Is this Levy Fee legal? - Bristow & Sutor, Council Tax

[CleverClogs]

Re: Is this Levy Fee legal? - Bristow & Sutor, Council Tax

Hi, further to this, B&S have been in touch again, claiming that I now 'owe' them £227.50.

Ask the buggers to explain that.

Once more, you need all the charges to be fully itemised and explained.

Use letter #1 from here

[bluebottle]

Re: Is this Levy Fee legal? - Bristow & Sutor, Council Tax

Hi, further to this, B&S have been in touch again, claiming that I now 'owe' them £227.50. I have moved but they have written to my employer requesting information on whether I'm employed there, saying they might think about doing an AOE order etc. In their dreams! They would have to obtain a CCJ against you and a court would have to order this. If your CT liability is discharged, then B & S are talking BS.

They've also rung me, and I've explained, again that they can either take me to court, accept a settlement figure or go away. Good for you. Well done.

My concern, clearly is that the only contact address they have for me now is my workplace, and I don't want further embarrassment caused by them turning up here. They've already put themselves in breach of their CCA Licence by doing this, so report them to OFT Credit Fitness. It is a breach of OFT Debt Collection Guidelines to contact a debtor's place of work. And B & S know it.

Apparently the council have told them that they're ok with the 'debt' being pursued. Who is saying that, B & S or the council? Check with the council and ask them to confirm in writing or by email.

Thoughts?

Response in red text.

[bizzybob]

Re: Is this Levy Fee legal? - Bristow & Sutor, Council Tax

Looks like Busted & Stupid, are stitching themselves up like a kipper, and are suffering from "makeitupaswegoalongitis" a serious disorder caused by a greed for illicit fees, that has spun out of control so far that the bailiff would not know the truth even if he was arrested for frau due to application of spurious fees and charges.. He is dreaming of the coming implementation of TCGA, where he thinks he will be able to levy even next doors cat if it is crapping on the debtor's lawn, anybodies motor near a debtords property and the innocent will have to pay its value and the bailiff fees into court for an interpleader to get them back. No money for interpleader, then tough bailiff has them and innocent loses their property

I would be inclined to do as BB suggests, but also write to your MP, and the CEO of the council involved. While you are at it contact Trading Standards also regarding the breach of CCA.

[Etinarcadiaego]

Re: Is this Levy Fee legal? - Bristow & Sutor, Council Tax

Hi thanks for your response - yes I thought their attempt was bullshit but I wondered if their contacting my employer gave me some ammo to use against them.

B&S have said this and the council have confirmed - email below:

"Dear xxxxx

Thank you for your e-mail.


Once your account was passed to Bristow and Sutor they were entitled to add their own fees for work carried out on the Council’s behalf in pursuit of the debt.
Of the four separate fees you have incurred, the first three came about before full payment of the Liability Order had been received. When we received the payment from you we updated Bristows of this.


However, because you still have fees outstanding with them they are entitled to pursue you for these fees and to add extra fees for extra work carried out by them as a result of the outstanding debt."

[Etinarcadiaego]

Re: Is this Levy Fee legal? - Bristow & Sutor, Council Tax

They've itemised it as an extra charge for a visit which took place in February (i.e. after the liability order was discharged)

1,049.40 0.00 1,049.40 Opening Balance
10/05/12 +24.50 +24.50 0.00 A.T.L. Fee (First Visit) 10/05/12
07/06/12 +18.00 +18.00 0.00 A.T.L. Fee (Second Visit) 07/06/12
27/07/12 +55.00 +55.00 0.00 Levy Fee 27/07/12
15/08/12 -1049.40 0.00 -1049.40 Paid Direct 14/08/12
14/02/13 +130.00 +130.00 0.00 Van/Abortive Removal Fees 14/02/13
227.50 227.50 0.00

[bluebottle]

Re: Is this Levy Fee legal? - Bristow & Sutor, Council Tax

They've itemised it as an extra charge for a visit which took place in February (i.e. after the liability order was discharged)

1,049.40 0.00 1,049.40 Opening Balance
10/05/12 +24.50 +24.50 0.00 A.T.L. Fee (First Visit) 10/05/12
07/06/12 +18.00 +18.00 0.00 A.T.L. Fee (Second Visit) 07/06/12
27/07/12 +55.00 +55.00 0.00 Levy Fee 27/07/12
15/08/12 -1049.40 0.00 -1049.40 Paid Direct 14/08/12
14/02/13 +130.00 +130.00 0.00 Van/Abortive Removal Fees 14/02/13
227.50 227.50 0.00

The bit I have highlighted in red is of doubtful legality.

As for the implementation of the TCGA, this discredited and corrupt government have to remain in office long enough to see it come into force and, to be honest, the way things are going, I don't think they will. It is a personal opinion, but I'll give this government until January 2014 at the latest.

[wales01man]

Re: Is this Levy Fee legal? - Bristow & Sutor, Council Tax

Love or hate this government whats the alternative?

[CleverClogs]

Re: Is this Levy Fee legal? - Bristow & Sutor, Council Tax

Love or hate this government whats the alternative?

UKIP - BNP coalition? :behindsofa:

[bizzybob]

Re: Is this Levy Fee legal? - Bristow & Sutor, Council Tax

UKIP - BNP coalition? :behindsofa:

How about a sprinkling of independents to keep order LOL

[bluebottle]

Re: Is this Levy Fee legal? - Bristow & Sutor, Council Tax

How about a sprinkling of independents to keep order LOL

I think you'll find that is what it is likely to be in the future, BB, but with a lot of independents. In the USA, there are more independents in local and an increasing number of state governments than in the federal government. The only reason there are two parties dominating the US political scene is because those with vested interests manipulate and fund those two parties to create the illusion of democracy. It is all smoke and mirrors. If the American people had a completely free vote, the Republicans and Democrats would be more or less annihilated by the independents. If this were replicated across the globe, I have no doubt the result would be more or less the same. People are a lot more savvy that politicians believe. And it is that attitude that will bring about the downfall of the current political system.

[ploddertom]

Re: Is this Levy Fee legal? - Bristow & Sutor, Council Tax

To get back to the job in hand. You have a 1st & 2nd Visit totalling £42-50 which I think we all agree are payable. You then had another visit whereby they gained entry & levied on a pile of goods which you listed earlier. It is after this visit that you paid the Council direct the monies owing from the Liability Order but not the Bailiff Fees.

With Council Tax it is that the Bailiff Fees are paid first and any balance is paid to the Council. However as you paid the Council they in turn have not paid the Bailiff and have confirmed you have discharged your Liability to them, this then leaves the Bailiff Fees outstanding. I have made comment previously about the levy they claim to have and still stick by my opinion the levy is of no good as the items seized would realise next to nothing if removed for sale at auction. Of course there is then another way of looking at this in that the Bailiff has left things too long and should be seen that any entitlement to any levy has now been long abandoned.

The only fees outstanding are for the 2 Visit Fees.

[Etinarcadiaego]

Re: Is this Levy Fee legal? - Bristow & Sutor, Council Tax

I've emailed the council and had this response...

Dear David


Further to your e-mail I can advise you that Bristow and Sutor have acted correctly in this case.


In accordance with Regulation 23 of The Local Authorities 9contracting out of Tax, Billing, Collection and Enforcement Functions) Order 1996, Bristow and Sutor has been authorised to apply and administer attachments to earnings on behalf of Milton Keynes Council in respect of collection of unpaid Council Tax.


This effectively means that Bristow and Sutor can undertake those functions laid down in Regulations 32, and 37 to 43 of the Council Tax (Administration and Enforcement) Regulations 1992 (as amended).


Regards




Senior Revenues Advisor



Sent: 19 August 2013 10:21


Subject: RE: RE:


Dear David,


Thank you for your note.


I ought to make you aware that B&S have also contacted my employer in writing, (in clear breach of their CCA licence) and have claimed, in an email that the liability order applies to this matter.


I am also seriously sceptical about the legality of the ‘removal fee’ they have charged for.


I have attached the relevant documents for your attention, and must ask why MKC feels it appropriate to continue a commercial relationship with an organisation which behaves in such a fashion.


Their behaviour is far from the acceptable, regulated standard, and I find it concerning that MKC apparently feel happy to give their blessing to such behaviour.


I will be contacting the OFT and my MP regarding this matter.


Best wishes,

[CleverClogs]

Re: Is this Levy Fee legal? - Bristow & Sutor, Council Tax

I've emailed the council and had this response...

Further to your e-mail I can advise you that Bristow and Sutor have acted correctly in this case.

In accordance with Regulation 23 (link) of The Local Authorities (contracting out of Tax, Billing, Collection and Enforcement Functions) Order 1996, Bristow and Sutor has been authorised to apply and administer attachments to earnings on behalf of Milton Keynes Council in respect of collection of unpaid Council Tax.

This effectively means that Bristow and Sutor can undertake those functions laid down in Regulations 32, and 37 to 43 of the Council Tax (Administration and Enforcement) Regulations 1992 (as amended).

Regulation 23 (link) of The Local Authorities (contracting out of Tax, Billing, Collection and Enforcement Functions) Order 1996 clearly states that the authority is granted subject to Regulation 70 (link).

This means that the matter is still under the ultimate control of the Council.

[bizzybob]

Re: Is this Levy Fee legal? - Bristow & Sutor, Council Tax

The council remain in control at all times, and therefore liable for any naughtiness by their appointed agents B & S, no matter what carp they spout, the buck stops with the council.

If I was the CEO or leader, I would be reaching for the Immodium about now.

[bluebottle]

Re: Is this Levy Fee legal? - Bristow & Sutor, Council Tax

The council remain in control at all times, and therefore liable for any naughtiness by their appointed agents B & S, no matter what carp they spout, the buck stops with the council.

If I was the CEO or leader, I would be reaching for the Immodium and Valium about now.

IFYPFY