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PCP - Voluntary Termination

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  • PCP - Voluntary Termination

    Hi,

    I have been reading this forum for a while and thought i'd get advice but also share my findings.

    I am dealing with FGA Capital UK (Fiat Financial Services) and am VT'ing the PCP agreement as 50% has been paid.

    I sent an email saying I wanted to VT, which Fiat stated is fine due to 50% having been paid, however they are after some additional costs as expected...

    First of all they want a £70 collection fee, i'm fairly certain they cannot ask for this and I have rarely seen anyone else mention they have been charged this. This is not related to the car's condition at all and I read (possibly on the FCA website) that they cannot charge for collection of the vehicle and to complain to the Financial Ombudsman Service if they are asking for this. Would everybody agree here?

    Secondly, they want the remainder of the GAP insurance policy (£155.95 from the £288.18), this was lumped in with the monthly cost of PCP but has a separate section on the agreement (note not a separate agreement). I don't think they can charge for this again, as on the agreement it even states after the GAP loan agreement 'regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974' which obviously states within it that as long as 50% has been paid nothing further can be charged. I understand I am roughly £10 short of 50%, but charging the full amount again is incorrect. I may add as well that I don't even think i'm liable for the £10, because I have paid the amount stated as 50% under the TERMINATION: YOUR RIGHTS section which is the only part that should matter.

    Lastly, they want excess mileage. The contract was for 8k per year. Currently on about 31 months of the 36 months. Roughly 2k miles over at 6p per mile (£120ish). I feel this is the grey area of the contract as it states 'have taken reasonable care of the goods'. Obviously mileage affects the value of the car but I don't feel that having 23k mileage instead of 21k mileage would affect the cars value that considerably to say it is not reasonable care. The car is still under the national average mileage for its age by a considerable amount and how could I possibly foresee that I would do this tiny extra mileage (roughly 16 miles extra per week!). I know a lot on here are under the impression that mileage should definitely not be charge, but I was wondering if anybody has had any success stories in fighting this? I have only really seen people asking for help, then being threatened by debt collectors/court action and nothing after.

    I am 99% sure I have rights to avoid the collection charge and GAP insurance, but a little less confident on the mileage unless others can give me absolute facts from a case they have won?

    Thanks for reading, I hope some of this may help others and others can help me!

    Mark
    Tags: None

  • #2
    Re: PCP - Voluntary Termination

    There isn't any court cases that I am aware of which have gone to court regarding voluntary termination. As you quite rightly said, many people on here seek help but when it comes to the crunch, it seems that they don't want to take it any further forward.

    The "TERMINATION: YOUR RIGHTS" statement is as clear as it can get so as regards to the collection and gap charges, you are not obliged to pay. As for the excess mileage, again you are correct in that the value of the car may decrease in value but that is not the same as saying the car is not in an reasonable condition. Just because the car might require a part changed earlier than expected due to the person driving lots miles would not in my opinion put it in the unreasonable category, especially if you have had the car regularly serviced and parts changed in accordance with the service manual then it would simply be reasonable wear and tear.

    The problem finance companies have is that they are making a statement that the excess mileage caused the car to be in an unreasonable condition but they are not an expert and a court would expect an independent report confirming that was the case. Of course that is going to cost money, usually more than it would to recover the excess charges so they don't do that and by the time a court case comes the car has already been sold. The claim about the excess mileage meaning the car is returned in an unreasonable condition is dressed up as saying you breached the contract and you have to pay the contractual penalty charges for going over.

    One of the most common things finance companies do is to apply a default to your credit report which is unlawful and in breach of the data protection act.

    I am in a sort of similar boat as you but in relation to the collection fee and the finance company I contracted with claimed unreasonable damage (despite photos showing otherwise) and decided to put a default on my credit file. After going round in circles for a while, I issued a claim this month for breach of the DPA against the finance co. The finance co. instructed a firm of solicitors who are known to be aggressive and immediately filed an acknowledgment intending to defend (standard practice). Not much longer than 24 hours later, they have come back with an offer to settle the claim. Negotiations of settlement are still ongoing so I am not inclined to discuss it any further details, but I think the finance co.'s solicitors know they are in a bit of a weak position if it goes to trial.

    The gist of all of this is how far are you willing to go to ensure the finance co does not abuse their position.
    If you have a question about the voluntary termination process, please read this guide first, as it should have all the answers you need. Please do not hijack another person's thread as I will not respond to you
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    LEGAL DISCLAIMER
    Please be aware that this is a public forum and is therefore accessible to anyone. The content I post on this forum is not intended to be legal advice nor does it establish any client-lawyer type relationship between you and me. Therefore any use of my content is at your own risk and I cannot be held responsible in any way. It is always recommended that you seek independent legal advice.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: PCP - Voluntary Termination

      Good for you on fighting it, I think they assume most people won't have the knowledge or resources to fight against it and they probably do very well off the extra charges.

      I'll push back against them and let you know how I get on.

      In respect to the collection cost, the national debt line say they cannot charge it according to the CCA 1974 on the following link, second to last paragraph.

      https://www.nationaldebtline.org/EW/.../Page-03.aspx#

      The only reason I'm VT'ing is because the value of the car is miles off what was expected, leaving me in £1,500 negative equity. The only people who will deal with me are surprise surprise Fiat, offering £3,000 dealer contribution towards a new car to effectively cover the negative equity and keep me locked in.

      Mark

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: PCP - Voluntary Termination

        Always bear in mind it is Fiat that has to prove that there is a causal link between the excess mileage and the condition of the vehicle beyond wear and tear, especially when they have not carried out a full mechanical check of the vehicle and a report which explains why the excess mileage means the car is not in a reasonable condition.

        If they can't prove it then they have no right to claim it, or in many cases record a default against you for it. This is why it is always good to keep a paper trail, if they are making statements about the excess mileage then challenge them on it, ask who is their source or what evidence have they obtained which backs up their claim. If they don't or wont provide it, then that can be deemed an inference that they have none and rely on you paying up.
        If you have a question about the voluntary termination process, please read this guide first, as it should have all the answers you need. Please do not hijack another person's thread as I will not respond to you
        - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
        LEGAL DISCLAIMER
        Please be aware that this is a public forum and is therefore accessible to anyone. The content I post on this forum is not intended to be legal advice nor does it establish any client-lawyer type relationship between you and me. Therefore any use of my content is at your own risk and I cannot be held responsible in any way. It is always recommended that you seek independent legal advice.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: PCP - Voluntary Termination

          Hi Rob,

          Just studied the contract a little more and realised that while the GAP insurance is on the same contract, it is a 'fixed-sum loan agreement' and my understanding is that you can't VT these. So it looks like I will have to pay the GAP in full - gutted!

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: PCP - Voluntary Termination

            Originally posted by mckram View Post
            Hi Rob,

            Just studied the contract a little more and realised that while the GAP insurance is on the same contract, it is a 'fixed-sum loan agreement' and my understanding is that you can't VT these. So it looks like I will have to pay the GAP in full - gutted!
            Is there anything in the contract that has a heading "Termination: Your Rights"? If not then the car belongs to you if it is indeed a fixed sum loan so you can sell it or do whatever.
            If you have a question about the voluntary termination process, please read this guide first, as it should have all the answers you need. Please do not hijack another person's thread as I will not respond to you
            - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
            LEGAL DISCLAIMER
            Please be aware that this is a public forum and is therefore accessible to anyone. The content I post on this forum is not intended to be legal advice nor does it establish any client-lawyer type relationship between you and me. Therefore any use of my content is at your own risk and I cannot be held responsible in any way. It is always recommended that you seek independent legal advice.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: PCP - Voluntary Termination

              Yes there is a heading saying that, but I assume this only applies to the PCP on the car. The other section of the contract is a fixed sum loan just for the GAP insurance. Which I believe cannot be VT'd. It's like two different loans under one contract, a bit sneaky when sold to me really as I assumed it was all under the PCP agreement!

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: PCP - Voluntary Termination

                Ah I see, well they seem to be better at it than other finance co's who just incorporate it into to whole agreement. There's no option to terminate and obtain a rebate at all?
                If you have a question about the voluntary termination process, please read this guide first, as it should have all the answers you need. Please do not hijack another person's thread as I will not respond to you
                - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
                LEGAL DISCLAIMER
                Please be aware that this is a public forum and is therefore accessible to anyone. The content I post on this forum is not intended to be legal advice nor does it establish any client-lawyer type relationship between you and me. Therefore any use of my content is at your own risk and I cannot be held responsible in any way. It is always recommended that you seek independent legal advice.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: PCP - Voluntary Termination

                  I've asked the question, but looking at the terms and conditions it doesn't look like it. Fiat paid a third party in full for the GAP and I owe them for it in the form of a fixed sum loan.

                  I'd imagine Fiat will ask for a refund on it from the third party as it is no longer required but still charge me the full amount!

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: PCP - Voluntary Termination

                    Originally posted by mckram View Post
                    I've asked the question, but looking at the terms and conditions it doesn't look like it. Fiat paid a third party in full for the GAP and I owe them for it in the form of a fixed sum loan.

                    I'd imagine Fiat will ask for a refund on it from the third party as it is no longer required but still charge me the full amount!
                    If that is the case then that could be a case of an unfair contract term, if they are getting a refund from the product but then claiming the ful lamount from you.

                    I don't know if it's possible but you could try contacting the insurer direct and see if a rebate is possible? You could then use that to leverage any possibility of terminating without further penalty.
                    If you have a question about the voluntary termination process, please read this guide first, as it should have all the answers you need. Please do not hijack another person's thread as I will not respond to you
                    - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
                    LEGAL DISCLAIMER
                    Please be aware that this is a public forum and is therefore accessible to anyone. The content I post on this forum is not intended to be legal advice nor does it establish any client-lawyer type relationship between you and me. Therefore any use of my content is at your own risk and I cannot be held responsible in any way. It is always recommended that you seek independent legal advice.

                    Comment

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