Credit Card Debt

[pipeline123]

Hi All,

First post here so hoping for some good advice & support.
I will try and cut a long story short ............

I received a letter from a DCA threatening court action in relation to a credit card debt.
I started sending the standard 3 letters requesting information and a copy of the credit card agreement.
After letter 2 and no information I received a court claim.
Responded to the claim, requested CCA under CPR18, notice of assignment, deed of assignment etc.
Filled my defence, agreed to mediation.
Only now at his point I have received the CCA, statement of accounts etc but no notice/deed of assignment to the latest DCA ( been sold on twice )
I have now questioned mediation usefulness as I still have no notice / deed of assignment.

Questions are :-
I had no cca or documentation provided before they issued court action - is this against consumer credit rules ?
Should I receive a copy of the notice and deed of assignment - without these i'm guessing there is no proof that they own any debt.
I have been reading forums where people state that the deed of assignment is the legal document that should be used in court but many judges are choosing to award in favour of the creditor even when this document is not provided ?

This is my first time dealing with legal things and its a bit daunting, also frustrating when there appears to be so many DCA's that don't play by the rules.

Many thanks for any help & support

[MIKE770]

Re: Credit Card Debt

3 letters system ?? hope it was not FOTL ????


Questions are :-
I had no cca or documentation provided before they issued court action - is this against consumer credit rules ? Answer:- No but they can still start Court proceedings.

Should I receive a copy of the notice and deed of assignment - without these i'm guessing there is no proof that they own any debt. Answer;- You are not entitled to see confidential Deeds of assignments - commercial sensitive info - BUT Notice of assignment only.

I have been reading forums where people state that the deed of assignment is the legal document that should be used in court but many judges are choosing to award in favour of the creditor even when this document is not provided ? Answer:- read where////////////

This is my first time dealing with legal things and its a bit daunting, also frustrating when there appears to be so many DCA's that don't play by the rules


You can send CPR 31.14 and request items mentioned on the form N1 received from the courts at this stage to the Solicitors who issued N1 . you state you have acknowledged the court papers thru MCOL?

did you originally send CCA1974 request enclosing £1.00 statuary fee if so how long ago ??

I am sure others can then assist you with this info?

[Diana M]

Re: Credit Card Debt

If you mean what I think you mean about "sending the standard three letters" then you may not have got off to a good start with defending this claim.

A s.77-79 CCA Request would be the best way forward so why not do that now asap even though you've recently been sent a possible CCA and have filed your Defence.

Post up details of the claim removing any personal details.

Who was the original creditor, when did you last pay anything towards the account, was it a credit card, loan, HP agreement, overdraft etc? How much is the claim and who are the Solicitors involved?

And finally what was the gist of your Defence?

Di

[pipeline123]

Re: Credit Card Debt

Hi Mike770,

Thanks for such a prompt reply.
Three letters were as suggested on another site, they basically ask for copies all of documentation and cca sent two weeks apart. Not sure what FOTL is ?
So I don't get to see the Deed but I should have a copy of the notice ? This I still haven't got in relation to the latest DCA that have bought the debt.
I did send CPR18 requesting the information and also the CCA request including £1.00 fee - some 8 weeks ago. They returned my postal order and stated that they do not need the £1.00 and would get the documentation for me.
I acknowledged that claim with the court form received at N1 stage.
I didn't receive the documentation within the 12 days requested on the CCA request and still haven't got all the info. - notice of assignment.

many thanks again

[MIKE770]

Re: Credit Card Debt

FOTL = Freedom of the Land also GOODFF get out of debt for free - same thing = causes a lot of problems with peeps in court process = ignore their sites. Twaddle.

- - - Updated - - -

Hi Mike770,

Thanks for such a prompt reply.
Three letters were as suggested on another site, they basically ask for copies all of documentation and cca sent two weeks apart. Not sure what FOTL is ?
So I don't get to see the Deed but I should have a copy of the notice ? This I still haven't got in relation to the latest DCA that have bought the debt.
I did send CPR18 requesting the information and also the CCA request including £1.00 fee - some 8 weeks ago. They returned my postal order and stated that they do not need the £1.00 and would get the documentation for me.
I acknowledged that claim with the court form received at N1 stage.
I didn't receive the documentation within the 12 days requested on the CCA request and still haven't got all the info. - notice of assignment.

many thanks again

CPR 13.14 at this stage, anyway they acknowledge the CCA1974 request and makes the case Unenforceable at this stage of events, but they will no doubt try to un settle you trying to get you to give up, now give all the info you can on here i.e. when taken out/originator,/default dates/last pAYMENTS ETC keep an eye on Diana's post on you thread she will assist you better and answer her questions?

[Diana M]

Re: Credit Card Debt

Post up details of the claim removing any personal details.

Who was the original creditor, when did you last pay anything towards the account, was it a credit card, loan, HP agreement, overdraft etc? How much is the claim and who are the Solicitors involved?

Di

Thank you for clarifying that you've already sent a CCA Request 8 weeks ago and have so far received no paperwork. I assume that was one of the legal arguments in your Defence.

What did you ask for in your Part 18 Request?

You may not have seen my earlier post so I've re-quoted it to be helpful

Di

[pipeline123]

Re: Credit Card Debt

Thanks Diana M

The cca request was done some 8 weeks ago including the £1.00 fee. is a s.77-79 cca request any different ?
I received nothing within the 12 days and still haven't got a notice of assignment to the latest DCA.
The original creditor was MBNA for a credit card, last payment was some 4 years ago through a debt management company.
The gist of my defence was that the creditor has not provided me with any information and have not complied with the consumer credit act. I have only just received some but not all documentation approx. 4 weeks after filling the defence.

many thanks again

[Diana M]

Re: Credit Card Debt

The original creditor was MBNA for a credit card, last payment was some 4 years ago through a debt management company.
The gist of my defence was that the creditor has not provided me with any information and have not complied with the consumer credit act. I have only just received some but not all documentation.

Is the Claimant PRA using in-house solicitors? Just a guess

What is the documentation you've recently received ?

If that was disclosed after you filed your Defence then you may need to amend your Defence. It depends on what has turned up.

Di

[pipeline123]

Re: Credit Card Debt

Hi All,

Yes, i'm afraid it was GOODF !

The cpr18 request was as follows :-

Dear Sirs,

Re: (Claimant's name) v (Your name) Case No:

CPR18 Request for further information.

On the Xxxxx 2015, I received the Claim Form in this case issued by you out of the Northampton County Court.
I confirm having returned my acknowledgement of service to the court in which I indicate my intention to contest your entire claim.

Prior to the issue of proceedings I had delivered a request for the production of the Agreement referred to in the Particulars of Claim, and on which you intend to rely. That request was ignored.

Please treat this letter as my request made under CPR18 for the disclosure and the production of a verified and legible copy of each of the following documents mentioned in your Particulars of Claim and is made by way of Service upon You:

1.The agreement/contract, including the specific Terms at the point the alleged Agreement was made and any subsequent changes. You will appreciate that in an ordinary case and by reason of the provisions of CPR PD 16 para 7.3, where a claim is based upon a written agreement, a copy of the contract or documents constituting the agreement should be attached to or served with the particulars of claim and the originals should be available at the hearing. Further, that any general conditions incorporated in the contract should also be attached.
2.The deed of assignment
3.The notice of assignment
4.The default warning letter
5.The default notice

6. I deny any indebtedness to the Claimant but particularly deny they are due statutory interest on the alleged amount of £xxx.xx and as such I request full disclosure of the amount the Claimant alleges to have paid for this alleged debt.

7. Also, your Particulars of Claim state the action is brought for Breach of Agreement, yet you have failed to identify the specific Statutory Instrument you have commenced proceedings under. Therefore, I would be request details of the Statutory Instrument under which you have brought proceedings.

You should ensure compliance with your CPR 18 duties and ensure that the documents I have requested are copied to and received by me within 7 days of receiving this letter. Failure to produce each and every document referenced within the Particulars of Claim (detailed above) will result in an Application to the Court for an Order of Disclosure.

Your CPR 18 duties extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for the originals of the documents I have requested, the better for you to be able to verify the document's authenticity and to provide me with a legible copy. Further, where I have requested a copy of a document, the original of which is now in the possession of another person, you will have a right to possession of that document if you have mentioned it in your case. You must take immediate steps to recover and preserve it for the purpose of this case.

Where I have mentioned a document and there is in your possession more than one version of that same document owing to a modification, obliteration or other marking or feature, each version will be a separate document and you must provide a copy of each version of it to me. Your obligations extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for any versions to include an obligation to recover and preserve such versions, which are now in the possession of a third party.

If you require more time in which to comply with this request you must tell me in writing. You must tell me before the time for compliance with this request has expired. In telling me you require more time you must tell me what steps you have taken and propose to take in order to comply with this request and also state a date by when you will comply with this request. In addition your statement must be accompanied with a statement that you agree to an extension of the time for me to file my defence. Your extension of time must be not less than 14 days from the date when you say you will have complied with my request and you must state the new date for filing my defence.

If you are unable to comply with this request and believe that you will never be able to comply with this request you must tell me in writing.

Please note that if you should fail to comply with this request, fail to request more time or fail to agree to an extension of time for the filing of my defence, I will make an application to the court for an order that the proceedings be struck out or stayed for non-compliance and a summary costs order.

Yours faithfully


And the CCA request was :-

Their address. Your Address.

Date:

I DO NOT ACKNOWLEDGE ANY DEBT TO YOUR COMPANY IN ANY FORM

F.A.O: [Name of person on letter/s contacting you]

Dear Sir/Madam

Account/Ref No:

With reference to the above agreement, I/we would be grateful if you would send me/us a copy of this credit agreement and a full breakdown of the account including any interest or charges applied.

I/we understand that under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 [sections 77-79], I am/we are entitled to receive a copy of any credit agreement and a statement of account on request.

I/we enclose a payment of £1.00 which represents the fee payable under the Consumer Credit Act 1974. Please note, this money is not to be used for any purpose except as the required administration fee for the above request.

I/we understand a copy of any credit agreement along with a statement of account should be supplied within 12 working days.

I/we understand that under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 creditors are unable to enforce an agreement if they fail to comply with the request for a copy of the agreement and statement of account under these sections of the Act. Please be aware that until you provide a copy of the credit agreement the following applies.

* You may not demand any payment on the account, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you.
* You may not add further interest or any charges to the account.
* You may not pass the account to a third party.
* You may not register any information in respect of the account with any credit reference agency.
* You may not issue a default notice related to the account.
* You may not issue a court summons.

You should also be aware that unless or until you provide me/us with the the agreement requested under the Consumer Credit Act 1974, it will remain Unenforceable at Law, and any legal proceedings taken out whilst the agreement request remains outstanding, will be Vexatious and Unlawful. Be aware also that the Financial Conduct Authority Regulations apply:

7.3.18: A firm must not threaten to commence court action, including an
application for a charging order or (in Scotland) an inhibition or an order
for sale, in order to pressurize a customer in default or arrears difficulties
to pay more than they can reasonably afford.

7.11.6: A firm must not suggest or state that action can or will be taken when
legally it cannot be taken.

I/we look forward to hearing from you within the allotted time scale.

Yours faithfully/By: Etc.


Many thanks to all who are replying to me !!

[pipeline123]

Re: Credit Card Debt

Hi Diana M

Looks like you know your stuff and have guessed correctly.
Recently I have got :-

CCA
Terms & Conditions
Statements
Transaction log
Notice of default
Termination
Notice of assignment from MBNA to DCA1 ( who is not the current one !)

Yes this all turned up after defence filed !

thanks

[Diana M]

Re: Credit Card Debt

Thanks Diana M

The cca request was done some 8 weeks ago

I see our posts keep crossing so I don't know whether you've seen my questions earlier on the thread.

You say you've agreed to Mediation. Do you mean you've ticked "Yes" to Mediation on the Directions Questionairre but heard nothing more yet or is there a date in the diary from the SCCMS?

If this is an old MBNA debt, can you recall the year you opened the account?

Di

[Diana M]

Re: Credit Card Debt

Hi Diana M

Looks like you know your stuff and have guessed correctly.

Recently I have got . . .

. . . Notice of assignment from MBNA to DCA1 ( who is not the current one !)

In which case I'll make a second guess

Was the previous DCA called Aktiv Kapital or Experto Credite collecting on behalf of Varde?

Di

[MIKE770]

Re: Credit Card Debt

The usual list of DCAs for MBNA

[pipeline123]

Re: Credit Card Debt

Hi
Sorry, not used to writing on forums and having someone reply so fast ! Thank you !
I had mediation call me to arrange for next week, I have emailed to say that it may not prove useful as I have not had the notice of assignment but happy to carry out mediation if it deemed useful in the case.
The account was opened in 2005

thanks

- - - Updated - - -

Second guess correct ! AK

[Diana M]

Re: Credit Card Debt

Second guess correct ! AK

Let's call it an educated guess

I expect the next thing you'll need to know is whether any of the documents you've been sent are "honest and accurate". Did PRA's covering letter describe the CCA as "reconstituted"?

If you opened the MBNA credit card in 2005 did you do that online or as the the result of a mailshot invitation etc?

Di