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N9B defence for inaccurate CCA

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Dolally1 View Post
    Thank you.

    c) In 2018 Next sent a contract with no address, then a couple of months later sent it again with my current address (not the one at the alleged time of opening). Restonís have sent two, both with the same previous address but as above not the correct address at time of alleged opening. Restonís have admitted in their covering letter that this is a reconstituted copy of the original as allowed by Carey vs HSBC bank 2009 and itís the only copy their client holds. So for an account as older than 2007 are they not allowed to reconstitute an agreement?
    They need to provide a true copy of the agreement at the time. They can't 'guess' what they think the address might of been. I'd be tempted to say that you previously held a account with Next. They can't provide a true copy or a 'reconstructed' agreement if that is what they should provide.

    Comment


    • #17
      true copy of the original pre 2007

      Comment


      • #18
        So should I expand point 12. To include - A true copy of the original agreement/contract has not been providedÖtherefore unenforceable?

        or is that something that I explain during mediation or hearing whichever way this ends up goingÖ

        many thanks for taking the time with this.

        Comment


        • #19
          You point out the legislation the judge has final say urgghh

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by Dolally1 View Post
            So should I expand point 12. To include - A true copy of the original agreement/contract has not been providedÖtherefore unenforceable?

            or is that something that I explain during mediation or hearing whichever way this ends up goingÖ

            many thanks for taking the time with this.
            As Mike says.

            Have you read post 16 and do you want to channge point (4)?

            Comment


            • #21
              Yes I think changing point 4 (as you have suggested above in post 16) is appropriate perhaps along with the addition of the line in post 18.

              I intend to submit the defence online (rather than paper copy) today. If the judge disagrees is there an appeals process?

              Thank you all your input thus far, I shall make a donation to this site as soon as Iím able as wouldnít have been able to get this far with out you.

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by Dolally1 View Post
                Yes I think changing point 4 (as you have suggested above in post 16) is appropriate perhaps along with the addition of the line in post 18.

                I intend to submit the defence online (rather than paper copy) today. If the judge disagrees is there an appeals process?

                Thank you all your input thus far, I shall make a donation to this site as soon as Iím able as wouldnít have been able to get this far with out you.
                Yes, you can Appeal the decision - https://www.gov.uk/government/public...ly-cases-ex340

                A good guide - https://www.judiciary.uk/wp-content/..._in_Person.pdf

                Ref post 18, read point 12, point 12 says that.

                Point 4 should read as follows now -

                4.It is admitted that the Defendant had previously entered into an agreement with Next for provision of credit.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Update:

                  Had a response from solicitors to my ďcommonly circulated template on consumer based forums defenceĒ (their words not mine!) Stating my defence has no real prospect of success and they will recommend their client makes an application to strike out the defence and enter judgement for the full amount with legal fees and costs.

                  They also invite me to withdraw my defence by completing the enclosed form or that I put forward a reasonable settlement proposal.

                  If i do nothing is the next step a directions questionnaire from the court and mediation? To which I can then explain the paperwork makes no sense.

                  Also a little concerned about everything being done by post and not receiving the directions questionnaire (due to be away from home in the next couple of months). Can I inform the court and have everything done via the online portal?

                  Thank you

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Dolally1 View Post
                    Update:

                    Had a response from solicitors to my ďcommonly circulated template on consumer based forums defenceĒ (their words not mine!) Stating my defence has no real prospect of success and they will recommend their client makes an application to strike out the defence and enter judgement for the full amount with legal fees and costs.

                    They also invite me to withdraw my defence by completing the enclosed form or that I put forward a reasonable settlement proposal.

                    If i do nothing is the next step a directions questionnaire from the court and mediation? To which I can then explain the paperwork makes no sense.

                    Also a little concerned about everything being done by post and not receiving the directions questionnaire (due to be away from home in the next couple of months). Can I inform the court and have everything done via the online portal?

                    Thank you
                    a) So your Defence didn't go down well with them, you won't be the first person to use a online template. Just ignore their comments.

                    b) You can actually download the Directions Questionnaire, fill it in and email it to the Court and Restons Solicitors.

                    https://www.gov.uk/government/public...l-claims-track

                    c) On there you must state that you want Mediation, but you haven't received the documents from Restons Solicitors if that is the case. You might shoot yourself in the foot, if you state where their error is in the documentation.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Iíve received under separate cover yet another copy of the same incorrect detailed paperwork.

                      If I limit the detail I put on the directions questionnaire (so not to shoot myself in the foot) I run the risk if they do not agree to mediation that the explanation of why I think itís unenforceable is not explained to the judge.

                      Or do I hope for mediation then let them know the detail.

                      Its like a tactical game of chess rather than simply telling the truth, which saddens me :0(

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Dolally1 View Post
                        Iíve received under separate cover yet another copy of the same incorrect detailed paperwork.

                        If I limit the detail I put on the directions questionnaire (so not to shoot myself in the foot) I run the risk if they do not agree to mediation that the explanation of why I think itís unenforceable is not explained to the judge.

                        Or do I hope for mediation then let them know the detail.

                        Its like a tactical game of chess rather than simply telling the truth, which saddens me :0(
                        Lets say for example there is no mediation (I'm not saying there won't be), you prepare your Witness Statement with evidence and there is a hearing when you can say that the document should be a true copy (pre 2007) and any how their reconstructed agreements are incorrect (wrong address) in any case.

                        Mediation is to reach a settlement, not to disclose aspects of your case. You just need to write that you haven't received the requested documents which is what you've put in your defence. Well you haven't received them because it should be a true copy if the agreement was taken out before 2007.

                        Well, they've reconstructed an agreement, instead of providing the original, they've got the wrong address on a reconstructed agreement, 'it's a hit and hope on their part'.

                        It will look bad on their part if they don't agree to mediation, hopefully after Witness Statements have been exchanged and you give them the evidence they will withdraw the case.

                        Why give them the opportunity to reconstruct further 'duds'.

                        If the Court / judge asks you what's wrong with the documents, then you can tell them.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Assuming we go through all the above process and either they withdraw or lose whatís to stop them bringing a new case using my evidence to recreate a non dud version?

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Dolally1 View Post
                            Assuming we go through all the above process and either they withdraw or lose whatís to stop them bringing a new case using my evidence to recreate a non dud version?
                            That's not going to happen, that would be an abuse of the Courts (I wasn't going to answer the question, but it's happy Wednesday).

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Ah I see. Thank you.

                              Happy Wednesday to you too

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Further update - just received another letter requesting I withdraw my defence as my cut and paste template stands no chance of success. As I have failed to comply with part 16 civil procedure rules and under part 24 the court can award summary judgement.

                                However if I do want to defend and pay the extra costs I should send my draft defence and evidence to them in the next two weeks.

                                And there was me thinking it was the court Iíd hear from next regarding what the next steps were!

                                Comment

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