The Cameron Campaign Pamphlet.

[charitynjw]

Re: The Cameron Campaign Pamphlet.

I'm usually in when I should be out, & vice versa!

If the Hokey Cokey really is what it's all about, I'm burgered!

:twitch:

[enaid]

Re: The Cameron Campaign Pamphlet.

Just a side thought on all this. The new NLW is imho about to cause problems for many small companies and maybe a few of the larger ones.
Reports already that overtime and bonuses have been cut so some people are no better off, suppose needs must for some firms to survive.
How apt that this has been done now and known by the clone clowns to probably cause problems for some firms, if we do exit of course all that will be blamed on the exit and not their slimey attempt at looking good and caring.

[ahflibra]

Re: The Cameron Campaign Pamphlet.

Wonder what company printed the booklet ? It don't say will have to do some searching , Hope it was a British company and not a European one

[enaid]

Re: The Cameron Campaign Pamphlet.

Wonder what company printed the booklet ? It don't say will have to do some searching , Hope it was a British company and not a European one

German

It also emerged last night that the firm which printed the Government’s leaflet is owned by a German company given repeated hand-outs by the European Commission.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/04/07/politics-live-governments-9million-anti-brexit-letter-sparks-fur/

[Crazy council]

Re: The Cameron Campaign Pamphlet.

hi,

you can guess that 500k of that was backhanders,

Williams Lea, a UK printing company owned by German-based Deutsche Post

The campaign has cost £9.3m. £5.9m went on printing and delivery costs and £2.9m had been spent on the accompanying website and digital promotion. Production of the leaflet made up £458,500.

[ahflibra]

Re: The Cameron Campaign Pamphlet.

Crafty Baxxards

[EXC]

Re: The Cameron Campaign Pamphlet.

To be fair the Better Off Out campaign has it's stuff printed in Holland, according the Eye, which is even more hypocritical in my view.

[PAWS]

Re: The Cameron Campaign Pamphlet.

All arguments for and against seem to be made up of generalisation and sweeping comment. Most people just want to know ‘what difference will it make to my life’. I really do not care what any pamphlet preaches or what some talking suit condescends to bawl at me– I do not need some power hungry baboon to add more lies to the ones we believed at the last election. We need to see what it means for us in clear and real terms. Most people just want to know ‘what difference will it make to my life’.
OK, let me tell you what difference it will make to my life. My husband works for a medium sized UK business. Many of it’s customers are based in the EU. It is operating to full capacity. It needs investment to expand and a German company have offered this investment in exchange for a share in the company. No British investors can be found. This would allow them to quadruple their productivity and more than double the workforce. More jobs in the UK and more exports from the UK. If we pull out of Europe the German company will not invest. The company would not be able to compete in Europe as duty would be added to the selling price. Not only would the company not employ more people, they may struggle to survive as they would lose most of their customer base. This would have a knock on effect on the local economy not to mention the amount of money being paid in corporate tax, NI and PAYE.
There is a lot of ill informed comment out there. Comments made by those who should know better.
George Monbiot wrote in the Guardian that the EU subsidies paid to UK farmers was simply a payment to help keep the fat cats rich. Alex Proud in the Telegraph commented that Farms were ‘too messy’ for his liking and we should question the subsidies received by farmers as the farms simply were not picturesque enough for him. The truth is– even with subsidies farmers are twice as likely to commit suicide than any other business group. Most -not some or a majority of a couple of % but most, admit to be in untenable debt. This green and pleasant land would not be so green and pleasant without them and without the subsidies only the big intensive farms would survive.Back to the days of big landlords and a small cartel controlling our food prices. By the way we do not produce enough food to feed ourselves and without free trade we would pay duty on imports. A combination of a very few big landowners controlling prices and duty added to the cost of imports = higher food prices at the tills.
So for me it would mean less local employment, possibly husband out of work and higher food bills. These are not speculative comments; these are facts and when put to supporters of the ‘OUT’ campaign they just shrug and say ‘Oh trust us, you will be better off’ and then witter on about how much membership costs us. So maybe we will save billions every year but who will actually get that money? The Government will decide. Well, they can’t properly manage the budget at the moment and the coffers are not fairly distributed.
Yep, we will not be paying billions of pounds to the EU - another fact but how much will rising unemployment due to reduced exports and lack of EU investment cost us in reduced revenue and higher benefit claims? How much will it cost us in rising import cost of essentials? How much in the future when our pension pots are empty?

[PAWS]

Re: The Cameron Campaign Pamphlet.

I would just like to add something re immigration. I am an EU immigrant to this country. I came here as a working student -working to pay my way through college but still, I suppose, taking the wages out of someone else’s pocket. I packed Ice Cream at night as well as a variety of other jobs to pay my fees and keep a roof over my head. When I went on to do a second degree I did get a partial grant but by then I had paid , many thousands in PAYE.
So,why did I come here in the first place? Why not study ‘back home’? Because I had been in a Magdalene Laundry and though not incarcerated (and no longer a laundry) I felt I could not live in a society where women were forced by shame and finances into such an horrific system. I ran as Shane McGowan said ‘from fear of priests with empty plates, guilt and weeping effigies’. No my life was not in danger but my spirit was. I then married a ‘very’ English man.
In almost 30 years , even though the IRA was still bombing the UK, I have never once been told to ‘go back to where I came from’. No one has ever been abusive or rude. Many other EU people could probably say the same. People in the UK are generally tolerant and decent but the media would have us believe that xenophobic hatred wafts from every bolted door. It simply is not true. It is natural for people to be suspicious of anyone who is different be it dress, accent, religion or the colour of one’s skin but the gutter press stoke this curiosity into fear and then hatred –
Please, please, in the name of humanity remember that not all you read in the papers is true. The country is not infested with free loading, knife wielding foreigners who won’t even bother to learn the language.Anyone who has tried to get a plumber or electrician, (at least where I live) will find that contrary to reports we are not awash with cheap foreign workers .Whatever country I visit I meet lots of foreign people working or studying. Paris, Berlin, Rome, Dublin and even WARSAW are full of Europeans living, working, and learning. Many of them from the UK.

[enaid]

Re: The Cameron Campaign Pamphlet.

The IN is very much important to you then Paws as is the OUT for me, but for different reasons.
You have stated your hubbies firm needs investment and can only seem to get this from Germany, does this mean they wont invest if we leave the EU?

My reasons for wanting OUT are simply that I don't believe things can get any worse here than what they are at present. I also don't believe that being part of a massive club that's getting bigger by the year and most of it poorer, is the way to go. I just think if we go down then let that be our fault and our choice not because we were dragged down by others.

[PAWS]

Re: The Cameron Campaign Pamphlet.

No-they will not invest if we leave the EU.


None of us believe that the UK will suddenly turn into North Korea if we leave (but I am keeping an eye on Cameron’s Hair!) but I just don’t see how it will solve the day to day issues we struggle with. Giants of industry have said that they will consider pulling out of the UK if we leave. Companies from America and the East use the UK as an English speaking base which allows them a fantastic and stable foothold in Europe. The Europeans who already invest here may also pull out. Now Gove tells us that we will still enjoy free trade but cannot give a plausible explanation as to how that would work. Very successful business people, people who have built up and run worldwide companies employing thousands disagree with him.

The government spend more than £11 billion on foreign aid -until the end of last year the main recipients included India and China both with a space programme. This will not change if we leave the EU. I know there are people in desperate poverty in other countries but tell that to the Stockport mother who turned up at a food bank with a plastic bag on her baby because she could not afford nappies.

Our best doctors and surgeons are moving to countries abroad because they are crippled by student debt and the NHS is mismanaged. It is not about funding but the mismanagement of the budgets and a general lack of professional standards. This will not change if we leave the EU.

Other EU countries provide good schools and government funded 3^rdlevel education. We do not and it is now almost back to the days when only the wealthy can afford a decent education. This will not change if we leave the EU.

[enaid]

Re: The Cameron Campaign Pamphlet.

Well I think a German firm holding a company to ransom is awful tbh, to me that's just what they are doing and they will be doing it to feather their own nests not ours
Germany does not want us to leave and that is also something to benefit them and not us.
I agree a lot of things may not change or even improve but being selfish, charity begins at home and if we can never look after our own for whatever reason we should certainly not be looking after others.

[PAWS]

Re: The Cameron Campaign Pamphlet.

Oh I do not think they are really holding them to ransom -if you look at it from their point of view they are about to invest millions in a company that might find it difficult to compete in a European market in the future. I know the in campaign are trying to convince people that we can still trade freely in Europe even if we are out but the truth is there are far too many variables for companies to take a chance.
I know the media portray us as the poor bullied underdog of Europe but that is not the case. If we only signed up to a trade agreement we would have to abide by rules and regulations we really would not have a say over and the rest of Europe would be inclined to take a dim view of a country that just wants the benefits but none of the responsibility of membership. Then we really would know what it was like to have regulations imposed upon us that we have no say over. Once the referendum is out of the way they are ready to invest but I really cannot blame them for holding back for now. They will make ideal partners but not if there is the slightest chance UK trade in Europe is restricted or subject to any constraints.

[enaid]

Re: The Cameron Campaign Pamphlet.

This is where I come unstuck, it is other countries that have helped the demise of many of our once booming industries.
The latest steel, then textiles, coal, ships, farming, cars to name just the main ones , but it seems we depend on them to invest here,. As though we ourselves have no money or faith in doing so.
I know we all want value for money, but I really think when the sweat shops and cheap labour abroad comes to an end (I think it will eventually even if others don't) we will be totally on out knees and at their mercy as we have nothing left here to depend on. The only ups are in retail and hospitality both which depend on the money in our pockets, or the pockets of tourists.
I just think if we have something worth selling, someone will buy it no matter what, right now we having nothing worth even giving away, very sad imho.

[enaid]

Re: The Cameron Campaign Pamphlet.

nuff said

http://www.itv.com/news/granada/upda...imported-milk/