Harassment by landlord

[worried_sick]

Hi, I'm hoping to get some advice. I'll try to keep the email as short as possible.


I entered a 6 month AST in November last year paying a months rent as deposit and months rent in advance. I've been regularly late with the rent payments and fell into arrears.


I missed the rent payment in the middle of February and was unable to pay it at the end of February when I got paid. I had contact with the landlord on 2 March and told them making any sort of payment would be a problem - I also told them I had health problems meaning I had been off work in February and was off for some time last year which meant I was on lower pay when on sick (all true).


On 3 March the landlord served me with s8 and s21 notices both with an end date of 13 May (the last day of the 6 months). Just before giving me the notices they gave me the prescribed information from the deposit as they hadn't given me that before (I asked about it on 2 March).


After looking this up, I find they only protected the deposit on 2 March (I've checked all the schemes to check it wasn't protected elsewhere or under a slightly different name etc.). I contacted the landlord on 13 March explaining this, and they were full of excuses. After a few text messages they phoned me. I was trying to get them to pay back the deposit and agree on some compensation for not protecting in time which I would set-off against the rent arrears.


I should mention the landlord works for a small estate agency, although most of this has been done outside the agency. However, the receipts they gave me for the deposit/rent were on estate agent headed paper and the deposit was protected through the estate agents account (I also found out recently when contacting the water company has the estate agent listed as 'the agent').


On 14 March the landlords father attended the property, banging and yelling at the windows. I went out to talk to him and he physically attacked me, threatened to 'come back' and put me out, and threatened to kill me and my mother who was at the property at the time. I threw him out and the police were called. Unfortunately I went 'beyond the bounds of defending myself' and we both received cautions.


On 16th March the landlord served another s8 notice (delivered by hand) with an expiry date of 31 March. They stated grounds 8, 10, 11 and 17.


On 23rd March they hand delivered another letter stating they would be coming to collect keys on 31 March as that's when the s8 expires. I've explained to them that's not how it works. I've also got them to agree, in writing (email) to an early surrender on 4th April which is when I can leave by. However, they are insisting on attending on 31 March - I've told them I will not be allowing entry and will be phoning the police if they attend.


I have not made any rent payment since this started going sour - needing to move out I needed money for that.


I'm only leaving so soon as I don't feel safe in the property. I mentioned health problems - these are mental health based and have been classified as a disability (landlord is not aware of this). I also have problems with anxiety and they have been much much worse since this incident. Moving so quickly has obviously incurred costs and I'm moving into a place more expensive than I would have liked, but it was available at really short notice.


A couple of other things to mention - the landlord has mentioned contacting my employer several times as they aren't happy with the reference as I was on lower pay for a period last year. I've seen exactly what they've asked for in the reference and the response and the only thing they mention is 'salary' which is provided. Also, whenever I've been late with the rent, even on the day the rent is due, the landlord would text me around 8am in the morning saying they can't pay their bills and can't support their daughter because I haven't paid rent.


Sorry that's so long, questions


1. Is the estate agency involved/implicated in this at all? They are not included in the contract at all but this person works for them and has used them for parts of it.


2. What do I do on Tuesday?! Can I try to get the police involved before to stop them trying to attend the property?


3. After I've left the property, what legal action can I take regarding the deposit, harassment and attempted illegal eviction? I don't want to do this but I think the behaviour has been really bad. I don't think I should be liable for any rent following 14th March as I haven't felt safe here due to their actions. What I want is to come to a settlement agreement with them setting off the 2 months rent I owed up to 13th March against compensation for the deposit and harassment (which I expect would result in them paying something to me).


4. If I am forced to take legal action, is it right that I report them to the Tenancy Officer at the local authority? Do I report the estate agent to the Property Ombudsman (I've checked they are a member)?


5. If I do mention the deposit and harassment I'm expecting them to react the same way as they did before. How do I protect myself? I'm not giving them a forwarding address...is that ok?


Please, any advice you have would be very very much appreciated.


Thanks

[Crazy council]

Re: Harassment by landlord

hi. I would need to see the paperwork first but, the 14 day notice is a notice that can take u to court after that date. Your ll can enter your property on that date for certan reasons, but that deos not meen he can throw u out. A court would have to evict u. Send a recorded deluver letter to the agents. Telling them the date u will be out willingly by. He does have the right to persue your for the arears. Be nice to your ll and make sure its clean and clear. Lls tend to be a lot more reasonable about arears if the property is clean and ready to relet

[worried_sick]

Re: Harassment by landlord

Hi, thanks. What grounds can they enter on that date? Can I refuse on safety grounds? I can't see any valid reason they need to come in on that date when we've agreed an early surrender 4 days later - I've agreed to do check out and give keys on that date.

[Crazy council]

Re: Harassment by landlord

He can enter to inspect as long as he has given u 3 days notice. unless he has a high court warrent. He can not evict u at tjis stage. But be reasonable with him. He is probebly not lieying about needing the rent to pay his own bills.

[worried_sick]

Re: Harassment by landlord

OK thanks. They haven't mentioned inspecting the property, they just said "As a Section 8 notice has been served on you we will still be following the legal procedure required and will therefore attend the property on 31st March". I don't think I'm being unreasonable as 2 weeks ago I was physically attacked by 'an agent acting on their behalf' who said they were going to put me out and were going to kill both myself and my mother.

[Crazy council]

Re: Harassment by landlord

mmmmm Tricky area.

The landlord/agent or appointed person, can inspect to check the property, and because you have given notice, show others around by agreement with you. They are expected to be reasonable with you, and you with them. They have to do it within reasonable hours, and be respectfull.

The LL probably just wants to make sure there is no damage

[dan_1207]

Re: Harassment by landlord

In answer to your numbered questions:

1. It is unlikely that the agency will hold responsibility.

2. You cannot be evicted without the court's say-so. Stay put, refuse entry, and if you feel uncomfortable at any point, call the police.

3. On the face of it, you have a claim against your landlord, but we would need a lot more details and evidence in connection with the deposit details, and the harassment. You may have a claim for damages.

4. You are under no obligation to report them. The action can be commenced by you following notice to your LL of your intention.

5. You are under no legal obligation to give a forwarding address.

[Crazy council]

Re: Harassment by landlord

Hi dan can i just ask you about 2 of these answers

2. .............. Stay put, refuse entry, and if you feel uncomfortable at any point, call the police.

Isnt the landlord/agent allowed to enter, and use a locksmith if needed, as long as they give the tenant, 3 days clear written notice of them requiring entry. Especially, after the first 5 months, if any damage has been suggested.

Can the police stop a LL entering a property if he has all the paperwork with him ( i know they likely would, but am not sure they can )

3. On the face of it, you have a claim against your landlord, but we would need a lot more details and evidence in connection with the deposit details, and the harassment. You may have a claim for damages.

I though claiming harassment against a LLor agent was quite specific, and quite hard for a TT to claim unless its on top of a claim of illegal eviction

Chasing up rent arrear, is not harassment, as long as its done in reasonable times of the day.
Inspecting the property, for repairs or maintenance, is not harassment as long as its done with notice and not 2 often

Am asking [MENTION=62240]dan_1207[/MENTION] because i occasionally work in that field, sorting out incidences like this, but my last formal legal training on property law was back in 2001/2

[worried_sick]

Re: Harassment by landlord

Thanks both for the replies.

Crazy council, surely chasing rent arrears by physical violence (thankfully I'm twice his size so it didn't amount to much), threats of illegal eviction and threats of death would count as harassment?

I haven't been given notice of inspection for repairs or maintenance - all they've stated is that it's for final inspection and to surrender keys as that's the date the s8 expires. I've advised I won't be allowing entry but I'm happy to meet on the date I'm leaving but haven't received a response.

I spoke to the police community support officer who just said phone the police if they get violent (again) :tinysmile_aha_t:

[MissFM]

Re: Harassment by landlord

Thanks both for the replies.

Crazy council, surely chasing rent arrears by physical violence (thankfully I'm twice his size so it didn't amount to much), threats of illegal eviction and threats of death would count as harassment?

I haven't been given notice of inspection for repairs or maintenance - all they've stated is that it's for final inspection and to surrender keys as that's the date the s8 expires. I've advised I won't be allowing entry but I'm happy to meet on the date I'm leaving but haven't received a response.

I spoke to the police community support officer who just said phone the police if they get violent (again) :tinysmile_aha_t:

Making a death threat is a criminal offence punishable, I believe, by up to 10 years in gaol. Do you have any witnesses or other evidence that this happened?

In your shoes I would certainly report the threats (officially) to the police and get a crime number.

[Crazy council]

Re: Harassment by landlord

hi

Crazy council, surely chasing rent arrears by physical violence (thankfully I'm twice his size so it didn't amount to much), threats of illegal eviction and threats of death would count as harassment?

it would be harassment, but you would have to prove it, Illegal eviction and threats of illegal eviction definitely ARE harrassment by the LL, but, they can not be used in defence at court unless they are proven first, the only timje i have seen this ( harrasment ) considered, was after an illegal eviction by the LL

I haven't been given notice of inspection for repairs or maintenance - all they've stated is that it's for final inspection and to surrender keys as that's the date the s8 expires.

Has he said that in writing, as its rubbish, only a court can evict you, ( but it can be done fast through high court ) and you get formal notice of the action. They dont have to give you a reason for the inspection, if its only one every six months or so.

Make sure you did the letter to the agents, as suggested earlier, ring them today, to make sure they have it and have read it, ( that will probably stop the LL tomorrow , but not definitely )

I have to be open and honest here, I , on occasion, act for both landlords and agents in sticky situations, that why i asked @dan_1207 for him to clear up, as he is a trainee solicitor. The advise i give you is baised on my learnings from a very long time ago, and my experience through the courts over the past 10 years with tenants ( and twice landlords ).

I only get asked to get involved when things get really sticky, so claims of harassment are not unusually, so are attempts to block me entering the property, infarct, setting the dogs or throwing stuffs not that unusual.

[worried_sick]

Re: Harassment by landlord

Thanks again both for the responses.

I agree proof is difficult - the only witness was my mother who was also threatened. I'm not sure if it was genuine or just air, but I know it's been difficult living alone in the property since then. It's also certainly the reason I'm moving out so quickly.

As I hope I mentioned in the original post, the police were involved. Unfortunately, again I had no witnesses and they considered I went too far in defending myself.

I don't really want to do anything until I move out - in case they go crazy again!! What I have in writing is "...vacate the above named property on 31st March 2015, as the Section 8 notice served on Monday 16th March 2015. We will attend the property at [time] 31st March 2015 to conduct your final inspection and take receipt of all keys to the property." After that I agreed with them an early surrender on 4th April and the following letter they sent states "As a Section 8 notice has been served on you we will still be following the legal procedure required and will therefore attend the property on 31 March 2015 as per our letter ..."

[Crazy council]

Re: Harassment by landlord

Hi, the notice is balls, your under no obligation to leave on that date, if you read the notice carfully , thankfully most tenants dont ) , its just a notice of court action to apply for the eviction.

But, hes just trying to hurry you up,

Right, i dont knwo your LL or curcs, but let me explain what on occasion i do get to see in these situations.

All the tenant gets to see is the Landlord going mad about the rent.

Whereas, a lot of the time, i get to see landlords with the heads in there hands, trying to recover from debts or missed bills situations, usually balancing massive mortgages that they will not see profit from in 15 years, The stress on teh landlord can be a lot, thats why sometime ( like in your case ) they go to far and blow there top,

So, am not saying in any way your LL is in the right, but, please consider that your LLs probably trying to deal with a finacial situation himself, and whats you replaced with a paying tenant ASAP.

I am dealing with exactly this situation at the moment for a LL, lots of arguing before we got involved, threats and everything. Sometime it takes both side to sit back and consider the other person as well.

I do hope your issuse get sorted, these can be nightmare situations to sort out, i posted what i have above just so you can see there maybe a side to this, your not looking at.

[worried_sick]

Re: Harassment by landlord

Yes, I understand what the notice means - my problem is I wonder if they do.

I appreciate the rest of your post as well.

[MissFM]

Re: Harassment by landlord

Sorry - misunderstood!

If you haven't already looked at the Shelter site then please do, as it has very clear info on both the required procedures for eviction and the time scales. (Even if all the correct procedures are followed it can take several months, from experience - more if rules are broken)

http://england.shelter.org.uk/get_ad...rivate_tenants/eviction_of_assured_shorthold_tenants

As for your deposit, see here: http://england.shelter.org.uk/get_ad..._deposit_rules

As stated above, the LL has to get a court order to formally evict you , and needs to use Bailiffs to do this. He is not allowed to strong-arm you himself, at least not by law.