Urgent Help please - Payday loan

[burmacat]

Hello

I am new to this forum but am in need of urgent help.

I am currently fighting Cash Genie - just been through mediation and the £628 they are requesting, they say they will accept an out of court settlement of £300 to be paid in £50 installments.

How ever they have had £429 in roll over fees over 11 months plus they took an unauthorised payment of £142 from my account last year.

The loan was originally £150 plus £45 interest. So as you can see I have already paid more than this back in charges and interest.

I have just found out i am pregnant so all this worry is not doing me much good. I dont know whether to accept the offer of £300 or go to court in March?

My mediator advised that if I lose I could have to pay up to £800 in charges etc. and that if I cant pay it in one lump sum then I will have a CCJ on my name.

In a right pickle and need to give my decision today.

Help will be very very much appreciated

[berniel]

Re: Urgent Help please - Payday loan

Hello
This is one of those occasions when it is difficult to give advice.
If this were me, I would tell them to stuff it. I would let them take me to court and try and justify charging me anything over what is due under the contract, and if they could, then get them to justify it again under the unfair terms conditions of the CCA.
But I am not in your position, if you can afford these repayments and if they assure you that no further interest will be added and in view that this course has been recommended under the administration procedure you may feel it is as well to accept.
Bernie

[burmacat]

Re: Urgent Help please - Payday loan

If this helps this is the agreement that they forwarded over to me after requesting.

If you think best to pay, I can see from your previous posts your advice if very good, so probs the best thing to do

Fixed-Sum Loan Agreement Regulated by the
Consumer Credit Act 1974
This Agreement being, agreement number xxxxxx is made on 2010-03-12 16:25:48 between:
Us, Cash Genie U.K Ltd (The Creditor)
Of Dalton House
60 Windsor Avenue
London
SW19 2RR
Company Registration Number: 07005622
Credit Consumer Licence Number: 0630949
Data Protection Act License Number:
Z195632X
And Miss xxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxxx

Your Employment Details are: Your Company:
Status: Full-Time Employment
Job Title:
Time at Company: 2-4 Years
Work Telephone: xxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
KEY FINANCIAL INFORMATION
Amount of Credit: £150.00
Duration of Agreement: 19 days
Total Amount Repayable: £195.00 to be repaid in a single payment on 31/03/2010
APR: 15,403%
OTHER FINANCIAL INFORMATION
Total Charge of Credit: 30 pence for every 100 pence borrowed, per part or full month that a balance remains
outstanding.
Interest is charged at the rate of 30% per month or part thereof [fixed], and applied to the balance
outstanding each month on the date of this Agreement.
KEY INFORMATION
If you breach this Agreement, our charges are as follows:
1. If you do not re-pay the loan on time you will have to pay the following charges:
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• An administration charge of £15.00;
• £12.00 per letter or e-mail correspondence with you requiring payment;
• the APR will continue to be charged from the first day that your loan is outstanding until the loan is
repaid.
2. If you move or change your contact details without telling us:
• our reasonable costs and expenses incurred in tracing you and verifying your new address which will be
charged at £45.00 per search but is not limited to a single search if we cannot locate you or verify your
new address.
3. You must also pay us all reasonable costs and expenses incurred in taking steps to enforce this
agreement against you. If we discover that your loan application is or was fraudulent we may require that the
total amount repayable is re-paid immediately.
IMPORTANT - READ THIS SECTION CAREFULLY TO FIND OUT
ABOUT YOUR RIGHTS
The Consumer Credit act 1974 lays down certain requirements for your protection which should have been
complied with when this agreement was made. If they were not, the lender cannot enforce this agreement
without a court order.
This Act also gives you a number of rights. You can settle this agreement at any time by giving notice in
writing and paying off the amount you owe under this agreement.
If you would like more information about your rights under this act, contact your local Trading Standards
Department or a Citizens’ Advice Bureau.
MISSING PAYMENTS
Missing payments may have serious consequences and may make obtaining further credit difficult.
If you become aware that you are unable to fulfil your obligations of repayment, please contact us at your
earliest opportunity to discuss this matter, where options may be available. Any offer made will not supersede
the terms of this agreement and will be made on a goodwill basis of which we reserve the right to enforce the
full terms and remove the goodwill offer at anytime.
YOUR INFORMATION
We are the data controller in respect of your personal information. We will process your personal information
in accordance with the Data Protection Act 1998. Please read clauses 12 and 13 of our terms and conditions
and our Privacy Policy for further details of how we will use your information before you sign this agreement.
Upon making a decision to lend to you, it may be necessary to contact you by telephone. Calls may be
recorded for training and fraud prevention. We may send you information about our products and others
which may be of interest to you. We may also pass your information to other businesses to allow them to
send details of their products to you. You have a right at any time to stop us from contacting you or giving
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details to others for these purposes by writing to us.
CANCELLATION RIGHTS
You have the right to cancel your agreement within 14 days of our acceptance of this agreement by writing to
us at the above address. Please see clause 15 of our terms and conditions for further details of your right to
cancel.
You must inform us immediately if:
• You change address
• You change your name
• You change employment or your pay date changes
• You change email address
• You change bank accounts
• You change any debit card information we hold.
Consent to Electronic Communications:
By signing this loan agreement, you agree that subject to any applicable law or regulation, any notice, record
or other type of communication / information that is provided to you in connection with this loan agreement
may be sent electronically, namely by email to the address you have provided in your loan agreement or any
other email address that it becomes apparent you have access to.
Debit Authority
We will attempt to debit repayments agreed to under this agreement on the Payment Date. It is your
responsibility to ensure that the full payment is made on the Payment Date. If for any reason the funds are
not available on the Payment Date, you authorise Cash Genie UK Ltd to continue to attempt repayment of the
loan from any debit / credit card that we hold on your account as frequently and as often as we reasonably
choose, in any denominations up until the total outstanding balance is recovered.
We may transfer all our rights or any of our rights under this agreement.
Complaints
We hope that you do not have a reason to complain about our service, Cash Genie UK Ltd has a complaints
procedure and in the event that you have any concerns, or complaints, please write to Cash Genie UK Ltd,
Dalton House, 60 Windsor Avenue, London. SW19 2RR in the first instance. If you remain unhappy with our
decision, Cash Genie UK Ltd is a member of The BCCA (British Cheque Cashers Association) and adopts
fully its complaint procedure. Further details can be found on their website, BCCA or telephone
01244 505904, email info@bcca.co.uk or write to Chief Executive, BCCA, PO BOX 3414, Chester, CH1
9BF.If you still remain unhappy, you may have the right to refer your complaint to the Financial Ombudsman
Service, (FOS) Quay Plaza, 183 Marsh Wall, London, E14 9SR or telephone 0845 080 1800. You would
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need to notify FOS within 6 months of our final decision letter.
English Law
This agreement will be governed by the laws of England and all communication will be written in English. This
agreement shall be construed according to the laws of England whose courts shall be the exclusive courts of
jurisdiction.
Electronic Signature
Electronic Communications Act of 2000 provides that electronic signatures on documents hold equivalent
legal status as traditional handwritten signatures. By completing this online application, I certify that my digital
signature is the equivalent of my handwritten signature.
By signing this agreement, you agree that you understand fully its terms and conditions and also agree to its
terms and conditions which are set out above and the terms and conditions which we send to you with this
agreement. In the event that any section may be classed as unenforceable, all other sections will still be
classed as enforceable unless deemed to be unenforceable by a court in England & Wales.
Electronically Signed: Lee
Electronic Validation Code: 409910
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This is what a gent sent from Carter Forbes

Thanks again for your help Bernie

[berniel]

Re: Urgent Help please - Payday loan

Yes you have highlighted the points of contention.
Firstly I would contend that they have no right to charge this rate past the term of the agreement.
I would say that the term” fixed sum “applies to the total amount payable and therefore should include the total charge for credit.
Any interest payable after this should be at a maximum of the statutory rate.
I do not think that this will succeed but you never know, and they may just back off before the trial because if it did it would set one hell of a precedent.
The main defence should be that these astronomically high interest rates can only be sanctioned because the term of the loan is so short, when you start to apply them to a long term agreement as is the case here the amount charged becomes” unconscionable” and unfair within the meaning of section 140 of the act.
Bernie

[Lord_Alcohol]

Re: Urgent Help please - Payday loan

Firstly, I would remove your personal info from your post above - asap!! Ah you've already done it!!

Secondly, I do not think it is lawful for a creditor to charge contractual interest beyond the period of the contract, which was for 19 days. Beyond that, the statutory (8% I think, hope someone can confirm) applies.

Thirdly, you have paid £571 of a debt of £195. It is very unlikely that a court would agree that you owe Cash Genie anything.

Fourthly, it is quite possible that Cash Genie may serve a claim. However, your defence could be;

- the total amount borrowed has been repaid 3 times over
- the interest rate is extortionate when applied beyond the contract period
- the creditor has therefore formed an unfair relationship and you require him to show that it is otherwise
- under S140, a court has powers to cause the creditor to pay you, so it may very well be worth going to court.

Fifthly, as it is likely to be small claims, costs (if you lose) are likely to be minimal (and not £800) and note that a CCJ is only registered 14 days after the judgement - you still have 2 weeks after the court hearing to do avoid registration.

Lastly, how about getting your local paper involved. A story like this might be right up their street.

Also, do not be scared by a claim - there are folk here on LB (and also over the road) that can really help - and I believe a court will be EXTREMELY sympathetic to your situation.

One other thing - has CG served any notices, such as a Default Notice or Sums in Arrears? Under CCA, the creditor can only claim interest and arrears after notifying you in the proper way.

Forgot to mention - it would be worthwhile changing banks becuase, if your bank won't help re the DD, then CG may help themselves to your money later on.

LA

[berniel]

Re: Urgent Help please - Payday loan

Firstly, I would remove your personal info from your post above - asap!! Ah you've already done it!!

Secondly, I do not think it is lawful for a creditor to charge contractual interest beyond the period of the contract, which was for 19 days. Beyond that, the statutory (8% I think, hope someone can confirm) applies.

Thirdly, you have paid £571 of a debt of £195. It is very unlikely that a court would agree that you owe Cash Genie anything.

Fourthly, it is quite possible that Cash Genie may serve a claim. However, your defence could be;

- the total amount borrowed has been repaid 3 times over
- the interest rate is extortionate when applied beyond the contract period
- the creditor has therefore formed an unfair relationship and you require him to show that it is otherwise
- under S140, a court has powers to cause the creditor to pay you, so it may very well be worth going to court.

Fifthly, as it is likely to be small claims, costs (if you lose) are likely to be minimal (and not £800) and note that a CCJ is only registered 14 days after the judgement - you still have 2 weeks after the court hearing to do avoid registration.

Lastly, how about getting your local paper involved. A story like this might be right up their street.

Also, do not be scared by a claim - there are folk here on LB (and also over the road) that can really help - and I believe a court will be EXTREMELY sympathetic to your situation.

One other thing - has CG served any notices, such as a Default Notice or Sums in Arrears? Under CCA, the creditor can only claim interest and arrears after notifying you in the proper way.

Forgot to mention - it would be worthwhile changing banks becuase, if your bank won't help re the DD, then CG may help themselves to your money later on.

LA

Thanks LA
I think i covred most of these points in my previous post.

Unfortunately they do not have to send a default notice or notice of arrears, although they can if they want, sums due on this type of contract are in arrears.

Bernie

[Lord_Alcohol]

Re: Urgent Help please - Payday loan

There's a good thread OTR, well worth a look. Not Cash Genie but same sort of scum;

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk...ourt-papers-**

LA

[burmacat]

Re: Urgent Help please - Payday loan

Totally didnt realise my personal details were on there - woops. think someone has removed them for me. Thanks who ever did that.

I am just past myself with worry as to whether, althought I have repaid money and clearly shown that I was willing to pay, I have shown my financial difficulties by rolling this debt over for 11 months.
I dont want to go to court and the judge rule in their favour and I end up having to pay back the £628 they are claiming plus their costs (my mediator told me I would have to pay their court costs, and there travel expenses etc)
I will be more than happy to pay the remainder of what was left of the original loan amount plus one months interest, but in my condition if this is not favoured then I will be stuck with a CCJ (as I wouldnt be able to pay the full amount and would need to opt for monthly repayments) and a hefty bill to pay with a child on the way.

I requested, through my mediator, a copy of any default they served me with as I had not recieved anything. They did send over a copy of a letter that they sent me with a part detailing the default that was being served - this was never recieved by myself.

i have already changed my bank - did this some time ago, so they cannot get any further funds as before.

Just on to my local paper via email now - great advice thanks again

Your help is very much appreciated

[berniel]

Re: Urgent Help please - Payday loan

Also regarding fees
Part 27 of the Civil Procedure Rules sets out the maximum costs which a judge can order a party to pay. Whether or not the judge will order a party to pay costs is ultimately a matter for him.

The costs awarded may depend on a number of factors including the relative financial status of the parties and their behaviour before and during court proceedings. If any costs awarded by the judge do not cover the expenses actually incurred, the party will have to pay them out of their own pocket.
The judge may consider the fact that the recommendations of the mediation were ignored to be a factor when deciding on costs should you loose.

Just looking at all the angles

Bernie

[burmacat]

Re: Urgent Help please - Payday loan

Just to make all aware also, I did offer £200 in mediation (as I did not want this to go to court) but they declined the offer

[Lord_Alcohol]

Re: Urgent Help please - Payday loan

Burmacat

OK, so there is no court claim yet? Is your mediator CAB?

So there was a default notice - good. Can you post it up? If there is a default notice then it is likely that the agreement was subsequently terminated and contractual interest no longer applies. I don't think it does anyway beyond the contract period, as Bernie has indicated.

If we can see your DN then it might reveal some defects, and would at least help us to understand their claim.

Do you know where the £628 comes from? Has CG itemised their 'claim' (assuming no court claim is served yet)?

Glad you'vre sorted the bank and contacted the papers!

LA

[berniel]

Re: Urgent Help please - Payday loan

Burmacat

OK, so there is no court claim yet? Is your mediator CAB?

So there was a default notice - good. Can you post it up? If there is a default notice then it is likely that the agreement was subsequently terminated and contractual interest no longer applies. I don't think it does anyway beyond the contract period, as Bernie has indicated.

If we can see your DN then it might reveal some defects, and would at least help us to understand their claim.

Do you know where the £628 comes from? Has CG itemised their 'claim' (assuming no court claim is served yet)?

Glad you'vre sorted the bank and contacted the papers!

LA

LA this kind of agreement does not require a default notice.
All payments due are due in arears, you only need to issue a default notice under the CCA if you are asking for early payments of sums due under a contract.
Bernie

[Lord_Alcohol]

Re: Urgent Help please - Payday loan

The OP has already indicated that there is a default notice of some description.

I agree Bernie, but it may help to look at any notices the OC has served, if only to better understand what the claim actually is.

There is also the possibility that the OP had entered into a further agreement with the OC to repay an agreed amount monthly, which may bring the question of DNs into play.

[burmacat]

Re: Urgent Help please - Payday loan

I have attached what they apparently sent me.

Hope this helps

Got to let my mediator no in less than 1 hour if I will accept the £300 offer or go to court.

I apologise I have not said before, my mediation was last thursday and I appear in court on March 6th if I decide not to pay

Thanks again

[Lord_Alcohol]

Re: Urgent Help please - Payday loan

Burmacat

Can you get rid of the personal data in your letter asap?

This is only a demand for money with no justification - was there no other notice served or even a breakdown of costs?

Also, has a claim been served? How do you know you are in court next month if no claim is served?

Can we see the claim form (minus personal info!)?

Personally I would not pay CG anything and would submit a defence, but you may prefer to avoid the perceived scariness of court. If we can see the claim then that would help.


LA