CCJ for old debt - have no idea what to do

[lowlowlola]

Hi All

I would be grateful for some advice as to how best to proceed , i will try and make a long story short

i got into a mess in 2006 joined a CCCS dmp and paid the majority of my debts off, tbh by 2011 I was exhausted by 5 years of living on the bread line, most of my debts were paid off and there were a couple left with amounts owing which were typically made up of PPI and charges (no i didn't pursue a claim) so i gave up and nothing really happened apart from the odd threat o'gram. Stupid I know

I have been receiving the odd letter from capquest and ignored them. today i got a ccj claim form for £9000. This i think relates to a RBScredit card debt it is not clear from the form. the card was taken out in 1995 and which at the date i started the dmp i owed £12000, this escalated to £16000 as they applied charges, interest and PPI charges for 4 years from the start of the DMP, RBS only issued a default in 2010. in total i paid £9K towards the debt and stopped paying in April 2011, so i realise i am 3 years away from it being statue barred

so at best i feel owe them £3k and i do really want to dispute it on these grounds

1) they continued to add charges and interest even though they knew i was on and had accepted my DMP thus escalating the debt and the amount showing does not reflect what was actually owed

2) I have made substantial payment towards the debt

3) the issue of the original default does not reflect the date when i informed them of my financial difficulties and they accepted the DMP

4) Capquest are contesting under the name Lloyds banking group and I have not had any correspondence with lloyds or acknowledged any debt

my questions are
1) how do i dispute this
2) do i have any grounds at all or am i whistling in the wind
3) should i try and negotiate with capquest say offer them 2.5 K for what i think is outstanding - but i would need to pay over a year

i really dont want a CCJ as it could affect my future employment prospects

any help would be gratefully received

[FlamingParrot]

Re: CCJ for old debt - have no idea what to do

Hi and welcome

I have been receiving the odd letter from capquest and ignored them. today i got a ccj claim form for £9000. This i think relates to a RBScredit card debt it is not clear from the form.

Do you think you could scan, take a picture, or type the particulars of claim? :typing:

the card was taken out in 1995 and which at the date i started the dmp i owed £12000, this escalated to £16000 as they applied charges, interest and PPI charges for 4 years from the start of the DMP, RBS only issued a default in 2010. in total i paid £9K towards the debt and stopped paying in April 2011, so i realise i am 3 years away from it being statue barred

so at best i feel owe them £3k and i do really want to dispute it on these grounds

Do bear in mind that if you make a part admission to a claim, you'd get a CCJ for the part you admit :scared: so it's best to state your intention to defend it in full to start with.

4) Capquest are contesting under the name Lloyds banking group and I have not had any correspondence with lloyds or acknowledged any debt

Could this be for a loan or card you had with Lloyds instead of RBS? Capquest are debt purchasers and would have bought the account from either. You really need to get hold of documents to prove this debt!

my questions are

1) how do i dispute this

Start by acknowledging the claim (you can usually do it online using the P/W provided on the claim). Tick the box saying you'll defend it in full. You have 14 days (+ 5 for service) from DATE ON CLAIM to acknowledge, but there's no reason not to do it as soon as you can. You'll have a further 14 days to prepare a defence. :clock:

2) do i have any grounds at all or am i whistling in the wind
3) should i try and negotiate with capquest say offer them 2.5 K for what i think is outstanding - but i would need to pay over a year

i really dont want a CCJ as it could affect my future employment prospects

any help would be gratefully received

Don't offer anything yet, what you need to do is request documents to see where you stand with this. :thumb: For now state your intention to defend and send the letters I'll post shortly. :typing:

[FlamingParrot]

Re: CCJ for old debt - have no idea what to do

Send the following CCA request letter to Capquest, with a PO for £1. Sign digitally using a computer font and send recorded delivery. They have 14 days to respond. Who are the solicitors acting for them? You should send them a copy (without the fee).

Dear Sirs

Ref: xxxxxxxx

I hereby formally request a copy of my Consumer Credit Agreement, pursuant to s.77-79 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (CCA1974).

I require you to provide me with a true copy of the credit agreement relating to the above account, together with any other documentation the Act requires you to provide. I expect you to comply fully and properly with this request, within the statutory time limit (12 + 2 days).

If it is your view that you are not the creditor, s.175 of the CCA1974 applies in the case of a simple assignment, and places a duty upon you to pass this request to the creditor. In the case of an absolute assignment, you are a creditor as defined by s.189. If you contend that you purchased the rights but not the duties of any agreement, you are reminded that s.189 of the Act is clear that an assignment is of both rights and duties. Your attention is drawn to ss.5(2), 3(b), 6 and 7 of the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 (CPUTR).
In line with recent OFT Guidance (issued Oct 2010) surrounding Unenforceability, I presume you're aware that the OFT has stipulated that 'sections 77-79 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 outline the information creditors must provide to debtors under fixed-term, running account & Hire Agreements'. This simply means that under these sections a debtor can pay £1 to get:

• a copy of their agreement
• copies of some of the other documents mentioned in their agreement
• a statement of account

If this information is not provided within 12 working days the debt becomes unenforceable. This means a creditor cannot:

• make the debtor pay the debt before they're supposed to
• get a court judgment against the debtor

So, in line with the OFT Guidance, and the Consumer Credit Act, please find attached my £1 payment, which is the statutory fee - note that these funds are not to be used for any other purpose. If you are unable to comply fully and properly with this request, you should confirm this in writing at the earliest opportunity and return the fee.

Yours faithfully,

[FlamingParrot]

Re: CCJ for old debt - have no idea what to do

This is the CPR 31.14 request to be sent to whoever is acting for Capquest (no fee required for this one), recorded delivery. They should respond in 7 days. Amend to suit.

Dear Sirs,

Re: XXXX v YYYYY
Case No: xxxx

CPR 31.14 Request

On xx/xxx/xxxx I received the Claim Form in this case issued by you out of the Northampton County Court.

I confirm having returned my acknowledgement of service to the court in which I indicate my intention to contest your entire claim.

Please treat this letter as my request made under CPR 31.14 for the disclosure and the production of a verified and legible copy of each of the following documents mentioned in your Particulars of Claim:

1. The Agreement. Together with the relevant terms associated with that account, you will appreciate that in an ordinary case and by reason of the provisions of CPR PD 16 para 7.3, where a claim is based upon a written agreement, a copy of the contract or documents constituting the agreement should be attached to or served with the particulars of claim and the original(s) should be available at the hearing. Further, that any general conditions incorporated in the contract should also be attached.
2. The notice of assignment.
3. The default notice, compliant with 87(1) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

Although your claim is for a sum which does not exceed £10,000.00 and thus in all likelihood it will be allocated to the small claims track once I deliver my defence, however as I am unable to lodge my defence at this moment, the case has not been allocated to a track for determination upon delivering a defence, as a consequence the provisions of CPR 27(2) have no effect and you should not seek to avoid compliance with your CPR 31 duties by claiming otherwise.

You should ensure compliance with your CPR 31 duties and ensure that the documents I have requested are copied to and received by me within 7 days of receiving this letter. Your CPR 31 duties extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for the originals of the documents I have requested, the better for you to be able to verify the document's authenticity and to provide me with a legible copy. Further, where I have requested a copy of a document, the original of which is now in the possession of another person, you will have a right to possession of that document if you have mentioned it in your case. You must take immediate steps to recover and preserve it for the purpose of this case.

Where I have mentioned a document and there is in your possession more than one version of that same document owing as a result to a modification, obliteration or othermarking, or feature, each version thus will be a separate document and you must provide a copy of each version of it to me. Your obligations extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for any, and all version(s) and include an obligation to recover and preserve such version(s) that are now in the possession of a third party.

In accordance with CPR 31.15(c) I undertake to be responsible for your reasonable copying costs incurred in complying with this CPR 31.14 request.

If you require more time in which to comply with this request you must tell me in writing. You must tell me before the time for compliance with this request has expired. In telling me you require more time you must tell me what steps you have taken and propose to take in order to comply with this request and also state a date by when you will comply with this request. In addition your statement must be accompanied with a statement that you agree to an extension of the time for me to file my defence. Your extension of time must be not less than 14 days from the date when you say you will have complied with my request and you must state the new date for filing my defence.

If you are unable to comply with this request and believe that you will never be able to comply with this request you must tell me in writing.

Please note that if you should fail to comply with this request, fail to request more time or fail to agree to an extension of time for the filing of my defence, I will make an application to the court for an order that the proceedings be struck out or stayed for non-compliance and a summary costs order.

I do hope this will not be necessary and look forward to hearing from you.

Yours faithfully

[lowlowlola]

Re: CCJ for old debt - have no idea what to do

thankk so much for taking the time to help me! I am at a loss what to do and you have made me feel much better already!

it can only be for the RBS account as I had no other debts that could be that high. all payments were made direct to RBS by CCCS until i stopped and then it was sold on.

the particulars are as stated on the CCJ Claim form

the claim is for the sum of £9097 in respect of monies owing by the defendent on a credit agreement held by the defendent with
lloyds banking group
under account number XXX38L upon which the defendant failed to maintain payments

a default notice was served upon the defendant and not complied with

by virtue of sale agreement between lloyds banking group and yje claimant, the claim vested in the claimant who has genuine commercial interest. the defendant has been notified of the assignment by letter

contact drysden fairfax solicitors
thanks again

[FlamingParrot]

Re: CCJ for old debt - have no idea what to do

And finally, as you want to query the charges, you could also send the Part 18 request below. You may have to amend it to suit the details of your account and what you need to find out about charges, etc. but should give you an idea. :thumb:

IN THE xyz county court
CLAIM NO:


BETWEEN:

XXXXXXXXXX

Claimant

and

XXXXXXXXXXX

Defendant

PART 18 REQUEST FOR FURTHER INFORMATION

To: XYZ (claimant)

I have received a recent court claim from your organisation. In order to file a defence and counter claim I require some information. Given that this matter is now the subject of legal proceedings, you are obliged to disclose under the Civil Procedure Rules, the information and documents detailed below.

The information must be furnished within fourteen days of the receipt of this letter. If you fail to comply, this will be reported to the Court, a copy of this letter will be provided as evidence to the same and an Order enforcing your compliance will be sought.

Please provide full details and relevant documentation of the following:

1. Documents relating to any insurance added to the account, including the insurance contract and terms and conditions.
2. Any incidents of manual intervention in respect of each and every charge applied to the account;
3. How and when are charges applied to the account, whether automatically or by other means;
4. The Claimant’s assessment of the cost of sending letters, making phone calls, or otherwise administering the account, with details of how the cost is calculated and what items of expense are included;
5. Copies of statements for the entire duration of the credit agreement.

Yours faithfully

[FlamingParrot]

Re: CCJ for old debt - have no idea what to do

thankk so much for taking the time to help me! I am at a loss what to do and you have made me feel much better already!

it can only be for the RBS account as I had no other debts that could be that high. all payments were made direct to RBS by CCCS until i stopped and then it was sold on.

the particulars are as stated on the CCJ Claim form

the claim is for the sum of £9097 in respect of monies owing by the defendent on a credit agreement held by the defendent with
lloyds banking group

The PoC state is for a LLOYDS account. :noidea:

under account number XXX38L upon which the defendant failed to maintain payments

Is there any way you can find out which one of your accounts would match that number?

a default notice was served upon the defendant and not complied with

by virtue of sale agreement between lloyds banking group and yje claimant, the claim vested in the claimant who has genuine commercial interest. the defendant has been notified of the assignment by letter

contact drysden fairfax solicitors
thanks again

OK, you need to send the CPR 31.14 request letter and the Part 18 letter to Dryden Fairfax, by recorded delivery, so you can find out what account they are referring to and how the amount has been arrived to. :noidea: They should respond in 7 days to the CPR 31.14 request, 14 days to the Part 18 request. The sooner you send the letters, the better. If they don't respond within the allowed time, you'll have to chase them and get them to agree to an extension to file your defence. :thumb:

Send the CCA request letter to Capquest, copy Dryden Fairfax. They have 14 days to respond, but there's no need to chase this one, as non-compliance can work in your favour.

[lowlowlola]

Re: CCJ for old debt - have no idea what to do

I am an idiot it's for Bank of Scotland all the details are the same though, same amount ,same start date......silly me !

[lowlowlola]

Re: CCJ for old debt - have no idea what to do

Dear All

*Update and questions*

just an update of where i am:

• [*=center]CCA sent to capquest and copy sent to DF solicitors
  [*=center]CPR 31.15 and section 18 sent to DF and copy sent to Capquest
• SAR sent to BOS

all sent recorded all received have printed out confirmation and filed with letters (sent each one separately so they cant deny receipt )

I would be grateful if you could help with a couple of queries:
1) Timings: CCJ claim was issued on 18th Feb therefore i make the latest date for response 22nd March (28+5 = 33 days from date of claim) is that correct?
2) "chasing the CPR 31.15. I sent the letter on 24th it was signed for on 26th - do i count 7 days from postage or receipt? I am assuming i chase the solicitors in the first instance though i suspect they will have just forwarded it to capquest

3) requesting extensions I am assuming that i request the extension to defend my case from 14 days of the section 18 and CCA being sent? (again is that the date of sending or receipt) as i know this can take time

4) My defence I very much doubt they will have the signed credit agreement as this was issued in 1997 or 8 - i understand that they can in these instances send an unsigned updated copy am i right that i can refuse this as part of my defence ?

I want to get my defence up and running this weekend so I have time to prepare adequately. I am preparing on the basis that they will not have the paper work to prove the debt and how it has been calculated . I understand that i must refer to the key points of law so am proposing to draft as follows (will put into legalese over the weekend but just want to make sure I am on the right line)

1) That the particulars of the claim are vague and do not allow me to file a proper defence
2) i have had a relationship with BoS but did not enter into any contract with capquest
3) i cant defend the contract as one has not been supplied I have asked them for it and given adequate time but they have not complied as per CPR 31.15
4) the claiment has not stated when the contract started or how the sums have owed have been calculated
4) the claiment has not supplied documents reasonably claimed for and has yet to show proof of
a) that a credit agreement was entered into with capquest
b) how the sum owed is calculated
c) that they have been assigned the debt

does that sound right

thanks again for all your help - I am very grateful