Illegible CCA but going to court

[paulb2905]

Re: Illegible CCA but going to court

TBH dont know when they costs become payable, not there yet in my case, sure someone will answer that tho.

Best thing to do is grab one of the downloadable spreadsheets for both the unlawful charges and the PPI one too.

Put in the figures and see what you come out with and pursue these. PPI not something i have any experience in dealing with so im sure someone more knowledgable will help with that.

Its staggering how much a compounded charge becomes - from 2004 to 2010 (from the copy statements that they provided to me) £200ish became £1000ish

Perhaps apply for a Stay pending the outcome of this, eg refund of the charges, depends how much they become.

[Amethyst]

Re: Illegible CCA but going to court

The charges/ppi need to be defended in your defence to the claim.

[maec]

Re: Illegible CCA but going to court

Strange companies are not just typing out the text from these agreements they are all the same. It isnt highly illegible you can make out what it says and there are plenty of egg agreements about the place to check anything you cant quite make out. So long as you can see the prescribed terms I'd expect it to be ok. The inception terms would be needed to go alongside it, although that wouldnt be fatal as the prescribed terms are on that document.

In regards to Amethyst's comment about the legibility of this agreement, I am still having trouble reading exactly what this agreement states.

In my humble opinion this agreement would be classed as illegible and therefore unenforceable, whereas the Claimant has stated that this is legible and is what they rely upon.

Specific notice was given by the court that any document whose contents were illegible, a typed copy should be included next to it in the bundle. The claimants bundle does not have a typed copy included.

For example I have difficulty reading anything in the section with the word "Approved" stamped over it, and this is the type of thing I interpret in my day to day work!

[Angry Cat]

Re: Illegible CCA but going to court

The copy agreement as per post 1, is illegible.
Please refer to Reg 2 of copy docyment regs 1983:
http://www.johnpughschambers.co.uk/C...tions_1983.pdf
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I also note that the Repayment Protection (PPI) is mentioned on the copy agreement;
makes a change for Egg!
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For your information, maec:
http://www.fsa.gov.uk/pages/Library/...2008/149.shtml

The rotten Egg mis-sold PPI prior to 2005, also...

Many angry ripped-off customers want their money back!!!

[Angry Cat]

Re: Illegible CCA but going to court

The charges/ppi need to be defended in your defence to the claim.

Agreed!

Perhaps BillK, could kindly assist with the calculations?

Also, we need to take a very close look at the purported inception T&C's that have been provided to maec.

[Turboman]

Re: Illegible CCA but going to court

Agreed!

Perhaps BillK, could kindly assist with the calculations?

Also, we need to take a very close look at the purported inception T&C's that have been provided to maec.

Yes--but we can't read the agreement for the figures though--unless there's a better copy on CAG ?????

[Amethyst]

Re: Illegible CCA but going to court

12.9% for purchases after 6 months at 0%

15.2% for cash advances and credit card cheques.

[Angry Cat]

Re: Illegible CCA but going to court

Yes--but we can't read the agreement for the figures though--

Quite so, illegible!

However, it shouldn't be a prob. to ascertain the interest rate for December 2001...will look.

And, the OP can check his/her statements re: the PPI premiums plus interest charged.
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12.9% for purchases after 6 months at 0%

15.2% for cash advances and credit card cheques.

Amethyst and her and her magnifying eye sight LOL

[maec]

Re: Illegible CCA but going to court

Hi angry, I have used a calculator on moneysavingexpert which comes to 40% of the amount claimed equalling PPI charges along with 10% relating to charges.

I have a fair few pages of t&c's to put up but can't do til I'm back at work. I'll see if I can pick out the relevant parts and type them for now.

Maec

[Angry Cat]

Re: Illegible CCA but going to court

Hi angry, I have used a calculator on moneysavingexpert which comes to 40% of the amount claimed equalling PPI charges along with 10% relating to charges.

Re: the PPI reclaim, do not forget to reclaim the interest as charged by EGG/Prudential or, St. Andrews Insurance on the PPI premiums, as well as the PPI premiums themselves.

I have a fair few pages of t&c's to put up but can't do til I'm back at work. I'll see if I can pick out the relevant parts and type them for now.

We need to ascertain, as to whether Cabot have supplied the inception T&C's;
issue date: December 2001.
You will also have to request the PPI documents: policy at the time of taking out the PPI, together with the Terms of that Policy and;
any variations to same or, the EGG insurer/underwriter

Maec

Comments in blue

[maec]

Re: Illegible CCA but going to court

Thanks for the pointers Angry, ive triple checked the t&c and cant find a date anywhere. There is also nothing specific to me neither, no name, address or account number.

Here are the points I thought relevant-

Point 4. Interest and Credit Charges

4.1 We will charge interest
On purchases at a monthly rate of 0%, 0% APR, fixed for 6 months after the Account is opened; and otherwise
At a monthly rate of 1.019%, 12.9% APR

4.2 Unless you are an existing Egg Customer, we charge a handling fee of 1.25% of the amount of each Cash Advance (min. fee £2). The APR for credit card cheques is 15.2%

4.3 We charge a handling fee of 1.5% of the amount of each Credit Card Cheque (min fee £2) The APR for credit card cheques is 15.2%

4.4 (Promotional balances blurb)

....


14. Early Payments

14.1 We will ask you to make an immediate payment of:
1. Any overdue amounts;
2. The amount over your individual limit; and
3. the amount of any Transaction which breaks the Agreement

14.2 As long as we follow the correct legal requirements, we can ask you to pay the full amount which you owe us under this Agreement if you:
1. repeatedly fail to comply with your obligations
2. die; or
3. become bankrupt, or an application for an interim order is made against you under section 253 of the Insolvency Act 1986.

15. Ending this Agreement
15.1 We can end this agreement by giving you no less than 30 days notice by post or e-mail. In both cases the Agreement will continue until you have repaid all amounts you owe us and have cut in more than two pieces and thrown away all the Cards we gave to you or an Additional Cardholder.
15.2 Any benefit or services we provide will end when you give us notice or when our notice is effective unless the terms of the particular benefit or service state otherwise.

17. Non credit cahrges
17.1. We will charge
£2 for each paper statement£10 should you request us to stop a credit card cheque: and
if you ask us for any non standard service.
17.2 If you do not do what you agree to do under this Agreement we may make the following charges to cover the additional cost caused to us:
£2 for any payment made other than by direct debit, debit card or transfer from an Egg savings account
£20 each month you go over the Individual limit
£20 if you do not keep up the payments on the Account
£20 for any payment returned due to lack of funds
any costs reasonably incurred by us in taking steps to recover what you owe us, recovering Cards and tracing you if you have failed to tell us of a change of address
We will continue to charge interest on any late payments both before and after any court judgement.

18. General
18.1 (about recording phone calls)
18.2 We may transfer to any other person or business any or all of:
our rights under this agreement at any time;
our duties (including, without limitation, our duty to lend to you).
We may do this without telling you. Your rights under this Agreement and your legal rights (including under the Consumer Credit Act 1974) will not be affected.

There you go, the only date on the whole thing is to do with the 1974 act.
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Im not sure how important this is but the document scanned in this thread has had a section added to it when reproduced in the court bundle.

The annotation is on the second page and states-

Credit Agreement regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974
Conditions
Referred to on the back of the Egg Card as Prudential Banking plc VISA conditions of use

Is this important? Why would they add this?

[maec]

Re: Illegible CCA but going to court

The first mention of interest in the statements provided show interest at 1.019 in Month 7 (March 2003) with interest at 1.093 from Month 8 onwards.

The first evidence of a charge is for £20 in 2004. Weirdly with each statement there is a list of charges which dont match (i.e. £16 instead)

[Angry Cat]

Re: Illegible CCA but going to court

After the OFT advisory re: penalty charges, banks in general reduced their charges to £12; uk based usa banks, also.
Egg, reduced theirs to £16.

[maec]

Re: Illegible CCA but going to court

Angry - I have charges of £12, £16 and £20 throughout the statements provided.

[Amethyst]

Re: Illegible CCA but going to court

CABOT and arrears only ***URGENT*** and Cabot/Morgans going to court with copy/illegible CCA
These your threads over the road and you're in court tmw ?