Need a guide for unregulated/secured credit and cca application

[Amethyst]

as I get really confused in the rules which do apply to unsecured and those which don't ....

any ideas ?

[Curlyben]

Re: Need a guide for unsecured credit and cca application

Whih rules do you need help on ?

[Amethyst]

Re: Need a guide for unsecured credit and cca application

What does apply to unsecured loans and what doesnt. Everything I have ever done on CCA has been with secured lending and I can't apply it to unsecured, as in my eyes, it just doesnt apply.

So I don't understand undisclosed commissions, unenforceable agreements, prescribed terms etc on unsecured lending or what protections actually do apply if the CCA doesnt.

So yep, everything Think I just got myself confused really.

[Curlyben]

Re: Need a guide for unsecured credit and cca application

Oh great.
Not too much then.

Mostly covered in my CCA thread.

The commissions was judged to be unenforceable in Wilson Vs Hurstanger 2007.

Simple unenforceability relies on s127(3) of CCA 74, assuming the agreement is pre April 2007 when CCA 2006 repealed this section.

Do you think a chat would be easier ?

[Amethyst]

Re: Need a guide for unsecured credit and cca application

ok told you i was confusing myself - I mean unregulated and secured - not unsecured.

Just shoot me now.

[Curlyben]

Re: Need a guide for unregulated/secured credit and cca application

*Head Desk*

What are you like.

Really depends on the situation.
Assuming sub £25k even secured is regulated by CCA, anything else isn't..

[Amethyst]

Re: Need a guide for unregulated/secured credit and cca application

oops - bet you thought I'd never read the guide then lol.

Right so undisclosed commissions ref wilson/hurstanger on an unregulated loan (over 25k) how are these being reclaimed / dealt with ? aka Rubys thread Reclaim of broker fee on mortgage - Legal Beagles - as I agreed with Tools and now don't understand how hurstanger applies ?

[Curlyben]

Re: Need a guide for unregulated/secured credit and cca application

Doesn't apply in this case as the commission was known.
Although in WvH it was included in the total amount of credit and not cost of credit as it should of been ie it was interest bearing.

[Amethyst]

Re: Need a guide for unregulated/secured credit and cca application

If you forget the commission was known - if it wasnt, on what basis would you be saying it wipes the agreement if the cca doesnt apply ?

the only other rules are the mortgagey rules which say you have to disclose you get a commission but not how much.

[Curlyben]

Re: Need a guide for unregulated/secured credit and cca application

In WvH not only was it unknown, but it was interest bearing as well, hence invalidating the amount of credit.

[Amethyst]

Re: Need a guide for unregulated/secured credit and cca application

Yes but that was a regulated loan wasnt it (included in amount of credit etc) So I dont understand how it applies to unregulated.

I understand Hurstanger (I thought) and the CCA on regulated agreements I just dont understand how things can apply to unregulated loans ?

[Curlyben]

Re: Need a guide for unregulated/secured credit and cca application

As far as I know it doesn't, but could offer good leverage if it occurred.

[Amethyst]

Re: Need a guide for unregulated/secured credit and cca application

So I'm right lol. Thank goodness I was really doubting my understanding of the CCA.

(or you're as confused as me)

I wonder then, on what basis these CMCs/Solicitors are taking on unregulated agreements saying they could be unenforceable. Is it just preying on misunderstandings of the CCA or is there actually something to use (more conclusive than a judgment based on the CCA)

[Curlyben]

Re: Need a guide for unregulated/secured credit and cca application

There may well be other judgements that we don't know about, either that or your gut feeling is most likely right

[Londoneye]

Re: Need a guide for unregulated/secured credit and cca application

I think the CMC's are taking on non regulated agreements for "audit" in the hope that they can find secret commissions, PPI's etc. There is virtually no chance of having a mortgage agreement declared unenforceable because it isn't regulated, however there could be elements of it that were unfair and could lead to the refund of the unfair elements ie PPI, commissions, arrangement fees, etc. etc. I must admit, I can't really see where the CMC's are coming from here, but their performance on regulated agreements leaves a lot to be desired, so maybe some of them just don't care and want to get their fees regardless of what's being offered in return.
Your confusion re secured/unsecured & regulated/unregulated should be easy to sort out; secured or unsecured is not an issue, the issue is whether the agreement is regulated or not. If originally under £25,000 it is regulated, even if it says it is not, (certain business finance may be excepted) if over £25,000 originally it need not be regulated but can be. eg northern rock top up loan of £30k is normally regulated, but unsecured. The mortgage part of the advance is unregulated and secured!! Clear as mud? So, to summarise, a CCA regulated agreement can be unenforceable or unfair. A non regulated agreement can be unfair, but not unenforceable.