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Benefits while separated

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  • Benefits while separated

    After almost 7 years of marriage, me and wife separated in August 2012. I dont want to go into much detail as it’s a very personal thing, but some of the points may be relevant later on.
    We have 3 children of our own...7 and 5 year old twins, plus 4 from her first marriage, ages 14,17, 18 and 23.

    It wasn’t the most amicable split as basically I didn’t want to leave, but she said the reasons were she just thought we had done our time and didn’t want to be together anymore.
    Reluctantly I moved out of her housing association property and into privately rented accommodation.
    She went on to benefits as s single mother of 7 children.

    Things were very strained for the first 9 months. We argued about the kids, money etc the usual thing during a separation. At one point the police were sent to my flat to warn me about my behaviour towards her.
    We both saw other people during this time. However, I knew that if she ever said she would take me back I would be there for her.

    For some unknown reason, last year we started getting on, we were both single and gradually we built a relationship back up from the ground.
    Since then, we have turned from a couple who hated each other to a normal couple who are dating etc. Things now are better than we can both remember. I visit hers regularly, and we do spend most weekends together. The younger children understand the situation that daddy doesn’t stay during the week because of work....the simplest explanation we can give that makes them understand why we do not live together.
    We don’t live together because we do not want to destroy what we have built up this last year and are not ready to take the risk of it all falling apart were we to take that step. One of the reasons we split in the first place was due to the pressures of having so many children.

    We are financially independent of each other.
    I work full time and do not receive any benefits. I have rent, council tax, phone, water, gas, electric bills to pay just like everyone else.

    However, last August, her benefits were stopped and she was accused of frauding the benefits system saying that they had information to believe that we had never split and were cheating the system.
    Needless to say she was terrified wondering how she was supposed to raise the family with no benefits.
    I provided her with copies of my tenancy agreements, council tax etc so when she was eventually called for a meeting, the case was dropped.

    Nothing has changed since then, we still live apart. We have mentioned in passing about living together again, but the time isn’t right. It may be a very long time before we consider making that move. The last thing we want is to get back together and then 6 month’s later things being how they were before we split.

    The reason for this post is because she had a family disagreement recently, which has led her to believe that it may have been a disgruntled relative who may have made the claims last year.
    We have no proof, but it is a definite possibility given the comments like “we know why he hasn’t moved back in”, “have some more children if you want to be better off”, “watch you don’t lose your benefits again!”
    Quite clearly this has upset her and she is now worried that she may get more hassle from the benefits agency.

    I have researched as much as I can and the things I have found appear to say that we are doing nothing wrong. We don’t live together, we are not financially tied together; I can prove that with documentation. But she is worried that they may see things differently because we are still legally married.

    My perspective is she could have met anyone after me, and be living the same way with them as she is with me now, so there should be no difference.
    We have every right to try and work things out, and just like any couple you don’t have to live together if you aren’t ready for that.
    Maybe some people seem to think that I have not moved back in because she would lose her benefits and hence we are fiddling the system.
    What they don’t know is that the bulk of her benefits are for two of our children who are disabled. This benefit would not be affected if we were to live together. In fact the benefits she would lose are probably less than what I would save by trying to run a household on my own.

    I took her away for two weeks recently. I paid for it and took her on a holiday that we both deserved after the past couple of years. And just like any carer, she needs a break occasionally from it all. Of course this instigated further harsh words from this relative about benefits paying for our holiday!

    Would appreciate any advice from anyone has experience similar to this, as it doesn’t seem to be a common occurrence.

    A
    Tags: None

  • #2
    Re: Benefits while separated

    Welcome to LB
    Originally posted by bluenoes View Post
    Since then, we have turned from a couple who hated each other to a normal couple who are dating etc. Things now are better than we can both remember. I visit hers regularly, and we do spend most weekends together. The younger children understand the situation that daddy doesn’t stay during the week because of work....the simplest explanation we can give that makes them understand why we do not live together.
    We don’t live together because we do not want to destroy what we have built up this last year and are not ready to take the risk of it all falling apart were we to take that step. One of the reasons we split in the first place was due to the pressures of having so many children.

    We are financially independent of each other.
    I work full time and do not receive any benefits.
    I have rent, council tax, phone, water, gas, electric bills to pay just like everyone else.

    However, last August, her benefits were stopped and she was accused of frauding the benefits system saying that they had information to believe that we had never split and were cheating the system.
    Needless to say she was terrified wondering how she was supposed to raise the family with no benefits.
    Worse than that, benefits fraud is a criminal offence that can put you in jail,:scared: so it's very important to have things cleared up.
    Originally posted by bluenoes View Post
    I provided her with copies of my tenancy agreements, council tax etc so when she was eventually called for a meeting, the case was dropped.
    As it should be!

    Originally posted by bluenoes View Post
    The reason for this post is because she had a family disagreement recently, which has led her to believe that it may have been a disgruntled relative who may have made the claims last year.
    We have no proof, but it is a definite possibility given the comments like “we know why he hasn’t moved back in”, “have some more children if you want to be better off”, “watch you don’t lose your benefits again!”
    Quite clearly this has upset her and she is now worried that she may get more hassle from the benefits agency.

    I have researched as much as I can and the things I have found appear to say that we are doing nothing wrong. We don’t live together, we are not financially tied together; I can prove that with documentation. But she is worried that they may see things differently because we are still legally married.
    The documentation should be enough to show you have separate lives financially. :thumb:

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Benefits while separated

      Originally posted by bluenoes View Post
      Maybe some people seem to think that I have not moved back in because she would lose her benefits and hence we are fiddling the system.
      What they don’t know is that the bulk of her benefits are for two of our children who are disabled
      . This benefit would not be affected if we were to live together. In fact the benefits she would lose are probably less than what I would save by trying to run a household on my own.
      What *some people* may think is irrelevant for the purposes of the benefits system, they have to act on PROOF. There's always resentment against people who rely on benefits, particularly those with lots of children, and the media is largely responsible for this attitude.

      There is, of course, a more mundane explanation: ENVY!

      Originally posted by bluenoes View Post
      I took her away for two weeks recently. I paid for it and took her on a holiday that we both deserved after the past couple of years. And just like any carer, she needs a break occasionally from it all. Of coursethis instigated further harsh words from this relative about benefits paying for our holiday!

      Would appreciate any advice from anyone has experience similar to this, as it doesn’t seem to be a common occurrence.
      That's where I have to disagree, all of the above is, in fact, a very common occurrence! A large number of investigations into alleged benefits fraud carried out by the DWP are prompted by reports from others, very few of which are concerned citizens trying to do their civic duty for their country. Most are 'enemies' of some sort, or people who just feel envious of someone who can seemingly sit at home doing nothing while they have to get up early every morning to go to work and still struggle to make ends meet.

      What they don't realise is that living on benefits is hardly a walk in the park, they hardly cover the bare necessities and it can be hard to find the money to replace a broken appliance or get something fixed, let alone holidays and other 'luxuries'.

      The reality of caring for disabled children (or adults for that matter), is not something everyone understands. In fact, many local authorities organise short breaks and other activities to provide respite for carers precisely for that reason, so you shouldn't feel guilty for offering her the respite she needs, after all she's bringing up 7 children and 2 of them disabled, she deserves a medal!

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Benefits while separated

        Completely agree with Flaming Parrot. Ignore them. I've been accused of 'cheating' benefits, by someone who is basically a sad lonely idiot. I only get child benefit and a small amount of child tax credit, so if I am cheating the system I'm not very good at it :doggieyes: . So it doesn't just happen when you actually do have benefits , it happens when you don't too.

        So long as you are acting properly, not staying over regularly and don't have your things at her home you'll be fine. You are completely doing the right thing in taking it slowly and rebuilding your relationship, so you do what you think is right for you both, and the children, and ignore the idiots.
        #staysafestayhome

        Any support I provide is offered without liability, if you are unsure please seek professional legal guidance.

        Received a Court Claim? Read >>>>> First Steps

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Benefits while separated

          Many thanks for taking the time to read and reply to this, its much appreciated.
          I've shown this to her, and she feels a bit better now. Needless to say she is still worried, I guess its only natural really.

          We do spend weekends together, either at hers or at mine on the occasion she can take a break.
          I don't have any clothes or things like that over there, just a few tools and the like in here shed as they were left when I moved out and had nowhere to store them.

          Time will tell if the person we believe may have put a complaint in does it again in the near future :tinysmile_cry_t:

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Benefits while separated

            Originally posted by bluenoes View Post
            Many thanks for taking the time to read and reply to this, its much appreciated.
            I've shown this to her, and she feels a bit better now. Needless to say she is still worried, I guess its only natural really.
            Good to hear that.

            Originally posted by bluenoes View Post
            We do spend weekends together, either at hers or at mine on the occasion she can take a break.
            I don't have any clothes or things like that over there, just a few tools and the like in here shed as they were left when I moved out and had nowhere to store them.

            Time will tell if the person we believe may have put a complaint in does it again in the near future :tinysmile_cry_t:
            Sadly some people make a habit of reporting others but, as you say above, you guys have nothing to hide, therefore nothing to worry about. :thumb:

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Benefits while separated

              Rather a late reply but as someone who was separated for 9 years but still on the most part friends I can sympathise. To be honest I had no problemds getting her the benefits she was entitled to, the problem came when I lost my job and applied for HB. As she lived in the marital home they wanted me to either move back in or kick her out . It was resolved in the end but it can be like banging you head against a brick wall

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Benefits while separated

                Separation after long time in married life is very difficult because of both are completely understandable each other and suddenly take decision about separate life is very critical.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Benefits while separated

                  Hi all.

                  I need to revive my thread as we today my wife got called into the local benefits office again as she has been reported for benefit fraud.

                  Since my original post back in May, we have heard nothing from any agencies about allegations, although we had the feeling that someone had a grudge.
                  It now appears that person has lodged their grudge.

                  Our situation remains the same.
                  We live separately, have separate bank accounts. I pay my own bills, she pays hers.
                  My rent agreement runs until February 2015, and we havent really discussed what we will do when that point comes, although things are going well, we wont want to ruin things so the chances are we will stay living seprately for another 6 months to a year.

                  However, she was pulled in today aand had to take bank accounts in with her etc.
                  They confirmed that an anonymous person had made allegations and thats why they are following it up.

                  To cut a long story short they have told her that she has a month to decide if she wants me to move back in and we then live as a normal couple.
                  If not, then she will be put under surveillance and they will look into it further.

                  They have said that just because I pay rent somewhere else doesnt mean we arent living together! Do they not think that me saving around 900 pound a month by not running my own houselhold would be better for me? How on earth they thing she is gaining financially by doing this is beyond me.

                  They have said that I cannot stay over, go shopping together etc etc etc.

                  So basically they are trying to force us to live together...or not see each other. How the hell can that be right...either legally or morally?

                  I cant move back anyway as I am stuck in my own flat until February.

                  She is obviously worried sick right now, nothing I can say helps. It sounds to me they are trying to force her hand so we move back together to suit them...surely if they were convinced there was fraud going on they would have acted now?

                  I am angry as much as anything of being forced into choosing we live together or thats it, game over.

                  They have not sked her to produce any documents to show that I am responsible for my own finances etc.

                  She told them that all she is trying to do is put our family back together. If and when we are ready to live together then we will.
                  They also said that the taxpayer is paying for her family!! To say that angered me is an understatement.

                  So, what do we do next?
                  I have suggested that she goes to the CAB to see if they can help. Apart from that I dont know what to think.

                  A

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Benefits while separated

                    Sorry to see the problem has reappeared, but afraid that is not totally unexpected.
                    Whilst I can't offer practical solutions (others here are better at that than me) you may find it useful to read the DWP's internal guidance manual on living together.
                    If you know what "they" look at being forewarned is forearmed: https://www.gov.uk/government/upload...99/dmgch11.pdf

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Benefits while separated

                      Many thanks for that, there is some good information in that document.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Benefits while separated

                        There is also this information (just click 'next page' at the bottom after reading the first one )
                        http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/manuals/ccmmanual/ccm15045.htm

                        The way I see it, if you can prove you live elsewhere and prove that you do not pay for things (rent/utility bills etc...) at your ex partners address then there is nothing the decision maker can say that will mean your ex loses her benefits. It shouldn't even matter if you stay at her house for the odd night to give her a break!

                        This (http://www.revenuebenefits.org.uk/ta...ving-together/) is also very informative :tinysmile_grin_t:

                        K x
                        Debt is like any other trap, easy enough to get into, but hard enough to get out of.

                        It doesn't matter where your journey begins, so long as you begin it...

                        recte agens confido

                        ~~~~~

                        Any advice I provide is given without liability, if you are unsure please seek professional legal guidance.

                        I can be emailed if you need my help loading pictures/documents to your thread. My email address is Kati@legalbeagles.info
                        But please include a link to your thread so I know who you are.

                        Specialist advice can be sought via our sister site JustBeagle

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Benefits while separated

                          Originally posted by des8 View Post
                          Sorry to see the problem has reappeared, but afraid that is not totally unexpected.
                          Whilst I can't offer practical solutions (others here are better at that than me) you may find it useful to read the DWP's internal guidance manual on living together.
                          If you know what "they" look at being forewarned is forearmed: https://www.gov.uk/government/upload...99/dmgch11.pdf
                          That is extremely useful thanks des8 xx
                          #staysafestayhome

                          Any support I provide is offered without liability, if you are unsure please seek professional legal guidance.

                          Received a Court Claim? Read >>>>> First Steps

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Benefits while separated

                            Originally posted by Kati View Post
                            There is also this information (just click 'next page' at the bottom after reading the first one )
                            http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/manuals/ccmmanual/ccm15045.htm

                            The way I see it, if you can prove you live elsewhere and prove that you do not pay for things (rent/utility bills etc...) at your ex partners address then there is nothing the decision maker can say that will mean your ex loses her benefits. It shouldn't even matter if you stay at her house for the odd night to give her a break!

                            This (http://www.revenuebenefits.org.uk/ta...ving-together/) is also very informative :tinysmile_grin_t:

                            K x
                            Thanks for the info, much appreciated.

                            Yes, I have my own flat, rent agreement in place, council tax, utility bills...everything you would normally have for having your own property.

                            Incidentally, we did a quick calculation as to how much better or worse off financially we would be IF we were to live together and we would be around 900 pound a month better off by living together financially. But we don't live together and wouldn't live together for financial reasons, its not about that.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Benefits while separated

                              I can't see them finding against you to be honest. Just remember to keep everything as transparent as possible so they cannot accuse you of hiding anything

                              It might be worth you both having a word with your MP too - just to see if they will write to the benefits agency in support of your ex's claim and asserting your truthfulness as to your living arrangements ('official' intervention can work wonders )
                              Debt is like any other trap, easy enough to get into, but hard enough to get out of.

                              It doesn't matter where your journey begins, so long as you begin it...

                              recte agens confido

                              ~~~~~

                              Any advice I provide is given without liability, if you are unsure please seek professional legal guidance.

                              I can be emailed if you need my help loading pictures/documents to your thread. My email address is Kati@legalbeagles.info
                              But please include a link to your thread so I know who you are.

                              Specialist advice can be sought via our sister site JustBeagle

                              Comment

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