High court writ

[Mitchell2002]

High court writ from marstons regarding southern water debt. No CCJ received, have acted immediately since receiving the letter from marstons.
Paper free billing never had anything through the post. Bill has sky rocketed, huge mess.
Hceo visit imminent, southern water are not following code of conduct as they sate no matter where in the recovery we will always endeavour to reach a payment plan and halt proceedings.
They tell me to call marstons who want full amount of £4100!
No way in hell can we pull that money out the bag?!
Won't be letting bailiff in, five children in the house, partner does work. Income not great but no benefits eligible.
Should we apply for an n244 to have the enforcement stopped and attempt a payment plan through the courts??
Considering an IVA as last resort.
Southern water refused to speak anymore today, after asking repeatedly why they are going against their own code of conduct. Was told as the conversation is being recorded they can't say anymore?? Tried speaking with a superior to no avail.
Debtline have advised that they can take the debt back and to put a complaint in?
The letter marstons has sent isn't signed, the enforcement agents number is not recognised in the bailiff register online either.
Marstons state they will only speak once entry is granted. But debtline have advised not to do that under any circumstances.
Don't know what to do??

[ploddertom]

Re: High court writ

How far back does this go?
Thought there was a restriction on back billing?
I'm not up to speed on the above but hope others may comment,

As for Southern Water I assume you are talking to the billing dept - they will not want to know as if they take the account back then they become liable for the fees. You probably need to go through this page to see if you qualify for any of their schemes https://www.southernwater.co.uk/diff...ying-your-bill & the number you probably need is @ https://www.southernwater.co.uk/contact-us-needs

Marstons only involvement is for enforcement only, they will know nothing about the background. The only way to halt them is to pay in full, apply for a Stay of Execution or for SW to stop them. Unlike some other dbts Marstons in this case are commanded to visit which in turn increases the debt because of the fee they can then charge. As it is for a residential property they have no automatic right of entry - unless you allow them in which is not something to be advised. They can however remove any items of value outside - usually a car - so keep well hidden.

[Mitchell2002]

Re: High court writ

Thanks for the reply. Yes we do qualify for the new start scheme as debt is over £500 and no payment made in the last two years...but sw do not want to do this as it has gone too far, even refused to speak anymore. Partner stumped them on the phone when relaying information from their own code of conduct and debtlines advice. They replied as this is being recorded I can't answer you??? Said to speak to Marstons.
I've filled the N244 to have the enforcement suspended and judgement varied.
Seems insane that it's got to go like this, the fees from bailiff will hike the debt massively, hardly helpful in getting is out of debt 🤔
We don't drive so car isn't a problem luckily!
Such a mess

[Amethyst]

Re: High court writ

If you hadn't received the court papers to begin with then you could apply for the judgment to be set aside rather than varied.

Is this 'debt' from your current or old address ?

Seems like a large debt for water - ours is £330 a year so would take more than 10 years to get to that amount.

Did you ask for paperless billing ?

[Mitchell2002]

Re: High court writ

Current address, in partners name not mine. We aren't married so I'm not liable for it but obv we live here together with children. SW are saying that it was sent, if it was it would have been dealt with. Same as the bills nothing through the post, this is the one thing that should come direct from his account everything else is in my name and comes from my account. Annoyed at him for not noticing no payments for the last 5 years and myself for not even checking it 😩
The court is miles away up north too! We live in the south, having to ask if it can be transferred to local court. It's gonna cost £200 for a day off work court fees and travel. All of which could go towards paying. No sense??

[Amethyst]

Re: High court writ

The court would be Northampton - that's just a bulk processing centre and if it went to a hearing it would be transferred to your local court. Not receiving any court papers is a good reason for having it set aside - at least the application will put a hold on enforcement so take that pressure off. Although it's going to be your word against theirs and the court that it didn't arrive if the address was correct.

It is likely that once you get it set aside, if you do, you'd have to make an arrangement with SW to pay the arrears and cover your current bills. I suppose if there's no defence (ie the billing is correct and you've just missed that payments haven't been being made) then you would end up just making an offer to pay with the court and have the order varied to installments. Have you actually seen a copy of the judgment order, and was it a forthwith order or installment ?

I'm not actually sure on the rules re back billing when there is paperless billing. They do email you once a new bill comes out though so presumably that is enough to cover them. Just searched my emails and found an unread notification of the new bill from back in March ! It is easy to forget about water once you've switched it to paperless you hear nothing at all, we had court papers last year, but sorted an arrangement. I just checked online and everything is going okay - so thanks for the nudge. I think I'll ask them to go back to paper as well as it seems a lot safer. Your OH isn't the only rubbish one, I've taken over all the bills now cause he'd keep mucking it up and getting us in poop so I'd have to keep checking with him, which was getting a bit tiresome. lol.

[ploddertom]

Re: High court writ

Not receiving any court papers is a good reason for having it set aside - at least the application will put a hold on enforcement so take that pressure off. The only way enforcement will be put on hold is if the Stay has actually been granted, it is insufficient just to make an application. Although it's going to be your word against theirs and the court that it didn't arrive if the address was correct.

It is likely that once you get it set aside, if you do, you'd have to make an arrangement with SW to pay the arrears and cover your current bills. I suppose if there's no defence (ie the billing is correct and you've just missed that payments haven't been being made) then you would end up just making an offer to pay with the court and have the order varied to installments. Have you actually seen a copy of the judgment order, and was it a forthwith order or installment ?

The downside is that if the debt is owed then the Court may well be reluctant to grant Set Aside as all that is happening is that one CCJ is being swapped for another.

[Mitchell2002]

Re: High court writ

I'm just going to do the n244 to stop enforcement and vary judgment. Marstons want full payment, which is utterly impossible, not refusing to pay, but reasonable payments only.
Have looked into ofwats guidelines regarding water board standards and again at southern waters code of conduct. Both state a customer shouldn't be put in a worse situation and payment negotiations should be put in place to help. I just don't see how adding massive amounts to an already huge debt is going to get them money any quicker? Just puts us in a worse situation to pay, and sends us in circles.
A manager from sw is going to be ringing partner back to 'discuss' but the n244 I think is the only thing that will help unfortunately?

[ploddertom]

Re: High court writ

How are you getting on with your N244? These are better submitted in person rather than post. Are you entitled to fee rmission as the application cost is £255.

[Mitchell2002]

Re: High court writ

Hi, it's almost done and not possible to deliver in person. It's too far away, the cost is £50 to stay and vary the writ. I'm not setting it aside as dont dispute the debt. Just need enforcement to be stopped and reasonable payment plan.
Had a visit today from marstons. He didn't knock, posted the letter and drove off. Added £520 though! His name is on this (wasn't on the enforcement notice) and mobile number but hce number isn't on it and his name isn't recognised in any of the registries online!?
Finished letter of complaint to southern water as they aren't adhering to there own code of practice not ofwats guide for water boards regarding debt. Plus marstons who are representing them are a joke so far!
No doubt fall on blind eyes, as have the phone calls have on deaf ears.

[ploddertom]

Re: High court writ

Hi, it's almost done and not possible to deliver in person. It's too far away, the cost is £50 to stay and vary the writ. I'm not setting it aside as dont dispute the debt. Just need enforcement to be stopped and reasonable payment plan.

Unsure where you are getting your info from but it is plainly wrong.

You can apply for this at your local County Court that acts as District Registry of the High Court or alternatively hand in at the Royal Courts of Justice in the Strand, London. Cost for a Variation Order may be £50 but does not act in applying for a Stay - that is a different Form altogether. Even an application without a Hearing costs £100 but usually these do need to be heard in person. What grounds have you used to apply for a Stay? Are you in receipt of Benefits or on a low wage. If so you may be able to apply to have the fees waived in full or in part - see Forms EX160a & EX160c for details.

[Mitchell2002]

Re: High court writ

😩 debtline
They said to fill the n244 apply for a stay and variation and send it to the court that issued it which is up north. Aslo put on the form that we request it be transferred locally for the hearing.
Set aside would mean we dispute the debt wouldn't it? We do owe the money.
CCJ was never received though sent but they didn't send via any service that recorded it, just Standard post. The enforcement notice was the first thing we received bringing the mess to our attention.

[Amethyst]

Re: High court writ

Should be N245 ?? [MENTION=26498]ploddertom[/MENTION] - https://formfinder.hmctsformfinder.j...k/n245-eng.pdf if you're not applying to set aside and want to put the warrant on hold and vary the order.
N244 is a general application ( for applying to set aside etc)

[ploddertom]

Re: High court writ

An N245 is to suspend a Warrant of Control - basically to stop the County Court Bailiff & as it is a dual purpose you may also apply for a Variation Order to make payment by instalments - the Court can instruct what the payment will be if there is disagreement.

A High Court Writ of Control can be Stayed by application to either the actual High Court in London or a County Court that acts as a District Registry of the High Court. In this case the the original Judgment has been transferred for Enforcement only and all other matters still come under the auspices of the County Court. An application can be made for a Stay of Execution on Form N244 but must be accompanied by the grounds for doing so which can be as simple as not being able to afford the fees demanded by the HCEO.

There is a misconception about which Form to use but the Enforcement Section of the Queens Bench Division do say it has to be on an N244. In this case it appears that someone has given the OP some incorrect information about the fee that has to be paid - £50 - and given the seriousness of the situation then this will only delay the application or alternatively the Court may misunderstand what they are actually asking for.

[Amethyst]

Re: High court writ

Thank you xx Would it be the standard application fees ?