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Flight Cancellation compensation

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  • #46
    Flight Cancellation compensation

    More confused nonsense from Jet2 attached.
    Their previous correspondence had blamed the delay on a fault with the No.1 VHF control panel - this particular piece of equipment turns out to be secondhand ('overhauled' as the letter states, whatever that means).
    They also quoted previously that this equipment would have been replaced after 48,000 hours use (so called 'soft life'), but it failed after only 2,880 flight hours - the actual 'soft life' for this equipment has reduced to 3,300 hours, which is quite a drop (a clerical error!).
    I was slightly wrong when reading this the first time - turns out the 3,300 flight hours referred to is actually what they call 'Mean Time Between Failure' (or MTBF) - however, because Jet2 operate (apparently) something called a proactive reliability programme, the 'soft life' for this particular piece of kit would be around 2,500 flight hours - I interpret this as meaning that it failed 380 hours after it would normally have been replaced under this programme (Jet2 will no doubt put me right on this, as they have with everything else!).
    The other confusing element concerns times - our flight was due to depart at 7.30am, but in fact didn't leave until around 10.40am, hence the eventual arrival at 2.02pm (3 hours 12 minutes after the scheduled arrival time). I'm not clear why it took from 8.30am (when Jet2 declared the faulty part in question 'serviceable') until 10.40am to get us all on board and ultimately take-off. I'll have to ask the question I suppose.
    Again, reading this for a second time, it looks like Jet2 (and other airlines) use something called Co-ordinated Universal Time (or UTC) - this is effectively the same as GMT, so in my particular case, because our flight was in August (BST), when they quote UTC, I have had to add an hour on to get it match up with the actual boarding/departure times - another thing they try to use to confuse ordinary folk like me.
    Attached Files
    Last edited by supermac9; 9th January 2014, 12:17:PM. Reason: Update

    Comment


    • #47
      Flight Cancellation Compensation

      Latest drivel from Jet2 attached.
      This time they have resorted to making things up, suggesting that the fault with the now infamous No.1 VHF radio control panel was discovered while the aircraft was taxiing for take-off at 7.40am - complete nonsense of course, passengers weren't allowed to board until around 10.15am, prior to actually taking off at 10.50am.
      Since I have started letter tennis with Jet2, they have changed two things - one is how long this piece of equipment should last (3,300 hours instead of 48,000 hours), and now the actual time it was fixed (08.45am instead of 08.30am). I have questioned the reliability of their answers and have asked them to start telling the truth.
      Attached Files

      Comment


      • #48
        Flight Cancellation compensation

        I've had a standard letter from Jet2 which relates to the CAA asking them to reassess our file - it looks like a generic letter which has simply has my name, address and date added to it, and surprise, they still think that I'm not due any compensation!
        I'm waiting for replies to two letters still, but might as well respond to this one as well - keep them busy.
        Attached Files

        Comment


        • #49
          Re: Flight Cancellation compensation

          More delay, but hopefully this will finally give everyone some clarity on this issue.
          http://casetracker.justice.gov.uk/li...se_id=20133277

          Comment


          • #50
            Re: Flight Cancellation compensation

            Just when I though Jet2 couldnt get any lower, they have sent their latest letter through to me. It's got more fiction in it than a Stephen King novel, and they chop and change their version of events every time I get something from them. The latest changes are:
            1. The dodgy radio didn't pack in when the aircraft was taxiing, it was actually when it was just about to be pushed back off the stand - either way, it's complete and utter nonsense, as passengers weren't boarded until hours after this. Where they are getting their information from is a complete mystery, unless they are simply lying.
            2. Although they have said previously that this piece of kit would normally be replaced 25% early under their proactive reliability programme (the so-called 'soft life'), funnily enough this actually wasn't in place at the time of our delayed flight(!) - if it had been, they should have replaced it before it actually failed. Even more interestingly, they now do have a 'soft life' for this radio (I interpret this to mean that it should have had a soft life at the time of our flight, but I am sure they will dream up some imaginative reason why it hasn't been).
            I'm just going to keep playing letter tennis with them.

            http://www.bottonline.co.uk/aviation...l#.Uvya8vv5BGM

            http://casetracker.justice.gov.uk/li...se_id=20133277
            Attached Files
            Last edited by supermac9; 17th February 2014, 08:07:AM. Reason: Latest Response from Jet2

            Comment


            • #51
              Re: Flight Cancellation compensation

              Court success against Jet2:
              http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/c...-cash.23428653

              Comment


              • #52
                Flight Cancellation compensation

                More correspondence from those great fiction writers, Jet2.com.
                I have been trading letters with them for some time now, and one of the subjects now close to my heart is the so called 'soft-life' (which is the number of flight hours after which Jet2 would routinely replace a particular piece of kit) of their No.1 VHF control panel. Over the past few months this particular issue has developed a mysterious life of it's own (all of the figures quoted have been provided by Jet2 Customer (dis)Service):
                19.11.13 - 'soft-life' was 48,000 flight hours (that nearly 5 and a half years continuous flying)
                23.12.13 - 'soft-life' dropped to 2,500 flight hours
                06.02.14 - 'soft-life' didn't actually apply to this item at the time of our flight (which was on 25.08.12)
                28.02.14 - 'soft-life' applied with effect from May 2013 is 6,500 flight hours
                Prior to our flight, this secondhand VHF control panel failed after only 2,880 flight hours, so, surprise surprise, it wasn't their fault after all!!
                I'm beginning to think that Jet2 are deliberately quoting different figures just to irritate me - surely there can't be any science behind them if they just chop and change (48,000, 2,500, none, 6,500) to suit particular circumstances (in their favour, of course).
                I'm going to have to start legal proceedings or this letter jousting would just go on and on.
                Attached Files

                Comment


                • #53
                  Re: Flight Cancellation compensation

                  Jet2 have a 'Reliability Department'! I don't know whether to laugh or cry.
                  It's a pity some of them don't work on the administrative side of life, as they constantly come up with clerical errors when quoting figures to me.
                  Attached Files

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Re: Flight Cancellation compensation

                    Their letters are hilarious, stick with it, are you going to wait the outcome of Huzar before putting in your court claim?
                    #staysafestayhome

                    Any support I provide is offered without liability, if you are unsure please seek professional legal guidance.

                    Received a Court Claim? Read >>>>> First Steps

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      Re: Flight Cancellation compensation

                      I think it is best to wait for the outcome of the Huzar appeal, as it should clear things up once and for all.
                      I quite enjoy trading letters with Jet2, but they are determined to stand their ground if nothing else, even if their arguments are based on shifting sand.

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Flight Cancellation compensation

                        More comedy from the funny folk at Jet2.com - all this latest letter does is confirm that to get a job in their Customer (dis)Service department, you either have to be a pathological liar, creative with the truth or prone to make countless 'clerical errors'. I wonder if they ever bother employing 'normal' people who actually tell the truth and then stick to it, whatever the consequence.
                        I copy all of Jet2's correspondence to the CAA, but I'm not sure if anyone actually works for them, as they are silent most of the time.:doh:
                        Attached Files
                        Last edited by supermac9; 2nd April 2014, 15:15:PM.

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Re: Flight Cancellation compensation

                          The latest development (or non-development) on this one, this time from the airlines friend and co-conspirator, the CAA - the final message from their Passenger Complaints Team is as follows:
                          RE: Jet2Thank you for your latest email, and for your patience with us while we investigated your complaint about the disruption of flight LS597 on 25 August 2012. During our investigation we received information from Jet2 about the flight concerned, which we have considered in the light of new guidelines clarifying the “extraordinary circumstances” exception of EC 261/2004.After considering all the evidence available to us, it is our view that the disruption of your flight is of a type which means that the airline does not need to pay compensation. It appears from the documentation provided that there was a type of technical fault which means that, under these specific circumstances, the disruption was beyond the control of the airline and could not have been avoided. It is our view therefore that this disruption falls under the extraordinary circumstancesexception of EC261/2004 and as such, we believe that you are not entitled to compensation in this case.Unfortunately we are unable to take your case any further on the compensation part of your claim. Our opinion that, in this case, the disruption was due to extraordinary circumstances is based on the information provided to us. It is not legally binding and only relates to the flight concerned.We understand that this may be disappointing for you. You do still have the option of going to county court but, in our opinion, we believe that the airline has a strong case not to pay compensation and, as such, it is for you to decide whether you wish to pursue this further. You can find information on how to take court action at https://www.gov.uk/make-court-claim-for-money/overview.
                          This all could end up being a bit academic depending on the outcome of the Huzar appeal next month - we'll have to wait and see.

                          Comment


                          • #58
                            Re: Flight Cancellation compensation

                            Do not go to the CAA!
                            I told them about a delayed flight to America over a year ago, I got an email this week saying they had told continental to pay up, but continental are refusing and now the six years has past(5 days ago)
                            And now I can't take them to court sorry.

                            CAA completely toothless I wasted a year with them and now lost over 4000 in compensation.

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              Re: Flight Cancellation compensation

                              I understand that you have up to 6 years to take airlines to court, but the CAA are extremely slow to act and it looks like you have suffered as a result. It may be worthwhile seeking advice from someone like Bott and Co. who specialise in aviation compensation cases.
                              In my case, Jet2 have replied to my latest letter basically telling me where to go, and using the recent CAA decision on my case to back their argument up.
                              In my view, the CAA have come up with a bunch of so-called extraordinary circumstances which seem to weigh heavily in favour of the airlines (I've seen it described elsewhere as a 'stitch-up'!). Roll on Huzar.
                              Attached Files

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Re: Flight Cancellation compensation

                                More drivel about this case, this time from Monica Bonello at the CAA:
                                Thank you for your further email.

                                There are constraints on the CAA that prevent it from releasing certain information to passengers. Essentially any information obtained by the CAA under Part 8 of the Enterprise Act is specified information for the purposes of Part 9 of the Enterprise Act 2002. This means it cannot be disclosed except in very limited circumstances, for example, if an airline had given us consent. Disclosure in breach of Part 9 is a criminal offence on the part of the individual who makes the disclosure. We therefore often have very little room for manoeuvre in relation to information we gather about businesses when assessing compliance with Regulation EC261/2004.

                                To provide you with the CAA’s rationale in the assessment of your claim, would I’m afraid, lead us into territory that would be in breach of the Enterprise Act.

                                Yours sincerely

                                Monica Bonello
                                Secretary
                                Markets and Consumers Group
                                Civil Aviation Authority
                                CAA House, 45-59 Kingsway, London WC2B 6TE
                                Telephone: 0207 453 6888
                                http://www.caa.co.uk

                                Good to see that they are firmly on the side of the passenger and going that extra mile for us all!

                                Comment

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