Letter from JBW with NO previous correspondence

[Paul683]

Hi all.

I'd value your guidance on this....

I've just received a letter from JBW regarding a 'Red Route Contravention' which occurred on 21/11/2013. It is informing me I must pay £277.00 before 2/8/2014 (3 days notice to act) or risk additional charges of £345.

I have not received ANY correspondence regarding this, from JBW or Transport for London - not even the original notice informing me of such contravention.

I therefore intend to inform whoever holds authority over this issue (JBW or Transport for London?) that I have not been given any previous notice, and thus was not given the opportunity to pay this fine before it grew to the current proportions. However, JBW's timeline will not allow this time to make such enquiries, without increasing the charge significantly.

My situation is this.

- I am living in South America, with no fixed address (since Oct 2012).
- The address to which JBW's letter was sent is my father's, which I use when I need a correspondence address (in this instance, DVLA).
- I was home visiting at the time of the alleged contravention.
- I am currently home visiting, but will be returning to South America in 5 weeks. I have no current plans to return to UK in the next few months and have no plans to return permanently.

Very grateful for your advice on how I should proceed.

Many thanks.

[Milo]

Re: Letter from JBW with NO previous correspondence

Paul,

A few questions.
The letter from JBW....what is the date on the letter and what date AND time is given for payment?

Is the letter entitled: Notice of Enforcement?

You say that the letter states that if payment is not made that additional charges of £345 will be applied. The CORRECT charge should be £235. Can you confirm the position regarding the charges. The Notice of Enforcement should have a fee of £75 added to the debt.

PS: Do you still have the vehicle to which this contravention relates?

[Paul683]

Re: Letter from JBW with NO previous correspondence

Paul,

A few questions.
The letter from JBW....what is the date on the letter and what date AND time is given for payment?

Is the letter entitled: Notice of Enforcement?

You say that the letter states that if payment is not made that additional charges of £345 will be applied. The CORRECT charge should be £235. Can you confirm the position regarding the charges. The Notice of Enforcement should have a fee of £75 added to the debt.

PS: Do you still have the vehicle to which this contravention relates?

Hi Milo,

Thanks for following up...

The date of the letter is 24/07/2014. Date/time for payment is 02/08/2014, 1800hrs. It was received on 30/07.

Yes, it is entitled Notice of Enforcement.

You're correct. £235. I've looked again and the additional £110 applies only at the sale or disposal phase. And there is a £75 'Compliance stage fee' on this notice.

i still have the vehicle.

All the best, and thanks again

[ploddertom]

Re: Letter from JBW with NO previous correspondence

If you still have the envelope - how was it posted 2nd Class Royal Mail or a 3rd party such as DHL, UKMail etc. My view is that the Notice of Enforcement is non-compliant as you have not had 7 clear days notice.

[Wombats]

Re: Letter from JBW with NO previous correspondence

It is an area which clearly needs clarification. The intent is very clearly that the debtor should, from receipt of the Notice of Enforcement, have seven clear days to come to some sort of payment arrangement.

It appears all the enforcement companies are squeezing this time limit by claiming it is seven days from the posting date etc....

Is Milo able to comment on whether this issue has been brought up anywhere, or what we should be advising people here who face this circumstance? It is a common occurance, and unified advice across the major forums would be good to get.

I share PT's view that the notice is non-compliant as the legislation states:

6. (1) Subject to paragraph (3), notice of enforcement must be given to the debtor not less than 7 clear days before the enforcement agent takes control of the debtor’s goods.

My interpretation is that notice is only given to the debtor once the debtor knows about it, until that time notice is not given. Is my interpretation correct?

[Amethyst]

Re: Letter from JBW with NO previous correspondence

The 7 days is being discussed here http://www.legalbeagles.info/forums/...gulations-2013

[Wombats]

Re: Letter from JBW with NO previous correspondence

The 7 days is being discussed here http://www.legalbeagles.info/forums/...gulations-2013

LOL! I've just found that thread and linked it to my post! Is it great minds thinking or fools seldom differing?

[Paul683]

Re: Letter from JBW with NO previous correspondence

Thanks for all your thoughts thus far. Just an update.

I found out the reason I had not received any previous correspondence - they were going to my old address. I changed my address with DVLA at the same time that Transport for London were seeking my address from them - it must have been a matter of ships passing in the night whilst the change of address was being processed.

T for L have told me I should have a case to appeal under such circumstances. I shall do so, submitting the necessary paperwork tomorrow which will lead to them informing JBW to suspend proceedings.

Fingers crossed, sense and reason will prevail and whoever deals with it will see that it was just a case of unlucky timing.

[Wombats]

Re: Letter from JBW with NO previous correspondence

I'd be inclined to inform JBW yourself as well just to be sure. :tinysmile_twink_t2:

[Milo]

Re: Letter from JBW with NO previous correspondence

Paul,
I am pleased that you have managed to get this 'part resolved'. Are TfL asking that you file an Out of Time witness statement? Whilst this is the correct procedure I notice that you are returning to South Africa in a few weeks times. My personal opinion is therefore that an OTT is NOT appropriate in your case. Please post back and I will respond. Transport for London are by far the very best authority to negotiate with and in all cases such as yours that I have seen TfL would be willing to 'rewind' the procedure back to the Notice of Owner stage.

I am very concerned indeed at the date of the letter. I intend providing more information on the '7 clear days' in the new few days but even the enforcement companies governing body..CIVEA have advised ALL their members that allowing '14 days' from the date of letter would be 'prudent'. Much more serious is the number of days that need to expire in the Transport for London contract !!!!

Please post back asap and I can advise further.