No will

[Avi777]

Hi,

My dad died in April 2019. Although my brother and I had a reasonable relationship with him we did not know much about his domestic arrangements and his partner of 30 years having never met her. He separated from my mum in the early 90s.

My main query is that I do not know if he had a will or whether it’s been misplaced. I very much doubt he did knowing him. Consequently I do not know where to start. I have regularly checked on the probate gov site to see probate had been served but there has never been anything on there.

Any advice how to proceed would be grateful. Although he was a company director and was still working I do not know if he had savings, bank accounts or assets. I presume bank accounts have been frozen without a probate certificate.

thank you

[ostell]

Why not contact his partner?

[Avi777]

Thanks for the reply. I don’t know her and feel awkward broaching the subject. As I’ve not heard anything I assume there’s no will.

[ostell]

Perhaps she might like some contact

Assumptions could be wrong. Perhaps she does not know how to contact you.

[Avi777]

Just awkward as we never knew her and my dad left my mum for her all those years back. 30 years is a significant time. She has children too, but not by my late dad and they weren’t married. I think my dad was secretive so she probably doesn’t know. He might have even had another family as well ?!

Reading a thread on here about letters of administration. I’m guessing we would be the main benefactors however I don’t want to go to the expense and effort if my dad had nothing anyway. How do I even track down bank accounts and assets when I don’t know vital things or have access to statements? I know he had a company car, and their house was in their joint names - not that I would want to put any claims on her house. I don’t wish to spend 3k on solicitors fees etc if my dad only had £300. Can you see the dilemma.

thank you.

[des8]

As you and your brother are his closest relatives (I assume your parents were divorced or your mother has passed on) if you obtain a copy of your father's death certificate you could apply for a grant of letters of administration. This should be granted if no one else has applied
With that documentation you could then approach all the banks etc requesting details of any & all accounts in his name

[Avi777]

Thank you for your reply. Yes my mum was separated and sadly passed away a number of years ago.

Is the process relatively easy & cheap to apply for?

Is there any time limit on it as my father passed away in 2019?

How do I know his partner hasn’t already done this and not told us ? - They weren’t married. Would this show up on the probate gov site ?

How do I even track down bank accounts/assets when all I have are basic details etc? There might be £200 but then there might be £20k sat there. Just don’t know. A complete mess and he knew he was ill.

thank you for reading this.

[des8]

Unmarried partners can't apply for letters of administration, but any grant would show on a probate search anyway


To apply for letters of administration isn't complicated : Form PA1A: Apply for probate by post if there is not a will - GOV.UK (www.gov.uk)
but I have just realised you need to complete an assessment of the estate value. As you can't in this case I would suggest first of all contacting HMRC to see if there is a way round the problem Contact details in this link: Valuing the estate of someone who's died: Report the estate’s value to HMRC - GOV.UK (www.gov.uk)



Perhaps a trawl round the banks with death certificate and proof of your relationship (birth certificate) will produce some information.
He was a director of a company.... ?shareholding

[Avi777]

Thank you for all the links etc. Do you know if there’s a time limit on claiming? Yes the value of the estate would be hard to estimate.

Is there any easier way to find bank accounts/shares etc. What about pensions too, I’m presuming that would go to his partner. My dad was 70 when he passed away. Worked his whole life in good jobs, so I find it hard to believe he left nothing. He was a director in name only as far as I know.

thank you.

[des8]

There is no time limit on probate.
Sometimes when one partner dies the other, perhaps elderly, just carries on and its not until they pass on some years later that both estates are sorted and it is necessary to get two grants of probate.

The easiest way is probably to bite the bullet and contact your late father's partner as ostell
Could be that she doesn't realise what needs to be done.

If that doesn't help there are firms who search out lost assets.
They might be able to help but I don't know what the charges are, nor how effective they are

[Avi777]

Thank you once again for your reply. Don’t know why people can’t just write a will and deal with it. Makes life so much easier for those left behind. Takes 20 mins as well.


His partner seemed reasonable but didn’t want her to think we were gold diggers even though we are entitled. She was meant to let us know about the scattering of his ashes but we’ve not heard a thing. I know grief affects people differently.


If anyone has any good ideas about tracking assets /finding bank accounts please let me know. As I say, I really don’t know if he had £200 or £20k to justify the expense and time and I just don’t know where to start as having no leads such as statements etc.

thank you.

[des8]

You did mention that your father and his partner jointly owned their house.
It might be worth looking here (Search for property information from HM Land Registry - GOV.UK (www.gov.uk) ) to see if they held it as joint tenants or tenants in common.
If as tenants in common , without evicting his partner you would have a figure to put in to HMRC so you could then obtain the grant of letters of administration

[Hagalout]

Without wishing to hijack the post can I just ask Des 8 some advice, in the situation you describe where the surviving partner(as Executor of deceased partners will) just carries on without applying for probate, who is entitled to apply when she passes away, as they are 2 seperate families, the Executor of the 2nd partners will presumably has no authority over the first partners estate and can't be held in any way responsible can they?

[Avi777]

Yes good question Hagalout.

House is divided up as Tennants in common.

[des8]

Without wishing to hijack the post can I just ask Des 8 some advice, in the situation you describe where the surviving partner(as Executor of deceased partners will) just carries on without applying for probate, who is entitled to apply when she passes away, as they are 2 seperate families, the Executor of the 2nd partners will presumably has no authority over the first partners estate and can't be held in any way responsible can they?

The Rules of Intestacy determine who is allowed to apply for the Letter of Administration
The order is:

1. The married partner or civil partner of the person who has died
2. The child (or children) of the person who has died (or grandchildren if the child is predeceased)
3. The parent of the person who has died
4. The brother or sister of the person who has died (or their children if they have predeceased)
5. The half-brother or half-sister of the person who has died (or their children if they have predeceased)
6. The grandparents of the person who has died
7. Aunts and uncles of the person who has died (or their children if they have predeceased)
8. Half aunts and uncles of the person who has died (or their children if they have predeceased)
9. The Crown

Depending on the value and assets of the relative estates letters of administration might not be needed.

However if there is real property held as tenants in common a grant will be required in respect of both persons estate.
If there is a child of the partnership, that child could be the personal representative for both estates, but would need a grant for each.