Day in the Life of Sparkie PCN

[CYNthesys]

Re: Day in the Life of Sparkie PCN

I thought that ultimately the following applied


If after 14 days of a charge certificate being served the penalty charge is still not paid, the enforcement authority may register it as a debt at the Traffic Enforcement Centre. The authority may then recover the penalty through the county court:

• The county court, on application from the enforcement authority, will authorise the authority to draw up an Order for Recovery. The authority will serve this order on you, with a Witness Statement form.
• If the penalty is not then paid, the authority may apply to the court for a Warrant of Execution.

[michael]

Re: Day in the Life of Sparkie PCN

I thought that ultimately the following applied


If after 14 days of a charge certificate being served the penalty charge is still not paid, the enforcement authority may register it as a debt at the Traffic Enforcement Centre. The authority may then recover the penalty through the county court:

• The county court, on application from the enforcement authority, will authorise the authority to draw up an Order for Recovery. The authority will serve this order on you, with a Witness Statement form.
• If the penalty is not then paid, the authority may apply to the court for a Warrant of Execution.

All that is true, to an extent. 28 days after serving the Notice to Owner, the council issues a charge certificate, which increases the full penalty by 50%. After a further 14 days, the Order for Recovery is issued and if that is not paid, the next thing the motorist will know is bailiffs knocking at the door.

All this is done via the TEC at Northampton. At no point is there an actual court case which the motorist can defend.

Only if the motorist makes formal representation to the NtO, which are then rejected, can he appeal to the adjudicator. If at that stage he doesn't appeal or pay then the CC and OfR come into play

[des8]

Re: Day in the Life of Sparkie PCN

Back now and pleased others have come to the rescue. (I was interrupted by arrival of 4 grandchildren and am now k*******d)
Basically agree with the advice now given, but I would also refrain from identifying the driver (I know the owner is "responsible for the charge" but being overcautious I would not tell them I was driving!)
Do send them proof of the blue badge, and I would also refer them to their own policy guidance as in Post 6

[michael]

Re: Day in the Life of Sparkie PCN

Basically agree with the advice now given, but I would also refrain from identifying the driver (I know the owner is "responsible for the charge" but being overcautious I would not tell them I was driving!)

You are going to need to identify someone, without a name and address the council will ignore the appeal and the next thing will be an NtO

[Fred]

Re: Day in the Life of Sparkie PCN

May be I have missed something here but if the vehicle owner registered (under genuine circumstances) may make a complaint/enquiry to the council on their web site specifically made for that purpose with reasonable cause, would also that be an option ? :tinysmile_twink_t2:

Would the council be reasonable in response ?

[des8]

Re: Day in the Life of Sparkie PCN

Sparkie just wants to see this PCN cancelled.
The easiest way is to write to council on behalf of Margaret, advising she is the owner (as they can check via DVLA) and of her condition.
Then explain the driver's actions and the circumstances surrounding the incident.
No need to go on about CEO.
Send proof of blue badge and remind them of their policy guidance and the PCN should be cancelled.
At least that is what I'd be doing.
If it is turned down, then start getting local councillor involved, and letters to Chief Executive, (and local press?)
Then to independent adjudicator through Traffic Penalty Tribunal, but I don't really envisage it getting that far

[Sparkie1723]

Re: Day in the Life of Sparkie PCN

From Michaels post

"All that is true, to an extent. 28 days after serving the Notice to Owner, the council issues a charge certificate, which increases the full penalty by 50%. After a further 14 days, the Order for Recovery is issued and if that is not paid, the next thing the motorist will know is bailiffs knocking at the door.

All this is done via the TEC at Northampton. At no point is there an actual court case which the motorist can defend."
This I do not understand No one can be penalised by a Court Case that cannot be defended..that is in conflict with The ECHR's or am I wrong again.

Should nothing be done and the process goes its path....... how could they they serve a Notice on Margaret? in her mental state even if it was sent signed for she would not know what she was signing for or what it was, and even if she read it she wouldn't understand it.
For instance the notice on the screen would never have been removed by her.
She would have thought it was meant to be there like a tax disc or something.
I am only supposing.
I am the one who has to deal with it .....could I claim costs off the Council for my time in dealing with it?
Its just that I'm sick of having to fight beurocracy to try and both of of us live a peaceful last few years, and we ain't got too many of them left.
Sparkie:tinysmile_cry_t:
I know I'm an awkard old Git

[CYNthesys]

Re: Day in the Life of Sparkie PCN

As the PCN is made out to the owner, and the owner in this case is incapable, by reason of mental disorder to be able to deal with this I believe that Human Rights issues are relevant and come into play , ie Article 6 the right to a fair and impartial hearing and Article 14 (anti discrimination)
On the face of it it seems that the rules governing the enforcement of PCNs are not necessarily compliant with HRA 1998,
(no opportunity available for a person lacking capacity to challenge or defend a PCN unless they have someone validly appointed to administer their property or affairs.

[Fred]

Re: Day in the Life of Sparkie PCN

Sparkie just wants to see this PCN cancelled.
The easiest way is to write to council on behalf of Margaret, advising she is the owner (as they can check via DVLA) and of her condition.
Then explain the driver's actions and the circumstances surrounding the incident.
No need to go on about CEO.
Send proof of blue badge and remind them of their policy guidance and the PCN should be cancelled.
At least that is what I'd be doing.
If it is turned down, then start getting local councillor involved, and letters to Chief Executive, (and local press?)
Then to independent adjudicator through Traffic Penalty Tribunal, but I don't really envisage it getting that far

The point I was trying & failed to make !.................

[CYNthesys]

Re: Day in the Life of Sparkie PCN

Im on same wave length Sparkie, my post crossed with yours

[des8]

Re: Day in the Life of Sparkie PCN

Initially keep it simple.
If that fails, yes, that is the time to go down human rights issues etc.
The councils own published policies SHOULD allow this to be put to bed quickly and easily.

[Sparkie1723]

Re: Day in the Life of Sparkie PCN

I want to thank everyone for their views comments and assistance...I now have to decide which is the best way to proceed ,,,,,not necessarily the simplest and easiest....just getting out of this is not of any benefit to anyone else...there is a lot for the Council to put right in the way they issue these notices..a lot of people just pay up when they do not have to if they have the nerve to fight back.

Thanks again for all the food for thought..I know its easy to get out of now.
Will see how I go from here.

Thanks again
Sparkie

[Sparkie1723]

Re: Day in the Life of Sparkie PCN

Council have advised that " On this occasion after reviewing the evidence they have cancelled the PCN Notice issued to Margaret":tinysmile_twink_t2:

Sparkie

[dogtired]

Re: Day in the Life of Sparkie PCN

:clap2:

[meellis]

Re: Day in the Life of Sparkie PCN

One less worry, good for you as you have too many of them at the mo.