• Welcome to the LegalBeagles Consumer and Legal Forum. Please register to get the most out of the forum. Registration is free and only needs a username and email address.
  • LegalBeagles® is a free forum, founded in May 2007, providing legal guidance and support to consumers and SME's across a range of legal areas.

    Please do not post your full name, reference numbers or any identifiable details on the forum.

BMW Financial Services - Voluntary Termination/Excess Mileage

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Originally posted by R0b View Post
    Well it has been some time but I've finally updated an example letter before action that you could use as a basis for bringing a claim. I'll admit that there's probably things in there that can be improved upon but hopefully gives you some comfort to know what you are talking about. In essence, if you were to bring a claim then the contents of the letter is probably what you are going to argue in court.

    I should point out that there are a few things in there that may or may not apply to your situation so be sure to make sure the letter is accurate if you are intending on using it. If you need access to it, I'll add it to my list of templates which you can find by clicking here.

    Would be good to know your thoughts and comments.
    Thanks for doing this R0b. Just FYI, the link you've provided in the post does not work. The document is obtainable through your list of templates however.

    I've just been on the phone to BMW Financial Services, asking for details of their legal department so that I can submit the Notice Before Action. I decided to ask also at this point, as one final port of call before going down the court route, whether or not BMW Financial Services would be prepared to make me a reduced offer (i.e. 30% of the alleged balance) to save us both a load of time and hassle. I explained very clearly, that this was in no way an admission of any liability on my part, and that I would only consider any offer made on the basis that all the incorrect/innacurate missed/late payment entries be reported as removed with CRAs. The advisor put me on hold and went off to check. Came back to me with an offer of reducing the alleged balance by 30%. I declined, and pushed back with a counter suggestion of 50%. Off they went again to check, before coming back to me with an acceptance of this suggestion. They then proceeded to explain that, even if I were to accept this offer, they would not be able to remove any former missed/late payment entries that had been submitted to CRAs, and that they would only mark the account as "partially settled". I argued it until I was blue in the face, but they were adament there was nothing they could do on this front, as it would qualify as "incorrect reporting" - the cheek of it!

    So it looks as though, regardless of whether or not I had been willing to accept an offer of a reduction of the alleged balance, I'd still have to take them to court anyway for inaccurate reporting! Unbelievable.

    If anyone has any thoughts before I "press the button" and seek legal action, then please do voice them!

    Comment


    • Strange, I've removed the file and re-uploaded it onto this post so it hopefully works now.

      I've nothing further to add really other than if it does go all the way, the crux of the arguments will come down to whether or not the excess mileage charges or collection fees fall within the meaning of "credit". The obvious answer to me is that it doesn't, for the reasons I've mentioned in the LBA which I think is a fair and reasonable expectation.

      If the matter ends up with a hearing at court, I would very much be interested in knowing which court it is so I can possibly attend in person.
      Attached Files
      LEGAL DISCLAIMER
      Please be aware that this is a public forum and is therefore accessible to anyone. The content I post on this forum is not intended to be legal advice nor does it establish any client-lawyer relationship between you and me. Some of the content I post may include example wording, letters or other similar responses or templates but they are intended for informational and educational purposes only. Using some or all of my content may fail to meet your needs that is specific to your situation and I cannot be held responsible or liable in any way so you accept that you are using it at your own risk. It is recommended that you seek independent legal advice and you can do this through the Law Society's Find a Solicitor database. Alternatively, you can contact your local Citizen's Advice Bureau for basic legal advice as well as various legal advice centres such as LawWorks. You may also be able to seek legal advice from your local university who may run a legal advice clinic to members of the public.

      Comment


      • Hi, read through this thread and I am in the same situation although a little more extreme. I am 3.5 years into BMW reporting a "6" on my account every month. I already have a mortgage etc and have no reason to get credit so had not known this was having such an adverse affect until now. I will never pay them off out of principle of the damage they've done to my credit rating. My question is this - How long can they report on this "account" for? 6 years the same as a default or longer? forever?
        Any help you can provide will be much appreciated.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by hollie1988 View Post
          Hi, read through this thread and I am in the same situation although a little more extreme. I am 3.5 years into BMW reporting a "6" on my account every month. I already have a mortgage etc and have no reason to get credit so had not known this was having such an adverse affect until now. I will never pay them off out of principle of the damage they've done to my credit rating. My question is this - How long can they report on this "account" for? 6 years the same as a default or longer? forever?
          Any help you can provide will be much appreciated.
          3.5 years? So a total of 42 missed/late entries? That's absolutely incredible.

          Legally, BMW Financial Services shouldn't be reporting more than about 6 missed/late payment entries. Once 6 have been recorded, they should file a "Default Notice" if they firmly believe there is a balance owed. This is why each and every new entry shows as a "6", as clearly the CRA's software application/engine can't understand or handle the prospect that a lender would issue any more than 6 missed/late entries.

          Once the Default Notice is filed, the missed/late entries have to stop. Credit files with CRAs have a life of 6 years - as soon as an account becomes older than 6 years, it gets removed from your file. This is why a Default Notice is so important, because it allows an individual to start walking that long 6 year road to hopefully end up repairing their credit rating.

          What BMW Financial Services are doing qualifies as an 'unfair absence of a default', and as such, constitutes inaccurate/improper processing of personal data (according to the terms imposed by the Data Protection Act). They are continuing to behave this way out of sheer arrogance - they believe there is absolutely nothing you can do to stop them so they're quite comfortable to continue damaging your perceived credit worthiness forever, apparently. I even have emails from their collections department, whereby they claim that they “do not need to issue a Default Notice” and that they have every right to “continue issuing missed/late payment entries every 30 days until the balance is paid”. So apparently, they’re so arrogant, they believe they’re above the law.

          I’d so very much like to take them to court, but the cost element worries me. I’m still making my decision.

          Comment


          • Hi folks, just a quick update on my situation. After settling my account with BMWF nearly 3 months on its still showing in my credit file with a zero balance. I have asked them why this has not been removed along with the negative markers previously applied, I’m now getting the usual waffle and no one wanting to take responsibility. I’m very frustrated as I would have been as well not settling my account!!!

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Cmilligan View Post
              Hi folks, just a quick update on my situation. After settling my account with BMWF nearly 3 months on its still showing in my credit file with a zero balance. I have asked them why this has not been removed along with the negative markers previously applied, I’m now getting the usual waffle and no one wanting to take responsibility. I’m very frustrated as I would have been as well not settling my account!!!
              Did you send your settlement offer in writing? In the form of a "without prejudice" full and final settlement offer letter? If not, then BMW FS are unlikely to anything other than just accept your payment and leave it.

              Golden rule here is ALWAYS get your terms (e.g. the removal of all former missed payment entries) agreed in writing before any money changes hands.

              Let us know how you get on. If they refuse to help you, then they really are the biggest bunch of immoral pigs I've ever known.

              Comment


              • Hi I have been reading tis thread and am in a similar situation. I VT'd the car in May 2018. BMW FS says I owe them £1530 for excess mileage, when I used facts in this thread I got the following response.

                They say that the initial contract I signed (BMW Select PCP on March 2014 4 years and 8k pa mileage, I terminated on May with 42k miles) says that the mileage will be pro-rated if the agreement ends early.

                They say that Excess Milage is chargeable under the provision set out in Section 99 (2) of the CCA this section states that the right to VT does not affect any liability under the agreement which was accrued before termination. This means that we can lawfully recover any excess mileage in addition to the 50% figure allowed by section 100(1) As the mileage was accrued before termination we are able to invoice you for this.

                They go on to say the wording in the act advises that no more payments will need to be made if there are no arrears and the vehicle is returned in a reasonable condition. BMW FS have no control over this wording and can only make every effort to make it clear in my agreement that the milage will be calculated on a pro rata basis as confirmed in the excess milage section on the 1st page of your agreement.

                BMW FS would also view excess milage as contravening your obligation to keep the vehicle in a reasonable condition in line with your agreement and subsequently we are able to recover these costs, It would certainly not be reasonable to expect BMW FS to absorb the loss of value that the extra milage has caused as a result.

                They also state that they explained as much in step 5 of their VT email sent earlier in the year, which I never signed or returned. Based on this reasoning they are confident that BMW FS have not acted incorrectly in raising this invoice.

                They have added the balance to my Credit account and it now shows I owe BMW £1530 is this legal? Given they have admitted they have claimed an invoice, and this amount is not subject to a credit agreement?

                Any advice please?

                Comment


                • Hello

                  If you have read this thread then you will know the current position you are in. Unless you can agree with BMW in writing that you agree to pay the said amount on the condition that all adverse entries are removed, your only other option is legal proceedings.
                  LEGAL DISCLAIMER
                  Please be aware that this is a public forum and is therefore accessible to anyone. The content I post on this forum is not intended to be legal advice nor does it establish any client-lawyer relationship between you and me. Some of the content I post may include example wording, letters or other similar responses or templates but they are intended for informational and educational purposes only. Using some or all of my content may fail to meet your needs that is specific to your situation and I cannot be held responsible or liable in any way so you accept that you are using it at your own risk. It is recommended that you seek independent legal advice and you can do this through the Law Society's Find a Solicitor database. Alternatively, you can contact your local Citizen's Advice Bureau for basic legal advice as well as various legal advice centres such as LawWorks. You may also be able to seek legal advice from your local university who may run a legal advice clinic to members of the public.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by R0b View Post
                    Hello

                    If you have read this thread then you will know the current position you are in. Unless you can agree with BMW in writing that you agree to pay the said amount on the condition that all adverse entries are removed, your only other option is legal proceedings.

                    sorry for not making myself clear, at the moment my credit file is just showing an amount owing, there is nothing adverse on it yet, i.e. no missed payment, and my credit score is still high.

                    Are they correct in stating that excess mileage is accrued before termination and is subject to far wear and tear? (this seems to be the tack they have changed to over earlier reports from this thread)

                    Comment


                    • It is a moot point but rather than re-explaining, why not take a look at post #40 on the link below and read the example letter I posted which should give you the explanation in full.


                      http://legalbeagles.info/forums/foru...-v-bmw-finance
                      LEGAL DISCLAIMER
                      Please be aware that this is a public forum and is therefore accessible to anyone. The content I post on this forum is not intended to be legal advice nor does it establish any client-lawyer relationship between you and me. Some of the content I post may include example wording, letters or other similar responses or templates but they are intended for informational and educational purposes only. Using some or all of my content may fail to meet your needs that is specific to your situation and I cannot be held responsible or liable in any way so you accept that you are using it at your own risk. It is recommended that you seek independent legal advice and you can do this through the Law Society's Find a Solicitor database. Alternatively, you can contact your local Citizen's Advice Bureau for basic legal advice as well as various legal advice centres such as LawWorks. You may also be able to seek legal advice from your local university who may run a legal advice clinic to members of the public.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by R0b View Post
                        It is a moot point but rather than re-explaining, why not take a look at post #40 on the link below and read the example letter I posted which should give you the explanation in full.


                        http://legalbeagles.info/forums/foru...-v-bmw-finance
                        fantastic thanks, I was unaware of that particular thread and had only really been following this one. Would living in Scotland affect my case? Ie in your superb response you make reference to a quote pertaining to England, should I leave that out?

                        Comment


                        • Only to the extent that case law in England and Wales is not binding but persuasive - you can still refer to it however, but if there are any authoritative cases in Scotland, they would take precedence over those in England and Wales.

                          But thats up to BMW to dispute, not you.
                          LEGAL DISCLAIMER
                          Please be aware that this is a public forum and is therefore accessible to anyone. The content I post on this forum is not intended to be legal advice nor does it establish any client-lawyer relationship between you and me. Some of the content I post may include example wording, letters or other similar responses or templates but they are intended for informational and educational purposes only. Using some or all of my content may fail to meet your needs that is specific to your situation and I cannot be held responsible or liable in any way so you accept that you are using it at your own risk. It is recommended that you seek independent legal advice and you can do this through the Law Society's Find a Solicitor database. Alternatively, you can contact your local Citizen's Advice Bureau for basic legal advice as well as various legal advice centres such as LawWorks. You may also be able to seek legal advice from your local university who may run a legal advice clinic to members of the public.

                          Comment


                          • Hi Rob are you able to provide the template that I can send to BMW for notice before action?
                            This relates to damages we had on a car with them from 2015 (only £245). We were not aware they were adding delinquent markers on my husbands file (only Experian,Equifax is still currently showing us paying each month!) until he got declined for car finance this year. We had disputed the original amount of £760 they then reduced to £245 went back and forth and we heard nothing since and assumed silence was acceptance.
                            Sent off letter to their complaints team in April this year using all the info on this thread (thank you, it has been invaluable) and they can’t even be bothered replying to it.
                            Our intention is to go straight to court since I know any other course of action is pointless and there is not huge sums involved in our case

                            I will keep you posted of any outcome

                            thanks
                            Kirsty

                            Comment


                            • Hi Kirsty,

                              Look at posts #150 and #152 of this thread on page 4.

                              It is an example template but will need to be adapted to suit your husband's situation.

                              I will be interested to see how BMW respond - might be best to use your own thread moving forward if you intend on driving this to court.
                              LEGAL DISCLAIMER
                              Please be aware that this is a public forum and is therefore accessible to anyone. The content I post on this forum is not intended to be legal advice nor does it establish any client-lawyer relationship between you and me. Some of the content I post may include example wording, letters or other similar responses or templates but they are intended for informational and educational purposes only. Using some or all of my content may fail to meet your needs that is specific to your situation and I cannot be held responsible or liable in any way so you accept that you are using it at your own risk. It is recommended that you seek independent legal advice and you can do this through the Law Society's Find a Solicitor database. Alternatively, you can contact your local Citizen's Advice Bureau for basic legal advice as well as various legal advice centres such as LawWorks. You may also be able to seek legal advice from your local university who may run a legal advice clinic to members of the public.

                              Comment


                              • Just a quick update from my side, as the originator of this thread...

                                I decided to make BMW FS a without prejudice, "full & final settlement" offer following their offering me a 50% reduction the last time I spoke to them on the phone. I wrote them a very clear letter explaining that I would agree to pay 50%, but only if the following terms were met:
                                • Neither BMW Financial Services (GB) Limited nor any associate company (including Debt Collection Agencies) will take any further action to attempt to enforce or pursue the alleged balance owing in any way whatsoever and that I will no longer accused of any liability
                                • BMW Financial Services (GB) Limited will report to all credit reference agencies (Experian, Equifax, CallCredit etc.) to ensure that they update their records to display the account as closed via way of full and final settlement with a balance of £0.00 owing
                                • BMW Financial Services (GB) Limited will report to all credit reference agencies (Experian, Equifax, CallCredit etc.) to ensure that they correct their records to remove all previously reported missed/late payment entries and amend the account history to show Account Status “0” (Payment up to date) for every month since the account opening, including the months following the date of Voluntary Termination
                                They came back to me fairly promptly, via email, saying that they would not accept my terms. They explained that, they would accept a payment of 50% of the total alleged balance, but only as a "partial settlement". They said that upon receipt of this sum, they would update credit reference agencies to show the account as partially settled with a balance of £0.00, but they would not remove any prior negatives (missed/late payment entries). They've decided to play hard ball as well, giving me just a few days to make a decision. They had the audacity to refer to their acceptance of a 50% payment as a "goodwill gesture" on their part. Disgraceful.

                                The only reason I even considered paying 50% of the alleged balance was to ensure that BMW FS corrected the false information that they have submitted to credit reference agencies. If they're refusing to do that, then where's my incentive to pay? Either way, I need to take them to court to get the incorrect information removed.

                                If you have any advice at all R0b, it'd be much appreciated.

                                Comment

                                View our Terms and Conditions

                                LegalBeagles Group uses cookies to enhance your browsing experience and to create a secure and effective website. By using this website, you are consenting to such use.To find out more and learn how to manage cookies please read our Cookie and Privacy Policy.

                                If you would like to opt in, or out, of receiving news and marketing from LegalBeagles Group Ltd you can amend your settings at any time here.


                                If you would like to cancel your registration please Contact Us. We will delete your user details on request, however, any previously posted user content will remain on the site with your username removed and 'Guest' inserted.

                                Announcement

                                Collapse

                                SHORTCUTS

                                Voluntary Termination: Letter Templates
                                A guide to voluntary termination: Your rights

                                If you are having problems related to your car finance and would like some help and support dealing with it, please read the guide and make a new thread in the forum with as much information as you can.

                                See more
                                See less

                                Court Claim ?

                                Guides and Letters
                                Loading...

                                upgrade to vip

                                Want exclusive access to forums, more privacy and a live chat box? Upgrade to become a bigger part of our community.

                                only £15/yr

                                Offers available. No subscription traps.

                                sign up now



                                Search and Compare fixed fee legal services and find a solicitor near you.

                                Find a Law Firm


                                Working...
                                X