Reclaiming charges from newlyn

[paul floorlayer]

Got caught out with an unpaid PCN at the turn of the year by an unmarked anpr van, got charged a whopping £798.64 for the pleasure, I never got shown a warrant (near certain out was out of date anyway as from late 2010) and under duress was forced to pay, now being abit more savvy about charges from reading various posts on legal beagles, I have started the ball rolling in trying to get back the unlawful charges from newlyns, I have sent the first template letter for a breakdown of fees by email and received a response the following day saying that they are carrying out an investigation of my account and will respond within 21 days, I allowed them the 21 days even though the letter states 14 days as a goodwill gesture and when the 21 days were up (tuesday gone) I followed it up with another email which has not been replied to as we speak, the gist was that they are obliged to provide this information by law and that my 14 day timeframe was ample let alone 21 days they asked for to pull up what I was charged for from their computer system and then have that sent via royal mail or back via email, and that should I not receive correspondence by friday (tomorrow) then I will take the matter further.

What is my next move? is it a letter to the council the pcn is from (harrow) or the local government ombudsman, trading standards, OFT, all of them? they are obviously dragging it as they work on the fact that the public are ignorant on what charges can be applied and realise they will eventually have to refund me, worst case scenario im looking at a refund of circa £550 by my calculations eventually....

[paul floorlayer]

Re: Reclaiming charges from newlyn

Ok my last email seemed to do the trick as today about two hours ago I got my breakdown.

council debt £172
first letter £11.20 sent 24th august 2012
finance check £20
visit fee 1 £57 14th december 2012 at approx 09.00
enforcement fee £235 8th jan 2013 at approx 10.30
levy fee £73 8th jan 2013 at approx 10.30
schedule 1 section 8 £35 8th jan 2013 at approx 10.30
cancel tow fee £90 8th jan 2013 at approx 10.30
debit card surcharge £1
vat £104.44
total balance £798.64
paid £798.64
balance outstanding £0

as far as i can tell im liable for the pcn (labelled council debt for a reason I presume) the letter fee and possibly the levy fee although I honestly cannot remember if they actually done any paperwork for the levy on presumably my van at the time (although would this not constitute an excessive levy as £2500 van for £172 debt?) havent got any of the paperwork they gave me still it has been lost since january.

What is my next move? would it be a letter to the council wanting an explanation as to why these fees not covered by schedule 1 have been applied or would it be to the LGO?

[labman]

Re: Reclaiming charges from newlyn

Here you go. This should help you work the correct fees out:

Fees
Sending a letter = £11.20 (Can only be charged once)

Sum up to £200 = 28% (Minimum fee of £28.00)

Any sum over £200 = 5.5%

Bailiffs can charge fees for a maximum of three visits. It is illegal to charge multiple fees for recovering more than one ticket in one visit.

Transportation of Seized Goods = Reasonable Costs (these should be broken down)

[paul floorlayer]

Re: Reclaiming charges from newlyn

Thank you, I have sent a letter back to newlyn outlining their over payment and offering them a chance to make a direct repayment to my self and at the same time sent a letter to harrow council asking if they are happy for their operatives to be making charges like that, both templates adapted from legal beagles, hopefully I will get a response sooner than later, worst case scenario I will go down the small claims route.

By my calculation I am only liable to pay the PCN the letter fee and the section 8 fee (reasonable costs), as im near 99% sure there was no levy made.

[labman]

Re: Reclaiming charges from newlyn

If they did visit, their fee should only be £48.16 not £57.00 (28% x £172)

It is reasonable to ask them to provide a breakdown of the Section 8 fee. Yours is low at £35, but bailiffs have a habit of using it to print money. What exactly did they spend that £35 on, over and above the other legitimate charges?

You might as well question it.

Re the letters, normal practice here is to send one to the Head of Revenues asking him to condone the charges in line with the relevant legislation, as you're not sure they're right. When they reply stating the fees are correct, you write to the CEO of the council pointing out their vicarious liability for the fees and stating his own Head of Revenuws is laying the council open to litigation. You don't want to take this route, but here are the legitimate charges and present them again.

Ask for the council to accept that and confirm in writing the bailiffs have been called off, and the PCN cleared in full.

Hope that helps. :beagle:

[bizzybob]

Re: Reclaiming charges from newlyn

The £20 Finance check fee is invalid also.

[paul floorlayer]

Re: Reclaiming charges from newlyn

The reason I dont think im liable for a levy fee is that this happened when I had pulled over checking an address in my van, an anpr van from newlyn pulled up behind and at first I thought it was police so obliged when asked if I could come over to their van, I dont remember being given any levy paperwork only a receipt for the amount I paid, all unfortunately misplaced since january though so cannot check and be 100%.
I was under the impression that a levy fee can only be applied if a levy is made, with all the matching paperwork or am I wrong? hence why I accept the first letter fee reasonable costs along with the pcn as something that was a legitimate balance to pay.

[labman]

Re: Reclaiming charges from newlyn

I guess the only way you are going to know for sure if the paperwork exists to back up the levy is to send a SAR to them, which costs £10.00. There should be a copy of the paperwork you would have been given if a valid levy had taken place. I find it hard to believe you would not remember if it had, given it was not that long ago.

You can find a SAR template at Number 3 HERE.

[paul floorlayer]

Re: Reclaiming charges from newlyn

I guess the only way you are going to know for sure if the paperwork exists to back up the levy is to send a SAR to them, which costs £10.00. There should be a copy of the paperwork you would have been given if a valid levy had taken place. I find it hard to believe you would not remember if it had, given it was not that long ago.

You can find a SAR template at Number 3 HERE.

Thats what I mean ok I have a bad memory but I dont remember them completing a levy form although I vaguely remember having a generic demand form made on the spot then a receipt for the payment as I agreed to pay almost straight away (less than 5 minutes), seeing as I would of been left in east london when meant to be on route to a job, they did take my keys as I left my mate in the van with the ignition on though, if they did have a valid levy then the section 8 fee wouldnt be due so either way by my calculations im either owed a refund of £570 or £550, part of my email I sent to them did actually state that I dont believe them to have a valid levy so wouldnt be liable for a levy fee and challenged them to prove they did with a photocopy of the form 7 if they claim to have a valid levy.

[paul floorlayer]

Re: Reclaiming charges from newlyn

Ok there was a levy on my van as I have had a copy of levy form sent to me from newlyns, I sent a letter to the head of traffic enforcement at harrow and have received a reply basically stating they are happy with how they have gone about reclaiming the money via enforcement and that the bailiff company can charge reasonable fees doing so, short hand for we are fine with it.

I have worked out that I'm owed circa £500 in unlawful charges, is my next stop small claims court proceedings looking for a detailed assessment to adjudge what fees where due? if thats the case am I correct in thinking I need to send a further steps notice to newlyn plc.

[labman]

Re: Reclaiming charges from newlyn

I'd refer you to posts 5 and 8.

Have you sent the letter to the Head of Revenues? Have you sent the bailiff SAR?

If not, I think that would be your next step and might avoid you having to take court action to reclaim the fees.

If it did come to court action, it would not be you sending a FSN, but others more qualified than me would help you with that, if it it comes to it.

It is your choice, but I'd go the non-court route first, and leave your options open if necessary. :beagle:

[bluebottle]

Re: Reclaiming charges from newlyn

One question I have is that did the Newlyns' employees in the van stop you or see you stopped and pulled in behind you? If the former, they have no powers to do so and this would bring into question the veracity of any statements being made by Newlyns and LB of Harrow and, possibly, the legality of the actions of the bailiffs on that day.

[paul floorlayer]

Re: Reclaiming charges from newlyn

One question I have is that did the Newlyns' employees in the van stop you or see you stopped and pulled in behind you? If the former, they have no powers to do so and this would bring into question the veracity of any statements being made by Newlyns and LB of Harrow and, possibly, the legality of the actions of the bailiffs on that day.

sat nav played up so pulled over to sort it out at which point I saw a white van pull up behind me and a bloke in what looked like police uniform at half glance ask me to come over to their van, at first I thought it was a policeman telling me one of my brake lights was out or something similar.

[bizzybob]

Re: Reclaiming charges from newlyn

sat nav played up so pulled over to sort it out at which point I saw a white van pull up behind me and a bloke in what looked like police uniform at half glance ask me to come over to their van, at first I thought it was a policeman telling me one of my brake lights was out or something similar.

So bailiffs are getting all paramillitary with flak jackets, and black shirts? Any room for feeling their collars for impersonating a police officer. Wonder if they had ANPR or were just looking for the van and got lucky.

Was the van a Berlingo or a Bipper?

[paul floorlayer]

Re: Reclaiming charges from newlyn

I'd refer you to posts 5 and 8.

Have you sent the letter to the Head of Revenues? Have you sent the bailiff SAR?

If not, I think that would be your next step and might avoid you having to take court action to reclaim the fees.

If it did come to court action, it would not be you sending a FSN, but others more qualified than me would help you with that, if it it comes to it.

It is your choice, but I'd go the non-court route first, and leave your options open if necessary. :beagle:

Have sent the letter to the head of revenues and received a response which I will post up, I take it id now need to send off 'letter 2' from the useful letters page to the ceo