Threatened with bailiff visit - over old credit card bill?

[charlesprime]

Hi all

Small bit of background:
Not a fan ot a huge fan of debt collecting companies, the way they bend and break the law, and the way they feed of people’s bones.
Regarding letters over credit card debt, I’ve always been told & have seen posts that invariably say “Ignore these letters”, “Do not write or telephone them, as this means you are acknowledging the debt”.

Also - I’ve always “understood” that unless it’s a local authority (parking fine / council tax etc) or a government (tax etc) issue, then debt collecting companies are sort of toothless: credit card debt is unsecured and - as it’s not a government debt, or a car that can be towed away - the credit card companies don’t have a leg to stand on.
I mean, they can get a CCJ against you and mess up your credit rating, but that’s it really.
So - if we assume that somebody doesn’t mind a bad credit rating - that’s the worst that can happen.

Thats what I thought.

But then I had a letter from the “County Court Business Centre”, St Katherine House, NN1 2LH (strangely, I live quite near this court), discussing a court judgement. The amount is around £1,800.
Part of the text said that “if you ignore this order your goods may be removed and sold”. (I noted the word "may").

For some reason, right or wrong, I ignored this letter.

Then I got a letter from “Mortimer Clark Solicitors”, referring to the “Judgement”.
The letter says,


"We still have not received any payment proposals from you so weak re instructed to apply a warrant of control to be made against you should you fail to make any satisfactory payment proposals within X days...
...If an acceptable payment is offers not made, an application will be made to the County Court to instruct a bailiff to seek payment from you, which would ultimately include attending your property to remove goods to auction” etc.

Now I feel that this isn’t true, and they can’t send bailiffs for simple credit card debt (it’s unsecured - the credit card took a risk), and that bailiffs (for simple card debt, anyway) have no right to enter your property.
Credit card companies (and these debt collecting companies that buy up debt from them) - they’re just private companies, and they don’t have the power of local government, say for council tax etc.. They are all bark and no bite.



Am I wrong?
Setting aside any moral judgement of me, can I continue to ignore this?


Thanks for reading!

[atticus]

Only ignore it if you prefer to continue to bury your head in the sand.

You have a county court judgement against you. It can be enforced by bailiffs.

[charlesprime]

Kind of you to reply. Thanks.

I’ve sometimes caught those programmes on TV called “Can’t Pay, We’ll take it Away” or whatever they’re called, and the debt never seems to be credit cards.
I was under the (possibly false?) impression that bailiffs don’t have as much power as people think, and that you don’t have to allow them entry.

Of course I am coming from a position where I am against these kind of companies, but setting aside that moral position (whether one agrees with me or not), people do have rights, and I suppose these rights are what I am asking about.

What rights do I have?
I mean, if ultimately I just don’t allow anybody into my home (for such a small amount), what is the end situation?

Indulge me here - just a legal exercise, as it were:

It’s not like anybody can arrest me. Is it?
Let’s assume that I don’t mind a bad credit rating (say, I have enough money to not require credit, for the sake of argument), and I take a moral position on these debt-buying companies. I'm intransigent about it.
So say, for example, I just don’t allow bailiffs in, and I exercise my right not to.

As an “endgame” - what is the worst these companies can then do?



Thanks Mr Finch

[atticus]

You're welcome

[charlesprime]

Thank you.


I was sort of trying to say “"Let’s assume that I don’'t care about a credit rating"”.

I genuinely don’t care about it.
I've had a bad credit rating for years, but have still done OK.

Going back to my question though, (if we see this as a legal brain-teaser, as it were) as an “endgame” - what is the worst these companies can then do?

I mean if I refuse entry etc.


Thanks again!

[atticus]

Bailiffs.
Charging order over property.
Attachment of earnings.
Third Party debt order.

The Civil Procedure Rules contain the full list of enforcement methods available to a judgement creditor.

[charlesprime]

Thank you again.



You mention "enforcement" and creditor".
However, "enforcement" agents can only enter premises by the usual route, normally the door.
They must not climb through open windows.
They can't break in.
Legally, the enforcement agent must not force entry to residential premises to enforce a writ or a warrant of control for a judgment debt unless:
the debtor has breached a valid controlled goods agreement, or:
a warrant authorising reasonable force has been issued by the court

Of course technically they are a "creditor", but that word sounds like a decent, upright citizen like a tradesman that's suffered because a conman has run off, not a rapacious, law-breaking leech-like company that buys up debts for pennies.


I am suggesting that we should always be aware of our rights and stand up for them, and bailiffs can't just randomly "enforce" - break people's doors down for small amounts of money.... well, in some cases, unless:

the debtor has breached a valid controlled goods agreement, or:
a warrant authorising reasonable force has been issued by the court

As it's unlikely either of those 2 things will come to pass, do you see my point?

I'm not Al Capone. It's about £1800.
They have no end game.


Unless you see me doing porridge for this?


Thank you