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Compounded debt (from thin air) in 6 yrs: Sixt> eCollect AG > Themys & Dyke GbR

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  • Compounded debt (from thin air) in 6 yrs: Sixt> eCollect AG > Themys & Dyke GbR

    Hi,

    Sharing my experience of dealing with a whole lot of agony, harrasing emails, and a compounding debt, all stemming from a bogus charge by Sixt rent a car Italy.

    **2017 - Car Rental, Original parking charge, dispute ignored by Sixt**
    So a long time ago (summer of 2017) we had rented a car from Sixt in back in Sicily. A while later we received a parking ticket notice from Sixt (which oddly at the time of renting we do not recall having any affixed to the car window) of a mere EUR 15 which we immediately paid and did not think twice. A year goes by and we then receive an email from from Sixt (2018) claiming that we owe them handling fee, having compounded from an initial EUR 15 to circa EUR 65 by then. We object, replying that we never received any prior notice and highlighting that we paid the original fine promptly during which time having received no ask to pay a handling fee. Our email is not responded to and being busy with life as everyone else, we forget about it.

    **2019 - Debt sold to eCollect; Our initial (in)action**
    We do not hear anything until Dec 2019 when we receive an email saying that the 'debt' is picked up by eCollect, who send emails with annoying language, asking us to pay upwards of EUR 110 (with detail charges look as if making fees out of thin air). We did some research at the time including on this forum around eCollect: 1. On whether they have been flexible with other people's disputes/experiences (answer:they are not), and 2. On whether they have jurisdiction in the UK (which they seem not to have). Charged with anger towards and feeling wronged by Sixt in that all this is due to their utter lack of communication and terrible bureaucracy, and knowing that we have paid the original fine, we then decide to ignore eCollect (may not have been the best decision in hindsight, but anyway...).

    **2023 - debt resold - new company, threat of litigation***
    Fast forward past COVID years and to 2023 (last week), we receive an email from this DE based collection agency called Themys & Dyke who claim to have bought the debt from eCollect who in turn had taken it on from Sixt, charging us north of EUR 210, filled with standard bs 'collection fee' line items, and threatening litigation if not settled by end of month.

    Other key points: we are based in England but the collection companies (originally from Sixt) only have an outdated/former non-UK address from us, a phone number plus an email address, and no other UK contact detail whatsoever.

    **our question/ask**
    We are quite new to (and shocked by) this industry's practice of compounding charges from nothing. Hence would highly appreciate thoughts/advice on the scenario whereby we choose to continue to ignore/not pay the new collectors. Is there a statute of limitation applicable here? Do they have jurisdiction in the UK etc? Essentially if the debt somehow has the risk of getting into the UK legal system we'd rather pay now and get it done with vs assessing the strength of our case vs theirs.


    Thanks a ton!
    Last edited by curiousbeagl; 6th March 2023, 13:48:PM. Reason: Edited the last paragraph to further clarify the Question/ask
    Tags: None

  • #2
    I would write to your Member of Parliament as you have here and report it to Action Fraud online, you will get a Ref number, then write to Themys & Dyke GbR, explain that you have lodged a complaint with the police. If there is any further harassment from them, then you will consider taking legal action for harassment under the Protection from Harassment Act 1997 because they are chasing you for money you don't owe.

    Comment


    • #3
      Hi,

      We share an almost identical scenario.

      In Spring 2018 we had hired a car from Sixt in Italy.

      A few months later we received an invoice from Sixt for unspecified admin fees. It wasn’t clear what this was for and it seemed pretty spurious. We did not respond and frankly forgot all about it.

      Then in January 2019 we received a traffic fine from the Italian police for £75 for a minor traffic violation of which we had been unaware. We duly paid this. (It subsequently transpired that the Sixt admin fee was for supplying the police with our details)

      Time passed until over 2 years later, in March 2022, we received an email from Ecollect claiming £160 in respect of the unpaid invoice for Sixt admin fees. The original invoice had been for £30 but with added charges and fees was now £160! The letter was threatening Court proceedings. It referred to an email we had never received and indeed we had never received any correspondence or emails from Sixt chasing the debt. We were pretty upset but decided just to pay it to get rid of the matter and we made the payment to Ecollect.

      No sooner had we paid the debt than we received an email claiming a further £300 for other outstanding invoices about which we knew nothing. They claim to have supplied the Italian police with info regarding other traffic violations but we had never received anything from the police or Sixt in respect of that. The previous correspondence from Ecollect had made no mention of any other debt. It seemed to us that this was some short of scam and we decided to ignore it.

      Fast forward to Feb 2023 we have also received a letter from Tymes & Dyke who say they are now pursing the further debt on behalf of Sixt which has risen to over £400 and threatening legal proceedings. The question is what to do about it. Having already paid £160 the concern is that even if we paid it would that be the end of the matter or will they come back claiming yet further outrageous charges and fees? We have not yet responded to Tymes & Dyke. Should we ignore them? Feeling that we will be damned if we do and damned if we don’t. We would welcome any advice and information anyone can give.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by MammaMia View Post
        Hi,

        We share an almost identical scenario.

        In Spring 2018 we had hired a car from Sixt in Italy.

        A few months later we received an invoice from Sixt for unspecified admin fees. It wasn’t clear what this was for and it seemed pretty spurious. We did not respond and frankly forgot all about it.

        Then in January 2019 we received a traffic fine from the Italian police for £75 for a minor traffic violation of which we had been unaware. We duly paid this. (It subsequently transpired that the Sixt admin fee was for supplying the police with our details)

        Time passed until over 2 years later, in March 2022, we received an email from Ecollect claiming £160 in respect of the unpaid invoice for Sixt admin fees. The original invoice had been for £30 but with added charges and fees was now £160! The letter was threatening Court proceedings. It referred to an email we had never received and indeed we had never received any correspondence or emails from Sixt chasing the debt. We were pretty upset but decided just to pay it to get rid of the matter and we made the payment to Ecollect.

        No sooner had we paid the debt than we received an email claiming a further £300 for other outstanding invoices about which we knew nothing. They claim to have supplied the Italian police with info regarding other traffic violations but we had never received anything from the police or Sixt in respect of that. The previous correspondence from Ecollect had made no mention of any other debt. It seemed to us that this was some short of scam and we decided to ignore it.

        Fast forward to Feb 2023 we have also received a letter from Tymes & Dyke who say they are now pursing the further debt on behalf of Sixt which has risen to over £400 and threatening legal proceedings. The question is what to do about it. Having already paid £160 the concern is that even if we paid it would that be the end of the matter or will they come back claiming yet further outrageous charges and fees? We have not yet responded to Tymes & Dyke. Should we ignore them? Feeling that we will be damned if we do and damned if we don’t. We would welcome any advice and information anyone can give.
        I suggest doing what I stated in post number 2. If they do start legal proceedings, you just defend the claim against you, you don't owe the monies, full payment has been made, yet they are 'conjuring' charges out of thin air, you might have grounds to counter-claim for harassment because they are chasing you for money you don't owe.

        At some point you can send Sixt, Ecollect, Tymes & Dyke a Subject Access Request to try to reconcile the charges they have collected and what they are trying to collect.
        I'm note sure how collecting data from Europe works, but should be straight forward.

        Comment


        • #5
          I don't know what all of this means, but sounds like some of it is against consumer laws in Italy.

          https://forum-quechoisir-org.transla...n&_x_tr_pto=sc

          This decision is visible in Italian at the following link page 201
          https://www.agcm.it/dotcmsdoc/bollettini/2022/22-22.pdf

          Comment


          • #6
            I have similar experience from car rental with Sixt (in Germany), where the claim of admin charge of EUR 29 compounded to the current claim of EUR 291 when they were transferred to eCollect then to Themys & Dyke, in a period of less than a year. Looking at the experiences and reponses here, I am now reluctant to respond to Themys & Dyke. This is daylight robbery and unreasonable. Credit card late payment and interest charges do not amount to that kind of extra charges. Will they really start legal action for such a small amount of money? I doubt so. I believe they will just continue with harrassement and threatening emails.
            The fact that some of you have paid and they continue to claim from you, it shows that settlement of claims is useless now.

            Comment


            • #7
              I'm in the United States, rented a car from SIxt in April of 2018, got billed from Sixt months later and asked for proof. No proof came and I did a charge back so the credit card company handled it. I later got 6 tickets for silly minor vilolations in Italy which I paid immediately to the tune of nearly $600. Two years later Sixt wants a slew of admin fees, then it took two months for them to substantiate. At this point I told Sixt to pound sand and told them that I'm not paying a ridiculously high admin bill 26 months after the fact after I had to ask them multiple times to substantiate.

              Here then comes Themy's and Dyke in March of 2023, some 5 years later demanding about $400 Euros. They are NOT a real law firm.

              Look up their Google reviews which are fabricated (they are "AMAZING" and all the reviews but the few bad ones were submitted by names that sound Russian or Eastern European, go figure), and then look up their address which is a building housing a non-profit real estate repurposing and preservation firm, and if that's not enough, take a look at their website and see that it was done by a 3 person "firm" located in a shabby residential area in Bulgaria (a web site builder that has "Coming Soon" on their own website).

              The whole thing is a joke. Here's what I sent them with no response. I'm all done and you folks should be too. I copied the letter below to Sixt and to Sixt's accounting department as well... screw them. Themy's and Dyke and Sixt have not replied. I also filed a formal complaint against Sixt for either contracting with these theives or for not safeguarding my personal information.

              Dear Sir or Madam,

              I have filed formal complaint # 230306-10521097 with the CFPB, a Bureau of the United States Government with a mission to protect US Citizen consumers from unfair, deceptive, or abusive practices and take action against companies that break the law.

              It is in their hands now.

              Good Day!
              Last edited by SICKOFSIXT; 21st March 2023, 18:06:PM.

              Comment


              • #8
                It really needs a Class Action against various parties to stop the 'harassment'.

                Comment


                • #9
                  To those that have been contacted by Themys & Dyke, i am in the same boat althought my case is slightly weirder but i will save explaining my drama as its very long. One thing i can say is that eCollect and Themys seem to be the same entity, i reported eCollect text messages as spam sending them to my spam folder as they were awfully annoying. Today i opened the spam folder to find that the same number eCollect was using is now contacting me claiming to be Themys & Dyke(the texts date back 3months now). The message is also very interesting as it says that Themys & Dyke are working on behalf of Sixt to build a case against me, insteresting as eCollect will have bought the debt from Sixt and the funds would no longer have anything to do with Sixt.

                  All in all i think we need to file a class action lawsuit against either/all of the 3 entities, final 2 for harassment and Sixt for not handling our personal information correctly(depending on who the hell is behind eCollect & co, as they seem like nothing more than scammers and not actual companies). I am ready to pursure this if others are too. In the meantime i will be ignoring them until i speak to citizens advice bureau and/or a solicitor.

                  Also soon we will see everyone who has complained about eCollect in other threads turn up in this thread

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    To add to the existing thread of complaints, I too have been hassled persistently by eCollect and now Themys and Dyke. I allegedly committed a speeding offence in Sicily while in a SIXT car in autumn 2020. Months later there was an email from SIXT claiming they had been issued with a fine that traced back to me. The official documentation looked really questionable so I ignored it. A few months later I found (by chance) an eCollect email in my Junk folder claiming I owed them an admin charge as they were collecting for SIXT. Since then emails have appeared fairly regularly about growing admin charges, until earlier this year the German lawyers appeared in the inbox and gave me a deadline of June 1 to pay the approx Eur 300 debt. or else they would proceed with legal action. I became slightly worried that they actually might be capable of creating some kind of legal case that could pursue me in the UK but this is nonsense, isnt it? I bet there are loads of folk with the same doubts who've actually paid up to get them off their backs.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I wanted to add to this as well. I rented a car in Italy from Sixt in July 2022. Months passed and in mid October I get 2 separate emails claiming 2 alleged speeding fines for €35 each (total €70). The emails were suspicious, unclear and it very much seemed like a scam.

                      I heard nothing more until March 2023 when I received the same emails then in April the claim was passed to eCollectAG. I took this one more seriously where they said they were the debt collectors and additional fees had arisen. To try end this I made a payment of €100 but continued to be harassed by emails claiming additional fees.

                      It has not clearly been passed to Themys & Dyke Rechtsanwälte GbR as I have now received a text and email. I do not plan to take any further action.

                      ​​​​​​​I agree with VictimofSixt that a case should be taken against all 3 parties.
                      Last edited by EireACA; 9th July 2023, 07:51:AM.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Same with me

                        i rented a car from Sixt in August 2020, in September sixt sent me an email that I owe them admin fee (€25), I replied that I can’t make a bank transfer but they can just charge my credit card. They didn’t charge it.

                        fast forward to 2023 and ecollect sent me an email claiming they work on “behalf” of sixt and that I now I owe them €198, I asked them for ways to know that they truly work for sixt and that once I pay nothing will be owed. They didn’t reply.

                        Today I received an email from Themys & Dyke with a link to “settle” for €512. I also went back over the emails and managed to log in to an Italian govt website in order to pay, they say I owe €216 to sixt.

                        I live in Portugal and plan to contact my lawyer tomorrow to see what I can do. I also plan to call sixt Germany and make sure I owe them nothing, I’ll definitely record the phone call as it might be useful since they all claim to collect debts on “behalf of sixt” and that “sixt is their client”.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I have a similar situation with them and I believe all customers are legally bounded by the contract and the terms and conditions they signed when they rented the car. Those terms and conditions don’t mention selling debts to collectors or giving personal information such as names, emails and addresses to third party debt collectors and for that they can be sued. Here is my email to them:

                          Hello,

                          I have recently received an email that you sent relating to outstanding charges to Sixt Car Hire Italy dating from October 2019.

                          After first receiving notice that there were outstanding payments for traffic infractions, I replied to them and asked for an online payment method so I could pay the balance. I never heard back from them and I tried to contact them again in order to settle the payment.
                          My emails were routinely ignored and then 3.5 years later I receive an email stating that I am liable for costs amounting to 1154€.

                          I was willing and able to pay the fines at the time but I wasn’t given the relevant information to do so.

                          Having looked at the terms and conditions that I had signed at the time, Sixt could have used my payment card to process the outstanding balance or they could have given my details to the private or public body that issued the fine for me to deal with directly. It does not mention involving third party opportunistic companies who will charge extortionate rates to recover what was initially a reasonable small fine.

                          Also in the terms and conditions it states that upon signing I agree to pay for parking, traffic or other fines as well as other reasonable costs. I was willing to pay the fines but they did not communicate and I did not know of any other way to pay them. I also strongly believe that the fees you are claiming fall outside of what is considered a reasonable costs related to a minor traffic offence almost four years ago.

                          I am more than happy for you to return this to Sixt and I deal with them directly to once and for all cover these payments, proving they cooperate this time but the costs you are demanding are excessive and absurd and I will not contemplate paying them.

                          Any further correspondence from you beside acknowledging receipt of my email and agreeing to pass the issue back to Sixt will result in me filing an official complaint with my Government Cyber Security Division for harassment.

                          For the avoidance of any doubt, I am not in any way trying to get out of paying what I rightfully ought to, however, I will not give in to being harassed and chased for ludicrously high and disproportionate fees.

                          I accept that the initial fines issued were just and fair and I will happily pay them but in order to do so I will contact Sixt again and see what resolution we can agree to without third-party involvement, especially a company that I believe to have no lawful connection to the situation and one that should never have acquired my personal details from Sixt.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I've resorted to ignoring them now, just received another email from Themys. Once again if anyone wants to file action against these fraudsters I am here just get in touch. Though I don't log into this forum often hopefully I get back to you as soon as possible. I hate the harassment we are receiving and want to do something about it.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Anyone reading this should think very carefully before responding as ABrain has done. He may live to regret his various admissions.
                              Lawyer (solicitor) - retired from practice, now supervising solicitor in a university law clinic. I do not advise by private message.

                              Litigants in Person should download and read the Judiciary's handbook for litigants in person: https://www.judiciary.uk/wp-content/..._in_Person.pdf

                              Comment

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