Arrow Global V loudog1

[loudog1]

The Claimant hasn't said that the claim is for an overdraft - it says it was a "contract" in the Particulars of Claim leaving the way open for them to claim it was a loan (Flexiloan account?) or a credit card since you've told them that was the case in your Defence which they pointed out to you in their latest letter asking you to withdraw your Defence or face a Sumarry Judgment Application.

Di

Thank you Di,

In the letters they have sent me previously, they state it is an "overdraft" which is why they say they can not provide me with a CCA and proceed to explain as its an overdraft it is not regulated under the consumer credit act.

Restons also state on my most recent letter (16/03/18)....

"Please note that no default notice needs to be provided as this account relates to an overdraft facility which is an excluded agreement and comes within Section 98A(8) because it is an 'authorised non-business overdraft agreement' defines in Section 189(1)"

I am confused!! x

[loudog1]

I am also confused as to why my SAR to HSBC shows so little information!

[Amethyst]

Okay this flexiloan is likely to be the issue. I believe Diana M had one and has a copy of the terms.

http://legalbeagles.info/forums/foru...hsbc-flexiloan was a similar scenario but I'm not sure how it has ended ( if it has )

Do you know ( or does the SAR show ) how much the flexiloan balance was at when it ( presumably) defaulted and does that scan with the amount they are claiming ?

[loudog1]

Ive been through all my paperwork that I requested from HSBC, its showing 2 different account numbers for 2 Flexiloans ( I Only had 1 flexiloan) neither account numbers match that of my claim form and there is no where on paperwork that shows any balance or any details of payments!

The only paperwork that shows any figures is Payment protection isurance that shows it was refunded. I was not aware they had refunded this!

[Amethyst]

Did they refund it to the account ( ie reduce the balance ) although that would have been informed to you in a letter. Have you moved since defaulting on the flexiloan? It wasn't a joint account or anything ?

Sounds like Arrow are going to run into some problems evidencing their claim, particularly if they keep insisting it was an overdraft.

[loudog1]

Did they refund it to the account ( ie reduce the balance ) although that would have been informed to you in a letter. Have you moved since defaulting on the flexiloan? It wasn't a joint account or anything ?

Sounds like Arrow are going to run into some problems evidencing their claim, particularly if they keep insisting it was an overdraft.

Amethyst Hi..... Thank you one again!

I have moved address yes, I do not know if the PPI was refunded to the account. the details just say its been refunded but not how its been refunded i.e. reduce balance.

I have no idea of any of the transactions on my Flexiloan, My SAR from HSBC does not show any of this.

The only information HSBC have provided against the account number on my Court Claim is as follows....



Account Number: 12345678
Product type: BANK ACCOUNT
Product Status: Closed
Product Sub Category: Unknown
Date Opened: 21-08-1996
Date Closed: 30-11-2006
Reason Closed: Bad Debt-Metropolitan


My SAR shows my Flexiloan that I had with a different account number, but again no date of payments. Should it be showing this?

HSBC's covering letter with the SAR was

""In response to your recent request I enclose personal information that is held about you.
Unfortunately the Bank only holds statements from the end of July/August 2005. I would to clarify that this office acts as a coordinator to collate any personal data held and to provide you with the information to which you are entitled under the DataProtection Act 1998. We are unable to answer any questions you may have about your accounts."
xx

[Diana M]

Sounds like Arrow are going to run into some problems evidencing their claim, particularly if they keep insisting it was an overdraft.

The Particulars of Claim don’t say it’s an overdraft. They say it’s a “contract”.

In correspondence Restons and Arrow have maintained it’s an overdraft but the OP has admitted in their Defence that they had a loan and a credit card which Restons has noted. They may now check.

If Restons ascertain that they have the wrong account number (if they do) then they can make an Application to amend the Particulars of Claim.

It’s early days with a £7k claim so Arrow has time to remedy any flaws which have been pointed out to them.

From what I’ve read the account was assigned to Arrow in 2011 i.e. seven years ago so it’s possible that the information/data held by HSBC is not comprehensive.

Di

[Diana M]

The only information HSBC have provided against the account number on my Court Claim is as follows....

Account Number: 12345678
Product type: BANK ACCOUNT
Product Status: Closed
Product Sub Category: Unknown
Date Opened: 21-08-1996
Date Closed: 30-11-2006
Reason Closed: Bad Debt-Metropolitan

Does this mean that there was a bank account with the same number as stated in the POC which was opened in 1996 as stated in the POC?

That information from your SAR appears to say the bank account had a negative balance when it was closed in 2006 having perhaps been referred to Metropolitan (HSBC in-house debt collectors).

Di

[loudog1]

Okay this flexiloan is likely to be the issue. I believe Diana M had one and has a copy of the terms.

http://legalbeagles.info/forums/foru...hsbc-flexiloan was a similar scenario but I'm not sure how it has ended ( if it has )

Do you know ( or does the SAR show ) how much the flexiloan balance was at when it ( presumably) defaulted and does that scan with the amount they are claiming ?

Amethyst

I have no idea what the balance of my loan was when it defaulted, my SAR does not show any transactions or amounts or dates!!

What are my next steps now that Reston's have replied? do I reply or wait to hear from the court? x

[loudog1]

The Particulars of Claim don’t say it’s an overdraft. They say it’s a “contract”.

In correspondence Restons and Arrow have maintained it’s an overdraft but the OP has admitted in their Defence that they had a loan and a credit card which Restons has noted. They may now check.

If Restons ascertain that they have the wrong account number (if they do) then they can make an Application to amend the Particulars of Claim.

It’s early days with a £7k claim so Arrow has time to remedy any flaws which have been pointed out to them.

From what I’ve read the account was assigned to Arrow in 2011 i.e. seven years ago so it’s possible that the information/data held by HSBC is not comprehensive.

Di

Hi Di

I have no idea what my account number was as it was so long ago and my SAR has very little info on it.

My flexiloan shows a different account number to that on the POC x

[loudog1]

Is there something I am missing on my SAR??
There are no balances on any of my accounts so I am struggling to figure out what may have been transferred to where?x

[warwick65]

I have been following this thread and am so confused

You say the SAR holds very little info- roughly how many pages was it? My SAR to capital one must have been 200+ pages , I am sure Di will say as I emailed the whole lot to her :-)

The claim is for a lot of money and your defence seems very far from clear, have you thought about instructing solicitors ?

[Diana M]

What are my next steps now that Reston's have replied? do I reply or wait to hear from the court?

Restons letter (dated on or around 18th March?) invites you to withdraw your Defence and/or make proposals to pay the sum claimed within 14 days of their letter. That deadline has not yet expired so I don't expect them to do anything before it does expire next week.

After that they will decide whether and/or when to issue and serve you with a Summary Judgment Application as threatened.

In some cases they can wait weeks to do this while they bolster their legal arguments with new evidence perhaps based on what they have learned from a Defence. They will draft a Witness Statement with Exhibits in support of their SJ Application. It's likely to be a more comprehensive version what they have said in their letter (with documents as evidence).

I'm afraid as a Litigant in Person you may simply have to sit and wait for their next move.

This morning I have received a letter from Reston's... this is what it says

"We note you have recently filed a defence to the court proceedings issued against you.

The Particulars of Claim are sufficient for you to understand what this claim is in relation to namely: the original creditor, the Claimant, the fact the account was assigned and date the account on which the account was assigned, the account number for the Credit Facility and the outstanding balance claimed.

In response to point 4, this has been responded to under a separate cover, please find attached overleaf.

You have alleged that it is not clear what contract the claim relates to however, you have admitted that you have had several hsbc products in the past and the account number has been provided to you. As such this can be checked against your own personal records.

in response to point 7, although you allege that in August 1996 you will have been 16, a current account can be opened at the age of 16 on which an overdraft can be entered into at a later date.

Although you allege that the claim is statue barred, we note that you have provided no information/evidence of when you believe the limitation period commenced, nor have you provided any details of when you believe you last made a payment towards the debt or when you last acknowledged your liability for the debt

In any event, the information we have received from our client is that the last payment received towards your account was on 08/04/2015 which is within 6 years of these proceedings having been issued. In the circumstances, we entirely disagree with your assertion that the claim is statute barred.

Please note that no Default Notice needs to be provided as this account relates to an Overdraft Facility which is an excluded agreement and comes within Section 98A(8) because it is an "authorised non-business overdraft agreement" defined in Section 189(1).

As there will not have been a signed credit agreement pursuant to section 74 of the consumer credit act 1974 an agreement need not be provided.

In order to amend your defence the necessary application would need to be made to the court or written permission would need to be given, as we are not willing to grant such permission you are unable to amend your defence unless the court permits it upon the necessary application being made.

In view of the information set out in this letter, we do not believe your evens has any real prospect of success and we will therefore recommend to our client that an application be made to strike out the defence and to enter Judgement against you for the full amount claimed, together with legal fees and costs. Should you wish to avoid these further costs being incurred then we invite you to withdraw your defence by completing the enclosed form N9A and returning it to this office within 14 days.

Alternatively, our client is prepared to consider and reasonable settlement proposals you may wish to put forward in order to resolve this matter amicably and avoid continuation of this litigation. Please contact this office within the next 14 days should this option be of interest to you"

Furthermore, throughput the lifetime of the account, you will have received various statutory notices and collection style letters relating to the account and as such, we do not believe there can any sensible basis for you to allege you do not understand the basis of the claim issued against you.

For the avoidance of doubt, no extension of time is agreed for you to file a Defence.

We trust this clarifies the matter"

Di

[warwick65]

Eek
that really is one hell of a threatening letter from our friendly neighbourhood solicitor. I wonder if they had drunk too many pints of much Greenalls the night before.

I suspect this will go before a Judge with a comment about this being a template defence from the internet and maybe even copies of your posts.

Of course they are trying to scare you but I think you need to be proactive

Does the account number they give relate in any way to your records- remember they often combine sort code and account number to make a reference number