Can you please advise on the best course of action?

[echat11]

'Thames Water couldn't give me any information (as they had sold the debt)'

Write back to Thames Water, tell them if they don't provide the requested information, then you will lodge a complaint with the ICO.
Make sure you get Proof of Postage.

They sold the debt is not a good reason for not providing the requested information.

[apsr90]

'Thames Water couldn't give me any information (as they had sold the debt)'

Write back to Thames Water, tell them if they don't provide the requested information, then you will lodge a complaint with the ICO.
Make sure you get Proof of Postage.

They sold the debt is not a good reason for not providing the requested information.

They provided quite a bit of information, but mostly about my current property. On the property in question, they just had the address, the debt amount, and the date of the default, which was 6 months after I had moved out of the property.

So to summarise:

* TW data shows date of default 6 months after I had moved out. Based on what the solicitor said they also likely overcharged 37.5% of the total amount. To confuse me even futher, TW in their SAR info had the period as 'Settled' in one row before being in debt and defaulted in another row.
* Tthe credit rating information for that property shows me as being billed until 2021 (I don't know why)
* The bill was based on the wrong methodology (unmetered vs. metered).

All of this is on top of not having recieved any information from the current Claimant of their Solicitor (terms of agreement, default notice etc.). What is the likely outcome when the court is presented with these?

[echat11]

They provided quite a bit of information, but mostly about my current property. On the property in question, they just had the address, the debt amount, and the date of the default, which was 6 months after I had moved out of the property.

So to summarise:

* TW data shows date of default 6 months after I had moved out. Based on what the solicitor said they also likely overcharged 37.5% of the total amount. To confuse me even futher, TW in their SAR info had the period as 'Settled' in one row before being in debt and defaulted in another row.
* Tthe credit rating information for that property shows me as being billed until 2021 (I don't know why)
* The bill was based on the wrong methodology (unmetered vs. metered).

All of this is on top of not having recieved any information from the current Claimant of their Solicitor (terms of agreement, default notice etc.). What is the likely outcome when the court is presented with these?

It's all in the laps of the Courts / Judges. But what will help is 'nailing' the evidence down, use a spreadsheet, length of time at property, then underneath, charges for the periods metered, under that the method they used.

[PallasAthena]

...apart from the fact that it was billed based on the Ratable Value of the Property (unmetered) when the property was in fact metered (I have photos of the meter).

Just for information on that point, it is is possible for TW to have installed a meter but for the bill still to be based on Rateable Value. That's the position for my house which is in the TW area.

I've been here many years and my water has been billed on RV ever since I moved in, and still is. But 10-15 years ago TW installed meters in the pavement on the supply to every house in my area, irrespective of how the water supply is currently being billed. I understand that's because TW ultimately want everyone on a meter and it's cheaper/easier to install meters for every property at the same time even if they haven't turned them on for billing. So I have a meter but it isn't used for billing.

I mention this only so that you don't rely on the meter issue too much in your response to TW.

[echat11]

Just for information on that point, it is is possible for TW to have installed a meter but for the bill still to be based on Rateable Value. That's the position for my house which is in the TW area.

I've been here many years and my water has been billed on RV ever since I moved in, and still is. But 10-15 years ago TW installed meters in the pavement on the supply to every house in my area, irrespective of how the water supply is currently being billed. I understand that's because TW ultimately want everyone on a meter and it's cheaper/easier to install meters for every property at the same time even if they haven't turned them on for billing. So I have a meter but it isn't used for billing.

I mention this only so that you don't rely on the meter issue too much in your response to TW.

We've got a meter to, they want everyone to be metered, they send comparison billing to show usage.
The fact that they have no competition means they can do what they like with customers, we are all at their mercy. The bill will say how they are charging, but so far the OP is getting little info, when they should be providing everything they have.

[apsr90]

Just for information on that point, it is is possible for TW to have installed a meter but for the bill still to be based on Rateable Value. That's the position for my house which is in the TW area.

I've been here many years and my water has been billed on RV ever since I moved in, and still is. But 10-15 years ago TW installed meters in the pavement on the supply to every house in my area, irrespective of how the water supply is currently being billed. I understand that's because TW ultimately want everyone on a meter and it's cheaper/easier to install meters for every property at the same time even if they haven't turned them on for billing. So I have a meter but it isn't used for billing.

I mention this only so that you don't rely on the meter issue too much in your response to TW.

Thank you for your response on this. I can see that being the case in some instances, but I distinctly remember taking a photo of the meter (and its reading) and providing this info to TW when I moved out. The problem is that through their SAR and the conversation I had with TW on the phone, they have no record of this. Now, I'm not sure how this is my problem considering they have a) overcharged me for a period when I wasn't at the property and b) they have billed me based on a methodology which is not based on actual usage of water, for which I provided them with information when I moved out. There is zero info on the billing on the property in question, just two rows, one where debt has been 'settled' and another when the date of default took place and the total amount. To add more confusion to this, the current claimant is not even TW but some other company that bought the debt. I sent them a SAR but I have not recieved anything as of yet.

[apsr90]

Hi again,

So I filed the defence on the 1st of July and on Money Claim it said it was "recieved" on the 3rd of July. I did not hear back until today. The solicitor sent me a letter dated the 25th of August asking for proof of what I have sent/claimed in my defence and to settle this 'amicably before a deadline in September'. My question is, don't they have 28 days/1 month to reply back to my defence and potentially initate court proceedings? Isn't this now outside of the window for them to continue chasing me?

P.S jsut found out that the "case stay was lifted" and a "DQ was sent to you" yesterday. I guess the follow up question is, do I have to respond to their forms? I was under the impression that anything had to be done through the courts.

Also, any chance I can ask for this case to be struck out due to everything from the claimant being sent or submitted outside of the time period stated?

[Pezza54]

The DQ the solicitor has sent you is probably the claimant's completed DQ. You need to download your own DQ, complete it, file it with the court and send a copy to the claimant's solicitor.
The claimant does not have to write a reply to defence, so there is no time limit on this document. If the claimant decides to draft a reply it is normally filed and served on the defendant with their DQ.
At present the court is taking over 40 working days to process DQs. so don't expect to hear back soon.
I don't think you would succeed in getting the claim struck out.
The next step will be your witness statement, plenty of time for that.

[apsr90]

The DQ the solicitor has sent you is probably the claimant's completed DQ. You need to download your own DQ, complete it, file it with the court and send a copy to the claimant's solicitor.
The claimant does not have to write a reply to defence, so there is no time limit on this document. If the claimant decides to draft a reply it is normally filed and served on the defendant with their DQ.
At present the court is taking over 40 working days to process DQs. so don't expect to hear back soon.
I don't think you would succeed in getting the claim struck out.
The next step will be your witness statement, plenty of time for that.

Thank you for your response. Even though the Money Claim website says DQ sent, I haven't actually recieved this yet (might be in the post, I don't know). The solicitor has just sent me a letter replying to some of the points from my defence, asking to submit proof within 5 days and then for their client to decide what to do. And another deadline of settling this amicably within 15 days. Realistically, should I even reply to their letter with evidence I have? I feel like the evidence is not really for them. They should be the ones to provide evidence of how the claimaint arrived at this bill. In their letter they even state erroneously that the bill was derived from a meter when I know for a fact from the original claimaint/provider that it was not.

I don't see any deadlines from the court or any information with regards to what the next steps are and how to reply to this. There are no options in the Money Claim website to do anything like upload files. I assume because no court hearing has been set yet.

[Pezza54]

I never received a blank DQ from the court. Just a direction to download N180, complete it, and file it with the court by a stipulated date.

It sounds as if the claimant is getting cold feet and wants to see what evidence you have before making a decision whether to proceed.

The solicitor is using bully boy tactics by trying to set you deadlines to reply.

You say the evidence isn't for them. The claimant will see your evidence not less than 14 days before the hearing date. This will still give them time to draft questions about your defence, witness statement and evidence which they will have an opportunity to put to you at the hearing.

If you think your evidence is strong and may lead to the claimant dropping the claim, I can't see why you shouldn't send it.

Other forum members may disagree.

[apsr90]

I never received a blank DQ from the court. Just a direction to download N180, complete it, and file it with the court by a stipulated date.

It sounds as if the claimant is getting cold feet and wants to see what evidence you have before making a decision whether to proceed.

The solicitor is using bully boy tactics by trying to set you deadlines to reply.

You say the evidence isn't for them. The claimant will see your evidence not less than 14 days before the hearing date. This will still give them time to draft questions about your defence, witness statement and evidence which they will have an opportunity to put to you at the hearing.

If you think your evidence is strong and may lead to the claimant dropping the claim, I can't see why you shouldn't send it.

Other forum members may disagree.

Thanks again. My main issue is with the fact that by providing evidence directly to them it implies that the burden of proof is one me rather than on them explaining how they arrived at this bill. But I guess what you are saying is that I have to provide this evidence regardless at the hearing, so I don't have much to lose? I know for a fact that they have overcharged by some months and that the billing in question was incorrectly put together (unmetered when the property had a meter and I have a photo of the meter in question, the reading of which was provided to the original provider)

[Pezza54]

You will have to provide your evidence at least 14 days before the hearing. If you try to present it at the hearing the judge will probably stop you

[apsr90]

You will have to provide your evidence at least 14 days before the hearing. If you try to present it at the hearing the judge will probably stop you

No I understand that. My point was just that the vidence will have to be submitted in any case. Which begs the question, why does the solicitor want to have the evidence prior to the DQ being even completed. I assume they have also paid e fee to lift the case being stayed, so if they will see the evidence 14 days prior to the hearing why ask for it in advance? Do they have to pay an extra fee when going to a hearing?

[Pezza54]

Yes claimant has to pay an additional fee for the hearing and will have to pay his additional solicitor's fees, win or lose the case

[Pezza54]

Is the total amount of the claim only £300?