Tweet
Hi
First post and after looking around I hope I've got the right section.
I bought a car from a used car dealer and drove it home, the next morning found that the coolant level was dangerously low and found that there was a leak from the lower radiator hose area. I also found a few other issues such as overfilled oil level and a broken wing mirror housing. The oil issue I would not have found had it not been for the coolant problem and the mirror I did not see as it was hidden in the lower corner and only visible from the drivers seat.
I immediately emailed the dealer about this and a few other minor issues but he insists I drive the car 80 miles around the M25 and M1 to his garage and stop as required along the way (the coolant is gone in about 3 miles) to refill the coolant level. I have pointed out that that is unacceptable as it is dangerous to stop and repair a car on the motorway...several times. Even if I don't take the motorways (adding so much more time to the journey and fuel costs) there is still the risk of the engine overheating and possible severe failure.
The first reply was:
The coolant was drained and replaced as part of the water pump change. I would have said that it was possible that there was an air lock but if you can see an obvious leak then we would need to look at that and repair it
The oil and water issues are of concern but if you top up and monitor the coolant, then the car can be used and driven. We would recommend that we arrange for you to drop it back to us to lower the oil and fix the coolant leak.
I wouldn't envisage the repair taking no more than a couple of days and we would be more than happy to supply you with a courtesy car during that period.
My reply:The coolant goes too fast, the top up I did went within a few minutes of a journey of 3 miles, there is no way I can drive and stop to refill that often and then there is the cost of the fluid itself. I certainly am not going to do that for 75+ miles on the motorways to get to you. I also don't know if the leak is something that will worsen.
I suggest getting a local garage to check the leak out and siphon out the excess oil and we agree a figure to cover that and these other snags.
No response so chased with:
1. Coolant leak is critical, it is not feasible to drive the car back to you and stopping several times on the motorway to refill is costly, impracticable, dangerous and could lead to engine failure. I am trying to limit using the car and have only done the school run about 8 times which is not even 3 miles, from a tank at max level the warning lights are on before I get to the school and the level is not even visible from the side it is so low. So far I have used almost 5 litres of fluid (before dilution).
2. Over-filled engine oil and the problems that can cause to the cat (as the warning sticker states).
(plus reference to the other issues)
I see the options as, and in order of my preference as the least costly to both of us:
A) Allow a garage local to me (you can appoint whomever you want) to investigate the leak and you approve them to make good, they could also adjust the oil level. I would accept a second-hand mirror/housing, whichever is cheaper, and attempt to fit myself in a gesture to limit your costs. The mileage issue is significant so should be addressed but points 5,6 and 7 I will accept as minor.
B) You come and collect the car, leave a courtesy car, fix the issues and return to me.
C) I exercise my right to reject the purchase, stop using it and allow you to collect it once the full refund has been processed.
The response:
The car trade industry is littered with fly by nights and bankruptcy. Our business model works well for us and has kept us in business where many fail. We therefore make decisions based on our model as this is the difference between liquidity are bankruptcy.
Part of our model is that we cover our own warranty and complete our own repairs. This enables us to keep our costs down and be competitive with sales prices
Our low prices do tend to attract customers from all locations but the large distances customers are prepared to travel for these prices can on occasions such as yours be problematic. When problems do occur we do our very best to resolve and repair things but as with all car dealers we cannot help with the logistics of returning the car.
We understand that returning a car can sometimes be time consuming and difficult and therefor local repair is preferred by the buyer but the costs are massively skewed by labour charges which would not apply to us. We also need to see the car ourselves to assess our warrantable liabilities
From reading your emails I sympathise with your issues and situation but we have to make business decisions which balance the consumer needs against a business model that supports buoyant trading and legislative compliance
So now I need to reply and my thoughts are that his "business model" cannot take preference over the Sale of Goods Act, it is not fit for purpose, and was advertised as a "GREAT EXAMPLE, READY TO DRIVE AWAY" (their capitalisation not mine). I also feel like telling him he should only sell to local people and not advertise nationally.
Have I been reasonable in my requests and options?
I am sure that I have read somewhere that I should not be at a financial loss in the returning the car (2 days lost from work, fuel to cover <400 miles, £40 worth of coolant) would that be right?
But most importantly the risk to myself of conducting motorway or roadside repairs (pretty sure the police would take a dim view) is not acceptable to me, and if the engine seized I have a fair idea that they would try to say it was caused by me!
It is a fair guess that they made a poor connection in the lower rad hose after changing the water pump (refer to their first reply) and could easily be checked by any garage local to me, then they could re-assess the course of action.
Any suggestions for my reply?
Many thanks
First post and after looking around I hope I've got the right section.
I bought a car from a used car dealer and drove it home, the next morning found that the coolant level was dangerously low and found that there was a leak from the lower radiator hose area. I also found a few other issues such as overfilled oil level and a broken wing mirror housing. The oil issue I would not have found had it not been for the coolant problem and the mirror I did not see as it was hidden in the lower corner and only visible from the drivers seat.
I immediately emailed the dealer about this and a few other minor issues but he insists I drive the car 80 miles around the M25 and M1 to his garage and stop as required along the way (the coolant is gone in about 3 miles) to refill the coolant level. I have pointed out that that is unacceptable as it is dangerous to stop and repair a car on the motorway...several times. Even if I don't take the motorways (adding so much more time to the journey and fuel costs) there is still the risk of the engine overheating and possible severe failure.
The first reply was:
The coolant was drained and replaced as part of the water pump change. I would have said that it was possible that there was an air lock but if you can see an obvious leak then we would need to look at that and repair it
The oil and water issues are of concern but if you top up and monitor the coolant, then the car can be used and driven. We would recommend that we arrange for you to drop it back to us to lower the oil and fix the coolant leak.
I wouldn't envisage the repair taking no more than a couple of days and we would be more than happy to supply you with a courtesy car during that period.
My reply:The coolant goes too fast, the top up I did went within a few minutes of a journey of 3 miles, there is no way I can drive and stop to refill that often and then there is the cost of the fluid itself. I certainly am not going to do that for 75+ miles on the motorways to get to you. I also don't know if the leak is something that will worsen.
I suggest getting a local garage to check the leak out and siphon out the excess oil and we agree a figure to cover that and these other snags.
No response so chased with:
1. Coolant leak is critical, it is not feasible to drive the car back to you and stopping several times on the motorway to refill is costly, impracticable, dangerous and could lead to engine failure. I am trying to limit using the car and have only done the school run about 8 times which is not even 3 miles, from a tank at max level the warning lights are on before I get to the school and the level is not even visible from the side it is so low. So far I have used almost 5 litres of fluid (before dilution).
2. Over-filled engine oil and the problems that can cause to the cat (as the warning sticker states).
(plus reference to the other issues)
I see the options as, and in order of my preference as the least costly to both of us:
A) Allow a garage local to me (you can appoint whomever you want) to investigate the leak and you approve them to make good, they could also adjust the oil level. I would accept a second-hand mirror/housing, whichever is cheaper, and attempt to fit myself in a gesture to limit your costs. The mileage issue is significant so should be addressed but points 5,6 and 7 I will accept as minor.
B) You come and collect the car, leave a courtesy car, fix the issues and return to me.
C) I exercise my right to reject the purchase, stop using it and allow you to collect it once the full refund has been processed.
The response:
The car trade industry is littered with fly by nights and bankruptcy. Our business model works well for us and has kept us in business where many fail. We therefore make decisions based on our model as this is the difference between liquidity are bankruptcy.
Part of our model is that we cover our own warranty and complete our own repairs. This enables us to keep our costs down and be competitive with sales prices
Our low prices do tend to attract customers from all locations but the large distances customers are prepared to travel for these prices can on occasions such as yours be problematic. When problems do occur we do our very best to resolve and repair things but as with all car dealers we cannot help with the logistics of returning the car.
We understand that returning a car can sometimes be time consuming and difficult and therefor local repair is preferred by the buyer but the costs are massively skewed by labour charges which would not apply to us. We also need to see the car ourselves to assess our warrantable liabilities
From reading your emails I sympathise with your issues and situation but we have to make business decisions which balance the consumer needs against a business model that supports buoyant trading and legislative compliance
So now I need to reply and my thoughts are that his "business model" cannot take preference over the Sale of Goods Act, it is not fit for purpose, and was advertised as a "GREAT EXAMPLE, READY TO DRIVE AWAY" (their capitalisation not mine). I also feel like telling him he should only sell to local people and not advertise nationally.
Have I been reasonable in my requests and options?
I am sure that I have read somewhere that I should not be at a financial loss in the returning the car (2 days lost from work, fuel to cover <400 miles, £40 worth of coolant) would that be right?
But most importantly the risk to myself of conducting motorway or roadside repairs (pretty sure the police would take a dim view) is not acceptable to me, and if the engine seized I have a fair idea that they would try to say it was caused by me!
It is a fair guess that they made a poor connection in the lower rad hose after changing the water pump (refer to their first reply) and could easily be checked by any garage local to me, then they could re-assess the course of action.
Any suggestions for my reply?
Many thanks
Comment