EA fees and Councils and FOI's discussion

[Guest]

Re: EA fees and Councils and FOI's discussion

You have no idea of the way it works as there are no precedents to rely on. Given your recent track record of getting things wrong, you are the last person that I would listen to. You might think you're coming across as clever by continually claiming that legislation is easy to follow, but all you are doing is showing how stupid you really are. How many solicitors do you know that come out with such craas statements? Very few if any I would guess.

'Money taken in the exercise of power' could have a multitude of meanings, including that it should refer to money taken exclusively by the person exercising the power. It is reasonable to argue that money paid voluntary the creditor is not done so in the exercise of power.

Can't be bothered arguing with you any longer, whatever is said, you just disagree with for the sake of it. I too have a saying that I use:

If you climb to into the pig sty and wrestle with the pigs, the pigs love it and you get dirty.

Again I have no Idea what it is you are talking about, if you are accusing me of some great error I wish you would just say what it is and get it off your chest rather than making oblique references to it.
Money taken the exercise of a power is well defined within the legislation. the fact that you cannot see it is not really important in the scheme of things as everyone else can.
To others it is not an issue worth even discussing. Yes solicitors have commented on this, only because of the multitude of FOI have made , the results are on this thread, the reason more do not is because it is so bloody obvious, to be frank. This like so many other silly ideas,started off as a perceived loophole and you carried it on for so long that even now when it is absolutely plan that you are incorrect your pride will not let it go.

The qoute was Churchill i take it, or perhaps the bard, just gores to prove, anyone can have an off day.

[Guest]

Re: EA fees and Councils and FOI's discussion

Legislation deals only with proceeds of enforcement, not voluntary payments.

Pote. If the account is in the hands of the EA it is under an enforcment power, any payment made will be a result of that power.

Do you think that the debtor can, after contact by the bailiff, go to the authority and say. I am going to pay this money now, but it is not the result of the bailiff action this is a voluntary payment so please do not charge any fees, and they will take any notice.
Sometimes I worry about you.

[Guest]

Re: EA fees and Councils and FOI's discussion

Really it is clear that all these FOIs show is that various authorities handle the apportionment of fees on direct payments in different ways, apart from the ones who have not updated there systems yet from the old regime.
The real point is that the legislation(yes i am afraid so ) is clear that the payments, less than the total amount outstanding are apportioned, there is clear legislative instruction, so how anyone can expect any other action to be taken, frankly is absurd.

[Big Al]

Re: EA fees and Councils and FOI's discussion

Pote. If the account is in the hands of the EA it is under an enforcment power, any payment made will be a result of that power.

Do you think that the debtor can, after contact by the bailiff, go to the authority and say. I am going to pay this money now, but it is not the result of the bailiff action this is a voluntary payment so please do not charge any fees, and they will take any notice.
Sometimes I worry about you.

And do you think a debtor who genuinely had no idea that the bailiffs were involved paid the debt through an enforcement power?

[Big Al]

Re: EA fees and Councils and FOI's discussion

Really it is clear that all these FOIs show is that various authorities handle the apportionment of fees on direct payments in different ways, apart from the ones who have not updated there systems yet from the old regime.
The real point is that the legislation(yes i am afraid so ) is clear that the payments, less than the total amount outstanding are apportioned, there is clear legislative instruction, so how anyone can expect any other action to be taken, frankly is absurd.

Yes, the legislation s clear, the bailiff collects his fees from proceeds.

[Guest]

Re: EA fees and Councils and FOI's discussion

And do you think a debtor who genuinely had no idea that the bailiffs were involved paid the debt through an enforcement power?

If someone genuinely had no idea that the debt was owed when it was passed to the EA(very unlikely given that on a council tax bill there are around 8 warning notice s sent before this event) then there are statutory remedies to get the authorrty to recover the warrant order.

Otherwise the first fee(compliance stage fee) is due when the account is sent to the EA, taking control of goods regulations section 4.

Recovery of fees for enforcement-related services from the debtor

4.—(1) — The enforcement agent may recover from the debtor the fees indicated in the Schedule in accordance with this regulation and regulations 11, 12, 13, 16 and 17, by reference to the stage, or stages, of enforcement for which enforcement-related services have been supplied.(2) The fees referred to in paragraph (1) may be recovered out of proceeds.(3) The enforcement agent may recover under this regulation the whole fee provided in the Schedule for a stage where the amount outstanding is paid after the commencement, but before the completion, of that stage.

[Guest]

Re: EA fees and Councils and FOI's discussion

Yes, the legislation s clear, the bailiff collects his fees from proceeds.

Very good

[Big Al]

Re: EA fees and Councils and FOI's discussion

If someone genuinely had no idea that the debt was owed when it was passed to the EA(very unlikely given that on a council tax bill there are around 8 warning notice s sent before this event) then there are statutory remedies to get the authorrty to recover the warrant order.

Which statutory remedies are those?

[Big Al]

Re: EA fees and Councils and FOI's discussion

4.—(1) — The enforcement agent may recover from the debtor the fees indicated in the Schedule in accordance with this regulation and regulations 11, 12, 13, 16 and 17, by reference to the stage, or stages, of enforcement for which enforcement-related services have been supplied.(2) The fees referred to in paragraph (1) may be recovered out of proceeds.(3) The enforcement agent may recover under this regulation the whole fee provided in the Schedule for a stage where the amount outstanding is paid after the commencement, but before the completion, of that stage.

And what are proceeds? Money from the sale of goods or money taken by an enforcement power.

[Guest]

Re: EA fees and Councils and FOI's discussion

And what are proceeds? Money from the sale of goods or money taken by an enforcement power.

Very good again Pote.
And an enforcment power is ?

[Big Al]

Re: EA fees and Councils and FOI's discussion

Very good again Pote.
And an enforcment power is ?

Something only an EA has.

[Guest]

Re: EA fees and Councils and FOI's discussion

Which statutory remedies are those?

I tink they are called statutory declarations pote, anyway you were doing so well, carry on and answer the previous question, you are almost there.

[Guest]

Re: EA fees and Councils and FOI's discussion

Something only an EA has.

Yes this is also true, not sure how it helps you. I will help the definition of enforcement power is

(2)

In this Schedule a power to use the procedure to recover a particular sum is called an “enforcement power”.

[Big Al]

Re: EA fees and Councils and FOI's discussion

I tink they are called statutory declarations pote, anyway you were doing so well, carry on and answer the previous question, you are almost there.

Ah, so revealed a nice get out of jail card - just do a stat dec saying you were unaware of the EA's involvement.

[Guest]

Re: EA fees and Councils and FOI's discussion

Now what do you think it means by "procedures"