Civil Enforcement Judgement

[AYEBEE]

Maureen, who works for me, is in following situation
1 Two years ago she got a ticket of some sort for parking in a Co-op car park. She agrees she overstayed... She says she wrote (not clear now to whom... Co-op, ticket issuer?), said she was a regular customer (which she is), etc. and would not pay...
2 Nothing happened for a long time
3 May 2014 - She gets letter from Civil Enforcement : Notice of Assignment of Debt referring to PCNxxxyyy. "We hereby give you notice.... we have assigned part of the above to Debt Enforcement & Action Limited of 124 Baker Street... Amount assigned was £130 relating to a Parking Charge Notice which was issued in accordance with a contract with The Co-op Group...
Yours faithfully. etc" A very short letter.
[I WONDER WHETHER this relates to overparking 2 years ago, or to a more recent overstay, but she insists she has heard nothing from anyone between the ticket two years ago and this letter.)
Maureen ignored this (which was not in fact so unreasonable as the letter gave no pointers for action.)
4 October 3rd. Maureen receives Judgement for Claimant, "Civil Enforcement Limited" (ergo, NOT the people to whom the £130 was assigned, which was Debt Enforcement & Action Limited). Must pay £130.43 incl interest plus £35 costs = £16543. Asks me what to do.
4a Maureen insists this was the first she had heard from the court and that she never got any kind of claim form from CCMCC about the case.
5 I wrote a letter for Maureen to send to CCMCC asking for judgement to be set aside, giving several grounds including the point above about Civil Enforcement not being Debt Enforcement, the apparent new owner of the debt.
6 Today, Maureen gets acknowledgement from CCMCC of letter with form N244 and asking for set aside fee of £155.
7 I now ring CCMCC as her representative. I say she never got the claim form. They say she must have had "a response pack" as it went to same address as judgement. (Maureen could be fibbing to me but I suspect not.) They say she can write and say she did not get it, but unlikely to affect the judgement.

I suspect this a lost cause, but having seen these 200 pages of Civil Enforcement nonsense, I thought I would make this posting. Any advice welcomed.

[mystery1]

Re: Civil Enforcement Judgement

The rules on setting a judgement aside are http://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/pro...l/rules/part13

It must be done promptly.

Does she still have the letter of assignment ? If yes then somebody is in a world of trouble.

This needs sorting tomorrow. If a judgement isn't paid within 28 days then a CCJ is on file for 6 years. Of course if we get it kicked out it won't matter.

M1

[stevemLS]

Re: Civil Enforcement Judgement

Have a look at CPR Part 13.

The court has a discretion to set aside in these circumstances. However, the defendant must show that they have a "real prospect of successfully defending the claim" or there is some other good reason why the defendant should be allowed to defend the claim.

The court will take into account whether application to set aside has been made "promptly", she is already pushing the boundary on that and has yet to make formal application.

I think Maureen is going to struggle to satisfy that test.

You have to also wonder whether it is worth paying the application fee for a debt of this size.

Others may disagree? I take a pragmatic approach to these matters.

[stevemLS]

Re: Civil Enforcement Judgement

Oh, I meant to say that unless the judgment is paid within 28 days, it will be registered against her and will trash her credit score, that may or may not be important to her.

Again, it is probably too late to pay within that timescale now so that alone may encourage her to apply to set aside, but as I said, I don't rate her prospects.

Sorry.

[mystery1]

Re: Civil Enforcement Judgement

Have a look at CPR Part 13.

The court has a discretion to set aside in these circumstances. However, the defendant must show that they have a "real prospect of successfully defending the claim" or there is some other good reason why the defendant should be allowed to defend the claim.

The court will take into account whether application to set aside has been made "promptly", she is already pushing the boundary on that and has yet to make formal application.

I think Maureen is going to struggle to satisfy that test.

You have to also wonder whether it is worth paying the application fee for a debt of this size.

Others may disagree? I take a pragmatic approach to these matters.

If she has the assignment letter i reckon there will be enough brown stuff flowing that Cel will consent and pay the £50 application fee.

M1

[AYEBEE]

Re: Civil Enforcement Judgement

Hi M1
THx for that but I am not clear on what you mean... Do you suggest Maureen "gives up" and pays up? I have just spoken to her and she is absolutely insistent that the claim never arrived at her house. May I assume that it is pointless to argue this to CCMCC? Paying £155 for a set aside application that may not succeed does not seem sensible.

What I find hard to understand is that DE and DEAL can enforce a 2 year old ticket that they have taken no action over in the meantime... I see that there are many examples of this on LB currently.

[mystery1]

Re: Civil Enforcement Judgement

If she has the letter then it's proof that the claim and the statement of truth that it contains is in fact not true. That is very significant i think.

M1

[AYEBEE]

Re: Civil Enforcement Judgement

Hi again M1
Again not quite grasping your message. Are you saying that if the debt was assigned to DEAL but the Claimant is CE, then the judgement is somehow defective?
But even if that is the case, was not the time to take that up when the claim was issued? (but it was not taken up because the claim never arrived).
And is there any way around the fact that the the cost of getting this argument considered now is £155 (the application for set aside fee).
We DO have the assignment of debt letter from CEL, which I sent to the court making the CE/DEAL point. But it just seems they will not consider anything without payment of that £155.
AB

[Amethyst]

Re: Civil Enforcement Judgement

If CEL had assigned the Debt to DEAL then CEL no longer own it and have no right to bring action against you.

The set aside can be applied for without a hearing at £50 if you speak with CEL and get them to agree with setting aside the Judgment first. Otherwise if financial circumstances are restrictive there might be a fee remission available - check out form EX160 http://hmctsformfinder.justice.gov.u..._forms_id=4396

[mystery1]

Re: Civil Enforcement Judgement

It doesn't negate the judgement. What it does do is bring the statement of truth at the bottom of the particulars of claim in to question. The person who signed it has landed themselves in very hot water because they essentially said Maureen owed CEL and should have been in the knowledge that this was incorrect.

http://www.out-law.com/topics/disput...ents-of-truth/


I would use this to persuade CEL to consent to a vacation of the default judgement and hopefully dismissal of the claim.


I take it "We DO have the assignment of debt letter from CEL, which I sent to the court making the CE/DEAL point" you sent a copy and not the original ?


Are you saying that if the debt was assigned to DEAL but the Claimant is CE, then the judgement is somehow defective?

Yes but not in a way that the default should not have been awarded by the courts as they didn't know CEL didn't own the debt (ignoring the legitimacy of the debt in an case)


But even if that is the case, was not the time to take that up when the claim was issued?

Yes but you can only play the hand you're dealt.


And is there any way around the fact that the the cost of getting this argument considered now is £155 (the application for set aside fee).

If you can bully them using their deceit and the incorrect statement of truth they may consent which is £50 and if they see sense they even pay to get rid of you.


But it just seems they will not consider anything

Courts rarely correspond by letter. Applications which sadly do cost.

M1

[AYEBEE]

Re: Civil Enforcement Judgement

If CEL had assigned the Debt to DEAL then CEL no longer own it and have no right to bring action against you.

The set aside can be applied for without a hearing at £50 if you speak with CEL and get them to agree with setting aside the Judgment first. Otherwise if financial circumstances are restrictive there might be a fee remission available - check out form EX160 http://hmctsformfinder.justice.gov.u..._forms_id=4396

Thankyou Amethyst. I will put this together with M1's further advice. Presently, I cannot conceive that CE will offer the slightest co-operation, but we shall see. Perhaps I should my draft letter to your site, which I must say exceeds my wildest expectations for free advice via the internet. (I looked at EX160 earlier - sadly does not apply.)

[AYEBEE]

Re: Civil Enforcement Judgement

Hello all
Will this do it?
Ab

Draft letter to CE

Dear sirs
PCN xxxxxxx
I received a judgement from the court in your favour instructing me to pay £165.
I did not receive the claim. The CCMCC says they posted it and I must have received it. But I did not. I have taken this up with the court.
HOWEVER, I have noticed that the judgement is in favour of Civil Enforcement Limited. This appears contrary to a letter you sent me in May, which I still have, advising me that the original debt had been assigned to Debt Enforcement & Action Limited.
I therefore deduce that the claim on which the judgement is based must be false, since Civil Enforcement no longer owned the debt.
I understand that the court would take a serious view of this matter, which I shall point out to them unless I hear from you within 14 days.
What I would like you to do is to write to the court, with a copy to me, seeking a vacation of the default judgement.
If I do not hear from you, I shall write to the court in these terms. If necessary, I will follow up with contempt of court proceedings.
Yours faithfully
Maureen M

[mystery1]

Re: Civil Enforcement Judgement

Hello all
Will this do it?
Ab

Draft letter to CE

Dear sirs
PCN xxxxxxx
I received a judgement from the court in your favour instructing me to pay £165.
I did not receive the claim. The CCMCC says they posted it and I must have received it. But I did not. I have taken this up with the court.
HOWEVER, I have noticed that the judgement is in favour of Civil Enforcement Limited. This appears contrary to a letter you sent me in May, which I still have, advising me that the original debt had been assigned to Debt Enforcement & Action Limited.
I therefore deduce that the claim on which the judgement is based must be false, since Civil Enforcement no longer owned the debt.
I understand that the court would take a serious view of this matter, which I shall point out to them unless I hear from you within 14 days.
What I would like you to do is to write to the court, with a copy to me, seeking a vacation of the default judgement.
If I do not hear from you, I shall write to the court in these terms. If necessary, I will follow up with contempt of court proceedings.
Yours faithfully
Maureen M

To put it simply, you do not have time for anything but a phone call. If we do not decide what is happening TODAY then Maureen is putting herself in a very uncomfortable position. She will get a ccj on her credit record and although it should be removed if the judgement is set aside these things take time and do not always go as simply as they should.

https://www.ce-service.co.uk/contact-us.html

0115 822 5020

If that doesn't work try the number as listed on a claim form http://www.legalbeagles.info/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=8745&d=1366232422


I would ask the to draw up a consent order to vacate the default judgement and ask them to pay. If they do not you will not only apply to have the judgement set aside but you will report Ashley Cohen, or whoever signed the claim form, with a view to having them charged with contempt of court as they have signed a statement of truth without an honest belief in it's truth. CEL do not own the entire debt for which they sued, and must have known this as it was they who assigned it. Their claim is based on an untruth. This is a very serious matter for which the penalties can be, and probably will be if convicted, jail time.



M1

[AYEBEE]

Re: Civil Enforcement Judgement

"I would ask the to draw up a consent order "


M1
You mean ask CE?

[mystery1]

Re: Civil Enforcement Judgement

Yes. I meant "them"

M1