commercial property and hmrc

[Jhydro]

advice needed please, i have a ltd company and was renting a unit which i had for the past 4 years and due to hard times and and a big drop in sales we fell behind on payments mainly cp tax we were told by hmrc we had to cease trading and they were taking control of goods and must wait for them to visit which should of been a week after the telephone conversation. they were coming to liquidate the company. we were also a little behind on the rent aswell no more than we ever had been in the past. we always spoke with the landlord and kept them up to date or they would contact us and ask wen payment wud be made. following hmrc instructions we closed the doors while we waited further instructions on wot to do next in the mean time i went to the unit id say just under 2weeks later to find a note on the door from the landlord saying something along the lines of we have forfited the leese and they have changed the locks. we were then told by our neighbour the following day they were emptying the property an never once had they tryed to contact us either by phone or email like they had done in the past. inside the unit there were items that were on leese like the coffee machine and watercooler also there were many personal item such as a store room full of vintage radios of my mum and dads an there camping equipment which had nothing to do with the business wot so ever. would be much appriecated if anyone has advice on wot to do next. thanks in advance. J

[jaguarsuk]

Re: commercial property and hmrc

advice needed please, i have a ltd company and was renting a unit which i had for the past 4 years and due to hard times and and a big drop in sales we fell behind on payments mainly cp tax we were told by hmrc we had to cease trading and they were taking control of goods and must wait for them to visit which should of been a week after the telephone conversation. they were coming to liquidate the company. we were also a little behind on the rent aswell no more than we ever had been in the past. we always spoke with the landlord and kept them up to date or they would contact us and ask wen payment wud be made. following hmrc instructions we closed the doors while we waited further instructions on wot to do next in the mean time i went to the unit id say just under 2weeks later to find a note on the door from the landlord saying something along the lines of we have forfited the leese and they have changed the locks. we were then told by our neighbour the following day they were emptying the property an never once had they tryed to contact us either by phone or email like they had done in the past. inside the unit there were items that were on leese like the coffee machine and watercooler also there were many personal item such as a store room full of vintage radios of my mum and dads an there camping equipment which had nothing to do with the business wot so ever. would be much appriecated if anyone has advice on wot to do next. thanks in advance. J

Firstly a letter asking for the return of all goods and property that was in the unit.

If ignored or refused an application to the court for an injunction to return them. As advised by [MENTION=39710]des8[/MENTION] on my question here: http://legalbeagles.info/forums/show...+of+possesions

"Guide to completion: https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/pr...an-application

On basis Torts (interference with goods) Act 1977
conversion of goods Sec 1(a)
Remedy: sec 3 (1) & (2)(a)"

Hopefully des8 will be able to confirm whether this applies to personal and commercial entities.

[Jhydro]

Re: commercial property and hmrc

the bit that worrys me is hmrc, is this now a dispute between them and the landlord?

[jaguarsuk]

Re: commercial property and hmrc

the bit that worrys me is hmrc, is this now a dispute between them and the landlord?

I don't know, they hadn't turned up to seize anything and it could be that removing by you or anyone to be sold, given away or whatever is perfectly fine until they actually turn up. It's not possible until they have seen it and made an inventory to know what was and wasn't in the place after all.

Whatever debt is outstanding to HMRC I would say will between them and you. You then separately would have to pursue the landlord for your loss and potentially any penalties you incur after them clearing out what wasn't theirs without notifying you. In any event, if the landlord has sold your stuff they are supposed to keep the money from the sale to return to you and can't just keep it to pay whatever you owe them unless you agree. They have no right to seize and sell your goods because you owe them rent.

[Jhydro]

Re: commercial property and hmrc

thanks for the qwik reply, i must say ive only just started using this forum an wot a forum and so far i must rate it a at 10/10. where do i stand with hmrc as as far as i was concerned anything in the unit to do with the business should of stayed there for them to start liqidation process, but now as the landlord has emptied the property there is nothing there to liqidate/

[jaguarsuk]

Re: commercial property and hmrc

thanks for the qwik reply, i must say ive only just started using this forum an wot a forum and so far i must rate it a at 10/10. where do i stand with hmrc as as far as i was concerned anything in the unit to do with the business should of stayed there for them to start liqidation process, but now as the landlord has emptied the property there is nothing there to liqidate/

I'm certainly not qualified to give you definitive answers, but I would talk to HMRC sooner rather than later about the situation rather than them finding out when they turn up. They might even be able to offer advice on what you or they can do?

[des8]

Re: commercial property and hmrc

did you check if your lease includes a specific forfeiture clause? without it the landlord cannot declare the lease forfeit.

Also the landlord has no right to seize, retain or sell your goods (or anyone elses that are in the buildimg)
As suggested, write requesting their return. If he fails to do so, you could apply for a court order to enforce their return, if HMRC don't do it for you!