DWP Recovery from Estate - Solicitor recomendations

[TVC1]

Re: DWP Recovery from Estate - Solicitor recomendations

Yes you can. They are also supposed to carry out periodic reviews every five years. I had to provide bank/building society statements going back to 2003 when they first awarded my Mum pension credit. If you have found this letter, keep it safe, I would not have thought that they have a leg to stand on so long as she declared accurate savings at the outset. After taking four months to investigate, I received a letter saying that the case was closed and no further action was required. My mother had £23,000 in the banks. Hope this allays your fears.

[KCW]

Re: DWP Recovery from Estate - Solicitor recomendations

Been reading this thread as my mum passed away in Nov and after dealing with her estate and getting probate have now received a letter asking for details of her assets, it's not even three months since she died! Filled in forms and been told they have to investigate. She was receiving pension credit and was 88 when she passed away, she left around £32000, which accrued slowly over a number of years. I can find one letter from Dwp from 2015 stating that she doesn't have to let them know if her assets increase. Can I ask them for a copy of her original application for pension credit and also the dates she was assessed? Thanks

Hello Yana2

The 'Recovery from Estate' dept will always 'investigate' when they are informed by the Probate Office of an estate being valued at more than the level of savings allowed for granting Pension Credit; £16000?. From what I have discovered; once a person reaches the age of 75 they automatically transfer onto an indefinite period of assessment. The letter you have stating that "she doesn't have to let them know if her assets increase" IMO confirms that she would not be assessed again. Therefore ... from extensive research ... I would suggest that you just wait for them to contact you again. My mother's case was very similar and my sister and I decided not to contact them ... to be honest because we thought that in protesting before they had reached a decision might actually work against us. I had a great case [IMHO] prepared but we didn't need it. Their decision was that her original assessment was correct and therefore ... case closed. Banks do not usually keep records for more than six years [the statutory requirement] and therefore you are under no legal [moral?] obligation to provide any information older than that which you may possess.

If only these departments would be more transparent!!!! That alone would ease the unnecessary stress at a time when we have more than enough to cope with.

Good luck

[Bv123]

Re: DWP Recovery from Estate - Solicitor recomendations

Hi All,


OP here again. Before I get muddled up, a quick context for the query I have -


Father passed away last year leaving behind Mum and me.
I am the son and Executor.
DWP sent me a letter to "hold off distribution of the estate".
DWP sent me another letter asking for Fathers bank/savings/post office balances, statements etc going back to 2003 and also for balances at specific dates.
I sent them the info. and also stated what some of the institutions had told me - that "they are not obliged to hold information for more than 6 years" and have sent what they do hold.


Latest letter from DWP is now asking for the same info AGAIN ("....we know some institutes can go as far back as 2003...Please ask them"), BUT also, now asking for Mums account statements - "...this account was used to receive Retirement Pension from 2011. The claim to Pension Credit was a joint claim, so any accounts/assets/investments held in the deceased's wife's name are required"


My query is (a bit confusing considering) -
- are they allowed to ask for this?
- can I ask the bank directly for this or am I obliged to ask my Mum for this?
- Does Mum have a right to refuse?
- do I have a right to refuse as this has been dragging on since Aug last year. All I want is a final letter either saying "go ahead and distribute the Estate" or "the overpayment is xxx.xx".

[enaid]

Re: DWP Recovery from Estate - Solicitor recomendations

So initially it was a joint claim for PC? this was claimed until your dad passed last year? was your mum reassessed as a single person for PC?

[Bv123]

Re: DWP Recovery from Estate - Solicitor recomendations

Hello Enaid,


Sooo good to talk to you again.


"So initially it was a joint claim for PC?" - I have to assume yes. This seems to be something DWP have found by themselves. Mum does not remember wether it was a joint claim or not. However, Mum tells me that she has not (almost never) received PC. She has only received SP, and then started receiving PIP from 2015 (Father passed away in 2016). Could this be case of the main claimant gets ALL the PC and then shares it?




"...this was claimed until your dad passed last year? " - Again, I have to assume yes - Father was receiving PC.


"...was your mum reassessed as a single person for PC?" - Again, I have to assume yes. but I do remember that after Father passing away, a few Council letters and DWP letters came to Mum saying "We are sorry to hear about your loss.....we need information about the date of death date etc " and there were the usual forms (sorry, can't remember off the top of my head) to fill out which were duly sent off. I assume from this that they have re-assessed mum as a single person.


Or am I being naive again, "assuming" things? I also remember informing them that mum now receives part of Father's Occupational Pension. I also remember completing the "Tell Us Once" service.

[enaid]

Re: DWP Recovery from Estate - Solicitor recomendations

Pension credit would have been claimed as a couple and all income should have been declared, this is an income related benefit and is a top up. Only one person claims and the money would be paid into one account in a lump sum. So your mum would have only been part of the claim if you understand me, but when it was applied for all income would have to be declared.
Have you any letters from DWP at all about the claim and the decision?

[Bv123]

Re: DWP Recovery from Estate - Solicitor recomendations

That makes sense then as to why Mum was not receiving PC into her account.

"Have you any letters from DWP at all about the claim and the decision?" - No. And to be honest, I don't want to chase and search and ask more questions and contact institutes any more. I just want to this saga to end.....but I also don't want to be naive.

So, let me get this right -
DWP are well within their rights to ask for Mum's bank statements?

Do I have a right to ask DWP what the liability is at this very moment (as I have already provided 3 sets of statements since Aug last year, they should have some calculations)? Like I said, all I want now is a final letter from DWP saying either "go ahead and distribute the Estate" or "the overpayment is xxx.xx".

[enaid]

Re: DWP Recovery from Estate - Solicitor recomendations

My opinion they are just trying to find out about your mums separate account, they will be trying to investigate if PC was claimed correctly at the beginning, has your mum had this account all along and was it included in the initial claim?

[Bv123]

Re: DWP Recovery from Estate - Solicitor recomendations

OK. I'll send them Mums statements

[Bv123]

Re: DWP Recovery from Estate - Solicitor recomendations

Another dilemna / confusion that I hope someone can help with -

The value/amount of a bank account in 2003 is no longer available. The earliest known amount is as at 2009 (banks' rule of only keeping the last 6/7 years of documents).

DWP RFE say that if the original value is not available then the last known value will be "held back" all the way to 2003. Am I right in thinking this means they will assume the amount held in 2009 is the amount held in 2003?

It does not sound fair to me that that the DWP demand Executors to chase banks etc to obtain accurate information so DWP can do their calculations, but then when the banks do not have the information, the DWP start to "assume" values.

[enaid]

Re: DWP Recovery from Estate - Solicitor recomendations

It seems to me that your dad claimed PC and did not declare your mums income/capital, if this is the case they would not know of the amount in 2003 as it was never declared. As for the 2009 amount being the one they are using as the original (what should have been declared sum in 2003) I don't know if they can do this tbh but they seem to think they can.
I hope someone can help you with this as it does seem to me they may be right in their assumptions your dad was overpaid.
I sincerely hope I am wrong, but I also think you need better advice than I give on this.
This situation being dealt with by many is a total nightmare and I have said many times the intention of PC to help the elderly manage is much appreciated. The way it is manged by the DWP and I must say a lot of the do gooders who try and help pensioners is all wrong.
Sorry I cant be of more help but I wish you well with this and please keep us updated xx

[Bv123]

Re: DWP Recovery from Estate - Solicitor recomendations

Certainly seems like there is something not right as this is the FOURTH time they have asked for "further" information.

Thanks for your advice. As for "better advice", I think I'll just end paying a solicitor to tell me what DWP are already telling me. I am now at the state where I just want DWP to give me a final figure so I can end my Executor duties. Might there be an option to make an offer to DWP?

[enaid]

Re: DWP Recovery from Estate - Solicitor recomendations

I would try CAB first off and they may have a specialist on this either locally or give you contact details.

Have had a poke around and found this FOI https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/reque...51015.pdf.html

It may be of no use to you but it does help explain a bit how to proceed if you disagree with their decision

A little more https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/reque...50213.pdf.html

[Bv123]

Re: DWP Recovery from Estate - Solicitor recomendations

Thanks Enaid for those FOI's. Glad someone actually asked those questions.

However, the answers in the FOI are more confounding e.g.

"The legal personal representative has 8 weeks to supply the bank information. If no response is received to our requests for financial information, an overpayment is
calculated based on the evidence available, as provided by the Probate Service. "

But we KNOW that the DWP has said that the legal personal representative/Executor has a legal duty to provide the requested information. There is no way DWP will simply wait and then accept a "no response" from someone who has taken an Oath to act as Executor.

I wonder if anyone knows how to contact B Willis, the requester of FOI3085 ?
If B Willis is on this forum, please PM me.

[marcus18]

Re: DWP Recovery from Estate - Solicitor recomendations

thanks to everyone contributing in this thread i've just been put in the same position but luckily i have a lot of paperwork and evidence to back me up. I'm just concerned about how long it takes them to come back as the estate is already in my bank account and i am unable to claim benefits because of it or look for work because of the stress this has put me under. I think their actions are little more than speculative criminality preying on vulnerable people and this needs to be publicised and stopped. As well as the details requested on the form I will be sending them:

photocopy of her building society passbook at the start of pension credit showing a balance of roughly £800
photocopy of first letter mentioning assessed income period oct 2003 - march 2010
photocopy of building society passbook at that date showing similar balance
photocopy of their reply to me in 2007 when I informed them of the change in her savings and they said it made no difference although by the assessed rules I didn't have to let them know.
photocopy of the rules regarding indefinite assessment periods she was 80 before the first one ended.
notice that they have carried out no re-assesments or reviews except for an appointed person visit in 2009 again before the first assessment period ended
notice that the whole period October 2003 - February 2017 is covered by assessed income
notice that I will take the matter to our MP if not very speedily resolved

any thoughts?