Welcome Finance Help

[christof21]

New here guys. Was referred here from a member on moneysavingexpert for an issue I'm having claiming back charges and PPI from Natwest.

This question is slightly different in that it involves Welcome Finance. It may be a long shot as well as it is about an HP Agreement, and not a loan, but it is still covered by the consumer credit act I suppose. Any way let me explain.

I got a car from Welcome back in April 07 on a 4 year HP Agreement, with a mechanical breakdown insurance. According to my paperwork, once you have paid 50% of the total amount payable on the agreement you can voluntarily terminate the agreement. So in April 09, I sent a letter off to Welcome stating that I have paid the VT figure on the agreement, and I am wanting instructions on how to return the car.

They then sent a letter stating that I owed them £700 to terminate as I hadn't reached the VT amount. They then proceeded to tell me that my monthly payment isn't actually the figure that the termination amount is calculated on. Only 90% of the monthly figure is to repay the car, the other 10% is for the repayment of the breakdown insurance, even though my agreement clearly states I can terminate the agreement once I have paid 50% of the total amount payable.

I have the car sat on my drive now, as I do not want it, and am still having to pay the monthly repayments because Welcome are refusing to do anything until I agree to the amount they claim I owe to terminate.

Any help offered would be appreciated.

[calamity jane]

Re: Welcome Finance Help

Welcome to Legal Beagles christof21.

Are you able to scan your Agreement (deleting all personal information) and post it on the thread so it can be checked?


CJ

[christof21]

Re: Welcome Finance Help

@ calamity jane

Thanks for your reply to my request for help. I have attached, hopefully, the scanned images of 3 documents.

One shows the break down of the figures for the agreement. The second one shows the wording of the agreement for the termination: your rights section. The third part shows the wording of the T's & C's for the agreement in relation to terminating.

Thanks for any help you can offer.

edit: Not sure the attached images come out big enough to read when you click on the thumbnail. I've uploaded them to photobucket instead. Here are the links

http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/g...07/Figures.png
http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/g.../Agreement.png
http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/g...r3_2007/TC.png

[Amethyst]

Re: Welcome Finance Help

They have actually put a figure on the agreement - £4094.84

What were the figures involved when you tried to terminate?

[christof21]

Re: Welcome Finance Help

They have actually put a figure on the agreement - £4094.84

What were the figures involved when you tried to terminate?

They sent me a letter saying I owed them £700.

I asked why when I had paid half the amount, which was the figure quoted on the paperwork. They responded by saying that I hadn't paid enough to reach the termination figure, i.e. I was £700 short, because the actual monthly figure used only represents 90% of the monthly I am paying. The other 10% being made up of repayment for the breakdown insurance.

I argued that the agreement states once I have paid half the "total amount payable", I can terminate, and no where does it state that my monthly payment is made up of £xx.xx for goods, and £xx.xx for insurance, then the termination figure is only made up of repaymet for the goods, not my total monthly payment.

They said that is how the agreement is, and I would have to pay to terminate. I kept pointing out that the agreement I have signed, in front of me does not state what they were claiming any where.

[Amethyst]

Re: Welcome Finance Help

If you look at the bottom of the front page theres a bit about proportional payments

[enaid]

Re: Welcome Finance Help

Well I may be wrong here but if you were paying £177.49 per month then over 48 month you would have paid £8519.52.
The amount you have to actually pay is £9019.52 which means the amount you should have been paying per month is £187.90.
Which IMO does leave a shortfall of £500 which is what the ins cost.
Don't know if that makes sense lol sorry if it doesn't.

[christof21]

Re: Welcome Finance Help

Well I may be wrong here but if you were paying £177.49 per month then over 48 month you would have paid £8519.52.
The amount you have to actually pay is £9019.52 which means the amount you should have been paying per month is £187.90.
Which IMO does leave a shortfall of £500 which is what the ins cost.
Don't know if that makes sense lol sorry if it doesn't.

What I don't understand is that none of the figures seem to add up.

If the termination amount is £4049, this figure represents half the total amount payable, but when you double that figure it comes out at £8098, which doesn't relate to any figure on the agreement any where.

And no where does it state how much per month is being paid towards the goods, and how much is being paid towards the insurances. I also doesn't state the termination figure is based on repayment of goods made only as Welcome are claiming. It clearly states the figure is half the 'total' amount payable, which again doesn't relate the total amount payable figure on the agreement.

Nothing makes any sense on the paperwork at all.

[enaid]

Re: Welcome Finance Help

Ok so imo this is how it worked out
£4900.00 for car + £3299.68 Int = £8199.68 half of this is £4099.84 which is the figure quoted.
£500.00 for Ins + £319.84 Int = £819.84
Giving a total of what you owe £9019.52 which is as it says, so how much have you been paying and for how many months?

[Amethyst]

Re: Welcome Finance Help

Nells - there was a deposit of £400 which you missed on your first lot of calcs.

[christof21]

Re: Welcome Finance Help

Ok so imo this is how it worked out
£4900.00 for car + £3299.68 Int = £8199.68 half of this is £4099.84 which is the figure quoted.
£500.00 for Ins + £319.84 Int = £819.84
Giving a total of what you owe £9019.52 which is as it says, so how much have you been paying and for how many months?

Sorry, all these figures are getting confusing now aren't they. lol

I've been paying £177.49 per month for a total of 51 months now, as another payment has just gone out of my bank.

As amethyst said, I also put a £400 deposit on the car as well.

They just have not been clear or forward with the figures and what they represent at all.

[enaid]

Re: Welcome Finance Help

so car was £4500.00 + £3299.68 Int = £7799.68
Ins £500.00 + Int £319.84 = £819.84
Total borrowed = £8619.52 is that right?

[enaid]

Re: Welcome Finance Help

I've been paying £177.49 per month for a total of 51 months now, as another payment has just gone out of my bank.

The agreement is only for 48 months

[christof21]

Re: Welcome Finance Help

I've been paying £177.49 per month for a total of 51 months now, as another payment has just gone out of my bank.

The agreement is only for 48 months

Sorry I meant 27 months. My mistake.

[enaid]

Re: Welcome Finance Help

so £177.49 x 27 = £4792.23 you have paid up to date.
Car £4900 - £400 = £4500 + £3299.68 =£7799.68 half of this is £3899.84 which is what your figure should be IMO.
Ins £500.00 +£319.84 = £819.84
If that is right then the most they can charge you is £3899.84 + £819.84 = £4719.68 as you have already paid £4792.23 then they owe you £72.55 if they can get away with charging you the full amount =Int for the ins.