print that I am liable - I had no knowledge that I was acting as guarantor until the solicitor told me that was the case and it came as a huge shock. There was no estate to deal with once the funeral had been paid for.

[Debt Camel]

Re: Charging order and possession

Check right now whether you have a CCJ: http://www.trustonline.org.uk/search-yourself

[urgenthelp]

Re: Charging order and possession

Presumably there has been a CCJ - did you defend the case? What monthly payment was set?

You say your mother's assets ran out - do she died with no estate at all? Was there no local authority funding?

Can you give some details about your house and mortgage:
- approx value of the house?
- is the house in joint names?
- is this debt in your name only?
- how large is the mortgage? are there any secured loans, if so in whose names?
- is the mortgage repayment or interest only? when will it end?
- how large are the arrears on the mortgage and what arrangement, if any, have you reached with the lender?

How large are your other debts and how much are you paying a month to them?

Orders for Sale are very rare, see http://debtcamel.co.uk/charging-order-sale/ for the statistics to prove this, Are you currently making the monthly CCJ payments set by the court? If you are up to date with these an Order For Sale will not be granted.

What was the settlement offer you made that was ignored / rejected?

Sorry, the fuller reply has gone to the bottom for some reason. I made an offer for the equivalent of 3 months of payments (when I finally managed to arrange a meeting with the Account Manager and DM to let them know her funds had pretty much finished), less £1800 deposit originally paid. They have (after over three months of mail and phone calls) only just responded today and I feel that they have done this deliberately as they know there isn't going to be time to too and fro before they close for the Christmas and New Year break.

[CYNthesys]

Re: Charging order and possession

I think the contract needs to be scrutinised, can you redact personal information, scan and post up the contract

[urgenthelp]

Re: Charging order and possession

I really don't have a spare £10. This has been half of the problem in the last few months to be honest. We don't have the money to employ a solicitor, I couldn't really afford to go to one for advice and the defence that we did 4 months ago. It seems so desperate as if we had been able to employ someone to do all of the legal side of things from the outset then I am more than certain that it would never have come to this! It's the way of the world I know, however it's heartbreakingly unfair. I will see if I can borrow some from someone so I can do this, thank you.
Please could you tell me what difference it would make, if any, if there either IS or ISN'T a CCJ in place in this case? Thank you x

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I'm sorry, I don't have the facilities to do that.

[Debt Camel]

Re: Charging order and possession

I made an offer for the equivalent of 3 months of payments less £1800 deposit originally paid.

How much is this compared to the amount they are asking for from you now?

(when I finally managed to arrange a meeting with the Account Manager and DM to let them know her funds had pretty much finished),

When was this? You were aware your mums funds were running out and you didnt' follow up what was being done about local authority funding? (I am sorry if this sounds unsympathetic but we need the facts more than you need someone saying how terrible this is.)

They have (after over three months of mail and phone calls) only just responded today

And what did they say?

Can you answer my very long previous list of questions please.

[Debt Camel]

Re: Charging order and possession

I really don't have a spare £10.

ok, lets row back and look at your income. You say you have two young adults in the house. Are they students? Working? On benefits? How much are they contributing to the house.

Please could you tell me what difference it would make, if any, if there either IS or ISN'T a CCJ in place in this case? .

If there is no CCJ, then the claim needs to be defended. If there is a CCJ, we need to know what the judgment says.

[CYNthesys]

Re: Charging order and possession

It doesnt cost £10 to search the register, its £4 per search

[urgenthelp]

Re: Charging order and possession

It doesnt cost £10 to search the register, its £4 per search

When I started to fill in my details and was about to go to the next page it came up with a £10 charge would be required to pay so I stopped and posted the comment x

[Amethyst]

Re: Charging order and possession

When I started to fill in my details and was about to go to the next page it came up with a £10 charge would be required to pay so I stopped and posted the comment x

You only need to tick the first box - England and Wales Orders & Judgments - that is definitely £4 ( I just went through all my details just to double check ) - I think it is £10 if you tick all the boxes although I have to say it really isn't very clear how much it is until after you have completed your details which is very irritating.

However if you have a charging order interim order already it is likely it would be older than 28 days and would show on your credit file so could be worth checking on https://www.noddle.co.uk/ first ( completely free - no need to sign up for any of the extras ) - that should show any CCJ's against you.