Lowell/Lloyds TSB/BW Legal

[Bigsis]

Re: Lowell/Lloyds TSB/BW Legal

Thanks Amethyst,

Never been to court before so its a bit daunting. As I've been sorting this out for my son, would I be able to speak on his behalf, otherwise I'm going to have to get him legally up to speed.

Hopefully they'll discontine or get struck out. Do I need to take copies of the witness statements etc or will everyone already have them. If I type up notes (as I won't remember all the legal jargon when the nerves kick in) will I be able to refer to them for guidance.

I've booked off next Thursday and Friday as its a 3 hour train ride to my sons County Court. I won't book the tickets till next week in case things change.

[Bigsis]

Re: Lowell/Lloyds TSB/BW Legal

Thanks M1

Oh boy, seems I've got alot of reading to do this weekend. As this is most likely to be an overdraft default and not quite the same as credit card or loans, will the info you've mentioned still apply.

[mystery1]

Re: Lowell/Lloyds TSB/BW Legal

All of it bar s77.

M1

[Bigsis]

Re: Lowell/Lloyds TSB/BW Legal

Can I just ask a quick question: would I be allowed into the hearing and can I speak on behalf of my son at the hearing?

[ncf355]

Re: Lowell/Lloyds TSB/BW Legal

Shouldn't be a problem

See this

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/McKenzie_friend

[Amethyst]

Re: Lowell/Lloyds TSB/BW Legal

You will need to ask the courts permission to speak on your sons behalf before the hearing starts.

Law Society Guidance http://www.lawsociety.org.uk/advice/...-person/#lip61

[Bigsis]

Re: Lowell/Lloyds TSB/BW Legal

Well we had the hearing today, Lowell sent solicitor who introduced himself and said the claimants still had not got the documents we requested. He said he would be asking for a further 28 - 42 days for Lowell to get them.

I asked court usher if I could speak on my sons behalf as a 'McKenzie friend', he said he would speak to Judge.

We went in and Judge said I was there as a support to my son but didnt say I could speak on his behalf. He asked my son if he had put in a defence and he said no. He said you need a defence to bring this to court, you have to have some form of defence.My son said he was waiting for documents from Lowell to know what he was defending. He said you are doing this in the wrong order. You need to put in a defence first. He said did you have an acct with TSB - yes, did you borrow money from them - no, well thats your defence. I asked if I could speak but he really didn't want me to, I said he needs to know what the debt is before he can defend, he told me I was not helping matters! He told my son to have a defense, it could be one line or 20 pages, you have to have your defense in place so that the other side can provide the evidence of the contract or
agreement. Solicitor asked for 28 - 42 days for his client to produce the documents requested. Judge ruled that my son must put in a defence by 14th May and Lowell must produce documents by 30th May.

[mystery1]

Re: Lowell/Lloyds TSB/BW Legal

It doesn't help if the Judge is wrong and it's harder to convince the judge when he doesn't really want you to speak and your son doesn't really know.

I suspect he was proceeding on the assumption that it was small claims when clearly cpr 26 had not yet been applied and cpr 27.1 says/implies that the rest of cpr 27 doesn't apply unless cpr 26 has been performed.

I suspect your best course of action is to do as the judge ordered and hope they fail.

I would appeal myself but it would mean a larger outlay and obviously a bigger risk. I'm obstinate , though.

M1

[bluebottle]

Re: Lowell/Lloyds TSB/BW Legal

If Lowells continue to stretch things out, my inclination would be to go for strike-out. However, that is my own view.

[Bigsis]

Re: Lowell/Lloyds TSB/BW Legal

Thanks M1 and BB for your replies, haven't been on here for a few days as I needed not to think about it, still a bit shell shocked with Judges negative attitude towards us. We felt he had made assumptions about us right from the start by saying he knew people take this course of action when they know they owe a debt in order to avoid paying it. Also the fact that he thought it unlikely Lowell would be able to produce the documents and would probably have to produce a speciman of what would have been signed and he would have to judge on the probability of whether it had been signed or not!

Is there a template or particular format to use for a defense, any advise on how to word it correctly?

[mystery1]

Re: Lowell/Lloyds TSB/BW Legal

Not surprised.

Did the judge mention small claims track at all or give any reason for defence then evidence ?

What about costs ?

Is the case now allocated ?

M1

[pt2537]

Re: Lowell/Lloyds TSB/BW Legal

Thanks M1 and BB for your replies, haven't been on here for a few days as I needed not to think about it, still a bit shell shocked with Judges negative attitude towards us. We felt he had made assumptions about us right from the start by saying he knew people take this course of action when they know they owe a debt in order to avoid paying it. Also the fact that he thought it unlikely Lowell would be able to produce the documents and would probably have to produce a speciman of what would have been signed and he would have to judge on the probability of whether it had been signed or not!

Is there a template or particular format to use for a defense, any advise on how to word it correctly?

This sadly is the view some Judges take.

It seems to happen with litigants in person more than it does with those who are represented. I have never had a judge take that view with a case ive dealt with but its sad that Judges do take such a stance with litigants

[Guest]

Re: Lowell/Lloyds TSB/BW Legal

This sadly is the view some Judges take.

It seems to happen with litigants in person more than it does with those who are represented. I have never had a judge take that view with a case ive dealt with but its sad that Judges do take such a stance with litigants

Wasn't Frost a similar scenario ?

[Bigsis]

Re: Lowell/Lloyds TSB/BW Legal

Hi M1

No he didn't mention small claims track, costs or allocation. He was just adamant we should have put forward a defence first, so Lowell could then tell us what the debt was for and for them to produce documents to prove it. I asked how should we word this defence, he said say when you opened the acct and when you closed it, that you didn't have a loan or credit card etc. They need something from you to reply to. I wanted to say I thought that was the purpose of CPR31.15, but felt I'd got on the wrong side of him already.

[pt2537]

Re: Lowell/Lloyds TSB/BW Legal

Wasn't Frost a similar scenario ?

No im talking about discovery applications where the Claimant fails to provide documents mentioned in the Claim form.

Frost was an entirely different matter with different facts as youre aware having read the judgment.