Employment tribunal - settlement offer & withdrawal of claim

[General Welldone]

Dear All

I posted recently about my forthcoming hearing and hope somebody will indulge my confusion a second time.

I shan't go into the details of the affair, but to say my case has been merged with that of a former colleague. For various reasons, largely personal, my mind is close to made up that I shall shortly withdraw my claim. My erstwhile colleague, however, is determined to go to tribunal in May. I've told her of my intention and she has asked if I will at least not withdraw until the day before the tribunal or, better still, the morning of. Needless to say she is considering the probability of a last-minute settlement. My plan up until she understandably asked (begged) me to not withdraw was to leave it until, at the latest, the witness statements gave me a better idea of things. Guilt & loyalty then veered me toward the united front she wanted to present until the last minute, but I am concerned that withdrawing on the morning of the hearing might lead the respondent to pursue costs (I was advised on here that a week before wouldn't be a problem, but did not ask about the same day as the hearing).

To further complicate matters, the respondent's solicitor offered a (small) sum to settle a few days ago. They claim it is to avoid ongoing costs, which might well be true, but could equally be a standard ploy, as I'm sure is the 'final offer, you must accept by 5pm tomorrow' part (truly, 5pm 1st March, at which point they assure me the offer will be withdrawn and no further offers made).

Any advice gratefully received. Much as I simply wish to be free of it all, I would like to support my co-claimant, just not at the risk of incurring a cost order should I withdraw on the day. Whether there's any substance to her suspicion that my withdrawal would weaken her claim, it would likely weaken her resolve.

Thanks in advance.

[MissFM]

Re: Employment tribunal - settlement offer & withdrawal of claim

Not in any way a legally informed opinion GW - but, in case it's of any help, my quite considerable experience of sticking my neck out to support a friend against my own judgement and intuition is that my head gets chopped off.

[Eloise01]

Re: Employment tribunal - settlement offer & withdrawal of claim

I am afraid that I really did cover it all in the thread you started last week. I don't know what else to add. It is unlikely that you would get a costs order against you, but nobody can promise you that. And it certainly is possible that a new offer could be made right up to the point you walk into a tribunal. Is withdrawing on the day going to make a difference - nobody can tell you. In the end, decisions on costs are determined by the tribunal and based on the employers arguments in favour of them. Nobody can account for those matters in advance. If they have made a final offer now, then there is a chance it will get better. But that also isn't guaranteed.

You have to decide.

[FlamingParrot]

Re: Employment tribunal - settlement offer & withdrawal of claim

Not in any way a legally informed opinion GW - but, in case it's of any help, my quite considerable experience of sticking my neck out to support a friend against my own judgement and intuition is that my head gets chopped off.

I've had the opposite experience, like people being sacked for being my friends, even when they shouldn't have been involved in the issues against me.

I am afraid that I really did cover it all in the thread you started last week. I don't know what else to add. It is unlikely that you would get a costs order against you, but nobody can promise you that. And it certainly is possible that a new offer could be made right up to the point you walk into a tribunal. Is withdrawing on the day going to make a difference - nobody can tell you. In the end, decisions on costs are determined by the tribunal and based on the employers arguments in favour of them. Nobody can account for those matters in advance. If they have made a final offer now, then there is a chance it will get better. But that also isn't guaranteed.

You have to decide.

We had a brief discussion about that yesterday, on this other thread -> http://www.legalbeagles.info/forums/...176#post321176

[Nikolai]

Re: Employment tribunal - settlement offer & withdrawal of claim

In any litigation you should look to your own interests and do what is right for you. Let others look after themselves, especially where there may be a potential conflict of interests. Sorry if this sounds overly formal or pompous - I don't intend that - it's just advice I've picked up over the years which has served well.

[alham]

Re: Employment tribunal - settlement offer & withdrawal of claim

My understanding of employment tribunals is that they do not award costs in general - the whole point is that, in general, no legal representation is assumed. Obviously, majority of cases are legally represented but no one can assume that fees will be paid by the losing party.

[Eloise01]

Re: Employment tribunal - settlement offer & withdrawal of claim

My understanding of employment tribunals is that they do not award costs in general - the whole point is that, in general, no legal representation is assumed. Obviously, majority of cases are legally represented but no one can assume that fees will be paid by the losing party.

That is generally true yes. But there has been something of a trend towards some costs being awarded - although still very, very rarely. The problem with pushing a decision to the wire is what the tribunal will make of that as a tactic. Settling on the day is rather more common than people think - but if you don't, the case proceeds, and win or lose, the case is there and made. Withdrawing on the day is slightly different. That's the wild card...

[Inca]

Re: Employment tribunal - settlement offer & withdrawal of claim

I'm afraid,,in this 'dog eat dog' world..it's every (wo)man for themselves,I wouldn't sacrifice myself for colleagues,,let them fight their own battles,,look after Number 1.

[FlamingParrot]

Re: Employment tribunal - settlement offer & withdrawal of claim

My understanding of employment tribunals is that they do not award costs in general - the whole point is that, in general, no legal representation is assumed. Obviously, majority of cases are legally represented but no one can assume that fees will be paid by the losing party.

That's not what I was told, I was warned about the possibility of costs against me if it was considered that my case didn't have enough merit. The other side hired a Magic Circle law firm that charged Ł500+/hr!! :wof: :wof: :wof:

That is generally true yes. But there has been something of a trend towards some costs being awarded - although still very, very rarely. The problem with pushing a decision to the wire is what the tribunal will make of that as a tactic. Settling on the day is rather more common than people think - but if you don't, the case proceeds, and win or lose, the case is there and made. Withdrawing on the day is slightly different. That's the wild card...

My case was put forward in 2003 and I was warned about them.

I'm afraid,,in this 'dog eat dog' world..it's every (wo)man for themselves,I wouldn't sacrifice myself for colleagues,,let them fight their own battles,,look after Number 1.

It was my colleague and a friend who worked for another company who got the sack because of me, not that I wanted that to happen, they were 'guilty by association' :embarassed: but I couldn't do anything for them. My colleague was a 'temp' using an umbrella company, who had been there 4 years.

The other guy and I exchanged emails and IT hacked into them. What's with me and electronic communications, much more recently a forum admin hacked into my private messages :mad2: and there was also a second victim. :embarassed: I shall stick to smoke signals and carrier pigeons from now on! :lol:

[Eloise01]

Re: Employment tribunal - settlement offer & withdrawal of claim

In 2011/12 over 186,000 tribunal claims were lodged. 1,411 cases resulted in costs awards - a very steep rise from the previous averages of about 400. But still a drop in the ocean. The fact is that ten years ago, the chances of costs was negligible, and still is. Certainly they would never have been awarded on the basis of "insufficient merit" - it would have required a view that the claim was vexatious and litigatious. In other words, entirely without merit and OBVIOUSLY without merit.

In the OPs case the wild card is that the OP isn't ready to present a case and that is the reason for withdrawal. It is POSSIBLE that telling a tribunal that will be seen as vexatious.

[General Welldone]

Re: Employment tribunal - settlement offer & withdrawal of claim

Thank you all for your replies, even if the milk of human kindness runs curdled and rank through some of you. I should add that I am ready to present a case, with only a final agreement on the bundle and exchange of witness statements to organise, but would simply rather not.

Eloise, you mention telling the tribunal the reason for the withdrawal. Formal guidance from the ET office is thin and poor, but I see no indication that a reason is to be given, merely that the judge is to be notified of the decision to withdraw. What would be considered a fair reason to withdraw at a late stage, bar a health emergency or somesuch?

I'm leaning toward withdrawing a day or two before the hearing, cognisant that they will not settle until the day of the hearing if past behaviour is any indication (as I've said, and as they probably planned, I'm past caring). Unless the respondent wishes to settle with my former colleague, the tribunal will still go ahead, with the costs they have incurred not being unwarranted as they have prepared much the same case against the pair of us. I should add that the respondent has made no suggestion thus far that they will be seeking costs. In fact, their barrister has been a model of fairness and decency, which is more than can be said for the shocking service the ET office provides (apologies for the gripe, but what began as mere incompetence has become a travesty).

[Eloise01]

Re: Employment tribunal - settlement offer & withdrawal of claim

Sorry - I understood from the questions you posed in your earlier thread that you were not prepared to present a case. If you are able to present a case, no matter how strong that case is, then you should proceed with the tribunal. As I told you before, you have nothing to lose. It makes no logical sense not to proceed. The risk to costs is in the timing of the withdrawal - if you do not withdraw then there is no risk! And potentially something to gain. You may be past caring now, but even a small settlement might buy something you would like - perhaps small compensation, but you have got this far and there's little sense in not seeing it through. But if you decide not to proceed, then cut your losses and do so now. You do not have to give a reason now - but if you leave it, as your colleague wants, to the morning or the day before, the only way of communicating this to the tribunal is to attend and if the judges want an explanation of why you got to the door (literally) and didn't go ahead, they may, to put it bluntly, be more than a little ****ed off at you!

If you are able to proceed with presenting a case, I would strongly advise that you do not withdraw. You may yet get a little holiday or even just a nice weekend away out of this. Cold feet is common. That's not a reason to back out.

In fairness - the ET Office is the administrative vehicle of the Employment Tribunal and nothing more - it is not there to provide you with guidance or advice. You are expected to know or learn process and procedure for yourself unless you have a lawyer who knows these things.

[General Welldone]

Re: Employment tribunal - settlement offer & withdrawal of claim

Sorry - I understood from the questions you posed in your earlier thread that you were not prepared to present a case. If you are able to present a case, no matter how strong that case is, then you should proceed with the tribunal. As I told you before, you have nothing to lose. It makes no logical sense not to proceed. The risk to costs is in the timing of the withdrawal - if you do not withdraw then there is no risk! And potentially something to gain. You may be past caring now, but even a small settlement might buy something you would like - perhaps small compensation, but you have got this far and there's little sense in not seeing it through. But if you decide not to proceed, then cut your losses and do so now. You do not have to give a reason now - but if you leave it, as your colleague wants, to the morning or the day before, the only way of communicating this to the tribunal is to attend and if the judges want an explanation of why you got to the door (literally) and didn't go ahead, they may, to put it bluntly, be more than a little ****ed off at you!

If you are able to proceed with presenting a case, I would strongly advise that you do not withdraw. You may yet get a little holiday or even just a nice weekend away out of this. Cold feet is common. That's not a reason to back out.

In fairness - the ET Office is the administrative vehicle of the Employment Tribunal and nothing more - it is not there to provide you with guidance or advice. You are expected to know or learn process and procedure for yourself unless you have a lawyer who knows these things.

Thank you, truly. I'll take this on board.

I understand perfectly the purview of the ET office (the literature is out there) and have not sought any guidance from them. What my particular office has proven incapable of doing, time and again, is handling straightforward administrative matters and responding to enquiries relating to the business of the case (case orders, confirmation of postponement three weeks after the original date of the hearing had gone), rather than its content. I have found the general enquiries line far more useful than the regional office. I dare say this is owing to cuts to the system, but whatever the reason, the fact is the office with which I deal has caused much needless aggravation to all parties, such that even the respondent's barrister dropped the facade of respectability and told them a number of times how unacceptable she finds their incompetence. A quick google search suggests I'm far from alone in feeling this way, though I suppose the complaint is one for an MP. Perhaps there are regional differences and strains peculiar to certain areas, but it looks to be a system unfit for purpose, as I imagine you know.

[Eloise01]

Re: Employment tribunal - settlement offer & withdrawal of claim

To be honest, this is fairly rare for a tribunal office and something I have seldom come across. And judging by the barristers reaction, something they have seldom come across either, because one tends not to get annoyed by the commonplace. However, it is true that the system is currently bursting at the seams due to a massive increase in the number of claims - that will no doubt be resolved in the summer when charges to make a claim are introduced and people can't afford to make claims