Re eived Court claim

[Couquerer1]

Please help, I've received a court claim by an academic institution for signing up for a place to study, but never enrolled with them. I've already sent an acknowledgement of service with an intention to defend the whole caim. I've also sent a CPR request to claimant requesting Contract documents, although I never signed one. The whole deal was done online. What points can I put in my defence?

[R0b]

Re: Re eived Court claim

Please help, I've received a court claim by an academic institution for signing up for a place to study, but never enrolled with them. I've already sent an acknowledgement of service with an intention to defend the whole caim. I've also sent a CPR request to claimant requesting Contract documents, although I never signed one. The whole deal was done online. What points can I put in my defence?

Hello,

- What is the name of the institution
- When you say you signed up, were there any terms and conditions attached meaning that by signing up you entered into a contract
- Were there any conditions when signing up or conditions before you are able to enrol e.g. certain qualifications
- What was the date of the claim issued and what date did you acknowledge the claim?

Answers to the above would be useful starting point

[Couquerer1]

Re: Re eived Court claim

Hello,

- What is the name of the institution
- When you say you signed up, were there any terms and conditions attached meaning that by signing up you entered into a contract
- Were there any conditions when signing up or conditions before you are able to enrol e.g. certain qualifications
- What was the date of the claim issued and what date did you acknowledge the claim?

Answers to the above would be useful starting point

Thanks for a quick response. Name of institution is University of Law.
- I accepted a place to study but then requested a deferral later before the course started, beacuse I could not raise the course fees as was planned.
- They were t&Cs that by accepting the offer, a contract is entered and the first installment was to be paid before the first day of commencing the course.
- was a cooling off period of 11 days to cancel the place or before 1st day of course commencement whichever is sooner.
- If I request a deferral of the place for any reason the first payment made would be carried over & used for my study on following year if deferral is accepted.
- Deferral request was refused according to communication with admissions team but then the last communication said status of deferral solved and am confused as to what that means when UoL is now making a claim against me.
- Never heard any communication from UofL since the last communication requesting to defer the place.
- UoL also passed my details to a DCA (Oriel) who have been writing to me like crazy & I slapped them with a three letter process to back them off.
-I never signed any documents the signing up for the place & acceptance of it was all done online. Never received any documents through the post, have never been to the school to enroll and never used their services.
- Claim was issued on the 15/02/2016 as on the claim form, I received it on the 17/02/2016 and acknowledged the service on the 18/02/2016.
- CPR 14:13 request was sent on the 22/02/2016.

Thank you.

[R0b]

Re: Re eived Court claim

How was the deferral communicated? and the solved deferral probably means that your deferral request has been resolved not accepted.

Did you start any part of the study and what course was this for, LLB, GDL, LPC, BTPC, post grad?

You don't need to sign a document for a binding agreement to happen, singing up online may also constitute an agreement

Were you required to pay any deposit to secure your place e.g. before the first date of study to secure your place?

Can you expand on the 3 letter process to the DCAs?

[Couquerer1]

Re: Re eived Court claim

Thanks R0b,

-Deferral was communicated via email.
-Course was for Postgraduate L.LM Lpc, never been to the school, or received any course materials.
- I understand signing up online could constitute an agreement but with this one I think it is a distance contract, and the fact that no service was provided the institution didn't lose anything. There is no way they can say they couldn't fill up the space cause I communicated with them almost 4months before the course commenced.

- I did paid £350 when I accepted the place of which I should have received a refund when I couldn't attend the course.

With regard to 3 letter process to DCA, the first letter was S10 Notice under Data Protection Act 1998, Denial of Implied Rights, letter 2 was a reminder of letter 1 offering another chance to remedy their lack of response to my request.
Letter 3- its Notice of Irrevocable Estoppel by Acquiescence.
Hope its clear enough.

[R0b]

Re: Re eived Court claim

Thanks for that, have you also taken a look at their T&Cs and find anything that could provide them with a defence? Arguably by paying your deposit you have fulfilled the consideration side of things however I do know that before you can officially start the course you need proof of your transcript from uni to show that you have completed the qualifying law modules, otherwise they won't allow you to do the course. If you don't bring it then you would sign a waiver to say you have done the qualifying modules and have a few weeks or so to provide your transcript so you can start the course straight away. If you never turned up on the day to do this and collect your materials then maybe that could serve as a sort of defence in that the agreement was not binding in any way until you had fulfilled all of the conditions, despite paying your deposit and accepting the place online.

Did you inform them at any point you wished to withdraw your place?

I suspect you won't be entitled to your deposit back as that was to secure your place but it would probably be worthwhile if you are successful in defending the cost of the course. Distance selling wise, you usually have up to 7 working days after the date you enter into the agreement provided they give you all of the correct information at the time, which I believe UoL do. If they don't then you have up to a maximum of 3 months and 7 working days to cancel or earlier if they supply the correct information and the 7 working days will apply from the point of the information being provided to you.

I understand by what you mean of UoL not losing anything because no service was provided but I always think it's a bit wishy washy, you could try to argue that and frame it as part of your defence but the fact that you paid a deposit was an intention to be bound by the terms of the agreement, if you weren't sure you could have the funds in place then you shouldn't have committed to paying the deposit is what I suspect they might say.

by my calculations you have until the 16 March to file and serve your defence and any counterclaim you wish to make. If you counterclaim as part of your defence you do not have to pay any application fees, that's if you intend on counterclaiming for the refund of your deposit.

[Couquerer1]

Re: Re eived Court claim

Thanks R0b,

I paid deposit because I had that amount and with high hopes that I would get the loan I had applied for. Only to receive a response later mid August that the bank was nolonger part of the scheme. To me this was unforceable because I had already submitted my application as well as acccepted a place, because I had to provide these details( e.g place of study, start date & course fees) & also too late to apply to another bank. This is why I then requested a deferral hoping to secure funds for the following year, coz I really wanted to do the course.

I didn't give them the transcript of my results.

The only communication I had with them was regarding the deferral nothing else until now I've received the court claim.

Am also arguing about the cooling off period of 11days after accepting the place or before first day of course, of which they say whichever is sooner? How would someone know like in my circumstance that I wouldn't be able to commence the course when I was still waiting for the response.
Also this fee is not to cover anything as they would carry it over to next year if course is deferred. What is the reason of paying such amount if I could not attend the course. I guess they are in a serious business. No way they could employ a lecturer from day 1 for 20 students when their records doesn't have 20 enrolled.
My question would be what detriment did they suffer? How many students studied there without accepting the place like I did? Did they refused them a place of study for not signing up or paying deposit? These are big fraudsters I tell you, collecting money from poor students with no service to be provided?

Their Privacy Statement states that they don't pass student details to third parties without my consent, but in this case they did pass my details to Oriel, which I think they breached their policy under the Data Protection Act 98 .

My main question is why would they collect money from me which is to be carried over if place is deferred, coz if I can afford to pay £2705 first installment no reason then for me to not go ahead with my study, raising the first installment was a big challenge.

Also UoL never communicated with me for all these years ad they were using Oriel, all of a sudden I get a court claim from them, don't you think they are playing hide n seek here. Obviously DCA has no powers to initiate a court claim unless they are hiding behind UoL.

Don't know whether I have done a right thing to sent a CPR 14:13 to UoL and am still waiting for their response.

Thanks again for the response !!!!

[R0b]

Re: Re eived Court claim

I paid deposit because I had that amount and with high hopes that I would get the loan I had applied for. Only to receive a response later mid August that the bank was nolonger part of the scheme. To me this was unforceable because I had already submitted my application as well as acccepted a place, because I had to provide these details( e.g place of study, start date & course fees) & also too late to apply to another bank. This is why I then requested a deferral hoping to secure funds for the following year, coz I really wanted to do the course.

This is something you would need to take up with the bank, but I doubt you will get anywhere as the loan wasn't even accepted it was just applied for.

The only communication I had with them was regarding the deferral nothing else until now I've received the court claim.

What was the reason for not telling them you wish to withdraw?

Am also arguing about the cooling off period of 11days after accepting the place or before first day of course, of which they say whichever is sooner? How would someone know like in my circumstance that I wouldn't be able to commence the course when I was still waiting for the response

Not sure that argument will stick, you agreed to that term and in all fairness a reasonable person wouldn't accept a place without having the funds in place. The simple argument would have been to wait until you have any response and question whether they could defer the place until you confirm funds are met. A bit hasty accepting the place without knowing you have been accepted for a loan especially if you still had 4 months before the course started.

Their Privacy Statement states that they don't pass student details to third parties without my consent, but in this case they did pass my details to Oriel, which I think they breached their policy under the Data Protection Act 98 .

There may be terms which says they can do this if you owe a debt.

Also UoL never communicated with me for all these years ad they were using Oriel

How long ago did you accept the place?

Don't know whether I have done a right thing to sent a CPR 14:13 to UoL and am still waiting for their response.

Do you mean CPR 31.14?

You still have 2 weeks to draft up your defence, and having a look at the current terms they stipulate that you need to provide them with a transcript to prove you have a qualifying law degree or your place may be withdrawn so again, despite accepting your place, one of the points to argue is that there is no binding agreement until all of the conditions precedent have been met.

If you want to knock up a draft defence I could have a look at it and give some general comments, it would also be useful to know what the particulars of claim state.

[Couquerer1]

Re: Re eived Court claim

Morning R0b, thanks once again for responding.

I accepted the place in early 2013.

Sorry I meant CPR 31:14

The reason I accepted the place is that the Bank needed proof that I have secured a place, so had to provide all the institution's details.

To be quite honest, I don't owe the Uni nothing, I wouldn't categorise this as a debt. Its payment for the services or education I would receive from the school, if place was deferred the fees would be carried forward to following year for me to receive education not anything else. So I don't see the reason why they want to enforce it, obviously it would benefit them lets say I didn't make it to proceed, as they say the fee would not be refunded. I'll wait & hear from them what the fees if for it student can't afford to proceed.


Thanks so much

[Couquerer1]

Re: Re eived Court claim

Morning R0b, thanks once again for responding.

I accepted the place in early 2013.

Sorry I meant CPR 31:14

The reason I accepted the place is that the Bank needed proof that I have secured a place, so had to provide all the institution's details.

To be quite honest, I don't owe the Uni nothing, I wouldn't categorise this as a debt. Its payment for the services or education I would receive from the school, if place was deferred the fees would be carried forward to following year for me to receive education not anything else. So I don't see the reason why they want to enforce it, obviously it would benefit them lets say I didn't make it to proceed, as they say the fee would not be refunded. I'll wait & hear from them what the fees if for it student can't afford to proceed.


Thanks so much

Hi anyone,

Following my CPR 31:14 request, the UoL trainee solicitor has sent me the terms & conditions with fees schedules, is this something they can rely on in court.

Surely, anyone can draft terms & conditions & sue in court for any amount. Can I say this is what the £2705 for. Or the fee is to buy the non-insistent service. What type of debt is it? Cause it is not a loan, credit card or the UoL never gave me anything.

Please help, am in the process of drafting my defence & would do with some of your help.

Thanks.

[R0b]

Re: Re eived Court claim

Hi anyone,

Following my CPR 31:14 request, the UoL trainee solicitor has sent me the terms & conditions with fees schedules, is this something they can rely on in court.

Surely, anyone can draft terms & conditions & sue in court for any amount. Can I say this is what the £2705 for. Or the fee is to buy the non-insistent service. What type of debt is it? Cause it is not a loan, credit card or the UoL never gave me anything.

Please help, am in the process of drafting my defence & would do with some of your help.

Thanks.

It would be useful to see the documents they have provided you, you can upload them by clicking on "Go advanced" button then selecting the icon that looks like a paperclip. Any personal details can be removed too.

They would be providing a witness statement which is contempt of court if it is not true. Sure anyone can produce them but there may be a way you could check to see if the terms given matches the terms the may have had online at the time.

It is a simple contract, I'll be honest I am not sure you might have much hope but certainly part could be something around the following:

1. You did not satisfy all of the conditions of the agreement (production of qualifiyng law degree) and therefore there was no binding contract;

2. Or if 1. is not successful then you could say that the clause is a penalty, the amount they are suing for is not a pre-genuine estimate of their loss as you did not actually begin the course, and informed them 4 months prior to the start of it. Therefore at best their losses are likely to amount to some administration fees which are probably no more than a couple hundred quid (worst case scenario)

Did they ever inform you that your place has been withdrawn, or that you have breached the terms of the agreement?

[Couquerer1]

Re: Re eived Court claim

It would be useful to see the documents they have provided you, you can upload them by clicking on "Go advanced" button then selecting the icon that looks like a paperclip. Any personal details can be removed too.

They would be providing a witness statement which is contempt of court if it is not true. Sure anyone can produce them but there may be a way you could check to see if the terms given matches the terms the may have had online at the time.

It is a simple contract, I'll be honest I am not sure you might have much hope but certainly part could be something around the following:

1. You did not satisfy all of the conditions of the agreement (production of qualifiyng law degree) and therefore there was no binding contract;

2. Or if 1. is not successful then you could say that the clause is a penalty, the amount they are suing for is not a pre-genuine estimate of their loss as you did not actually begin the course, and informed them 4 months prior to the start of it. Therefore at best their losses are likely to amount to some administration fees which are probably no more than a couple hundred quid (worst case scenario)

Did they ever inform you that your place has been withdrawn, or that you have breached the terms of the agreement?

Thanks R0b,

like I said before, the last communication I had from them was the response following my request for deferral. Imagine from May 2013 to Feb 2016 when they are issuing a court claim?

Nothing received saying place has been withdrawn or that I've breached the terms of agreement. (Its one of them days when everything is popping out of the blue)

Am sure they are trying their lucky on me.

please see their response below.

Further to your letter dated 22 February 2016, please find attached terms and conditions as referred to in the Claim Form. Please note this document includes details of payments that should have been made by yourself and form the ‘invoices’ referred to.

Please contact me if you have any further questions.

Yours sincerely,

[R0b]

Re: Re eived Court claim

I can't really give much other than what Ive said previously. You could also argue that thet have failed to follow any pre-action protocols and submitted a claim.

Are you able to upload the terms and fee schedules?

Have you moved address since you applied which could give them a point to argue they sent to your old address?

[Couquerer1]

Re: Re eived Court claim

I can't really give much other than what Ive said previously. You could also argue that thet have failed to follow any pre-action protocols and submitted a claim.

Are you able to upload the terms and fee schedules?

Have you moved address since you applied which could give them a point to argue they sent to your old address?

Thats ok dear, you doing a great job.

I've uploaded the t&c's inform of photos as I was using ipad. Can't even see them hear.

i haven't moved address since around here.

[R0b]

Re: Re eived Court claim

If you email admin@legalbeagles.info [MENTION=6]Amethyst[/MENTION] should be able to upload them for you