Dismissal for Gross Misconduct

[the94west]

Good Evening one and all.

I have to start off from the top. A few days ago in a huge moment of what I can only describe as a mindless act, I stole from my workplace. Or at least I attempted to. I was promptly caught and asked to come back in. This is the biggest single regret of my entire life.

I had worked for the company for nearly 4 years and to decide to throw it all away for this is unfathomable. Today i was invited to a investigation, which lasted for about an hour. After this was completed I was then informed after admitting my guilt, and offering no reason as to why I did it. I was informed I will be invited back for a disciplinary hearing - which I am 99% sure will lead to me losing my job, this I have come to accept.

However, my question is not about losing my job, it is about what to do next. I have written an immediate resignation which i intend to deliver to the store, this would be against the 4 week notice period so I would lose that right for pay and my holiday accrued.

I am under the impression though that the 20+ days I have already worked since the last payroll cut off and also the paid suspension will be honored and I should receive them.

I understand as well my employer has the right to deny my notice, and carry on with the investigation in my absence, this may result in dismissal and then the notice period / holiday pay is ok again?

The last bit of my query is I am fully aware this will affect my references in the future - I will not give the name of the manager or hr department for example when giving referees. I partially understand that if asked in the future, if they decided to dismiss under proceedings of the disciplinary when asked for a reference they can put "resigned under investigation" or words to that effect?

Please could anyone at all shed any light on this? Thank you in advance.

[bluebottle]

Re: Dismissal for Gross Misconduct

An employer is obliged to pay you for those hours you have worked. An employer has to be very careful when giving references as anything that is remotely untrue can result in the employer becoming embroiled in civil litigation. ACAS repeatedly warn employers of this.

Did the employer call the police? If not, why not?

[MissFM]

Re: Dismissal for Gross Misconduct

Can't shed light but just wanted to salute you for your honesty and express sympathy for you in facing the consequences of that one moment of madness. I'm sure many of us have done inexplicably dubious things on the spur of the moment and there but for the Grace of God...

Am sure someone will be along soon to give you sound advice.

Good luck 94west!

[MissFM]

Re: Dismissal for Gross Misconduct

sorry BB - posted at the same time - and 94 you now have good advice!

[leclerc]

Re: Dismissal for Gross Misconduct

I've been sacked from a well known bank but not for attempted theft.
The worst thing is the question of: what next? The first thing you do is complete forms for JSA(jobseekers allowance) cos the worst that they can do is say no. They won't because you have not been given the push but were pushed.
The next bit is to write a CV. The most important thing you can ever do is to be able to explain the reason why you were sacked because until you can turn that negative into a positive then it will bug you for a long time and some. When you finally get to that point then you are ready for the interview stage. Yes, you do still give the work as a referee because they will effectively have two choices: 1) Give a reference which states the dates that you worked for the company and that your employment ended on such and such a date or 2) they give no reference which is as good as a bad reference.

I want to clarify something and you do not have to answer this. Was it the theft of money? That is always a tough one and thankfully you realise that the consequences of theft is ultimately being fired.

I want to say one thing: you can resign but they have every right to sack you prior to that resignation period ending. I resigned on the day I was suspended because I knew that my time was up and I had worked for them for more or less 11 years. They did not accept it and continued through to the disciplinary stage and sacked me therefore ending my years of service. You are paid up to the date of sacking/resignation ending.
I'm afraid, I think they will ultimately sack you which means you are paid to that point.

I want to add something positive to the discussion though which relates to after you have been sacked. I wanted to work and I had to work so I did apply and get JSA and I did apply and receive housing benefit/Local Housing allowance(if you are in private rented accommodation). I went through all the job boards, went around the agencies with a CV and looked at gumtree, reed, monster jobs, etc etc. Expect it to be tough and expect more "No's" than you will get interviews for but keep plugging away. I work as a cleaner now and I have two jobs both of which are effectively full time hours. I work Monday to Friday(hated working Saturdays in the bank so don't do that now but had it been necessary then I would have done that).

I think it was an incredibly stressful time but ultimately by staying positive, by having great support(a lot from this forum I might add) I got through it and still believe that the change in career path was probably for the better........just abouts anyway

[the94west]

Re: Dismissal for Gross Misconduct

Thank you for your speedy response. I know I have royally shot myself in the foot, I shall now be making every effort to get a new job - and quick. Needless to say I didnt put down the manager of my current store nor the store itself. As I cant risk a bad reference, especially in this current day and age.

The police were not called, I presume because the items were recovered intact, it was an attempt at theft not a successful one and as a gesture of faith.

I have prepared my resignation and have it ready to give tomorrow in the post by recorded post. I understand possibly the manager can refuse it, however they cannot force me to stay as an employee. Also it makes sense for them to get rid of me rather than carry on paying me for the duration til a meeting which I will not attend.

[leclerc]

Re: Dismissal for Gross Misconduct

If you give notice that you are resigning, it does not stop them from continuing with the disciplinary process and sacking you prior to the notice period being completed. That is what I mean when I say that they do not have to accept your resignation.

I would add that if your reference is from someone else but who works for the same company and it is a big company with a central HR department then the person giving out the reference might fall foul of the same disciplinary process. I would add that if they gave a good reference in the name of the company and it was then found out to be untrue then you would risk termination from another job.

[stevread1]

Re: Dismissal for Gross Misconduct

Got caught in a simulair situation many years ago but it was a warehouse not a shop for a well known food company. Went thru the agencies and started off picking litter at a landfill, sticking labels on packaging at a meat factory etc. But I kept at it worked hard and turned up evry day. Soon got a reputation for being a reliable hard worker so gradually worked my way back up to decent work with decent wages. And goood references from the firms I worked for on the agency's. So its not the end altho its soul destroying at first you will get back up there.
Im afraid the old saying "beggers cant be choosers" may apply for a while untill you get back on your feet and start again.

[the94west]

Re: Dismissal for Gross Misconduct

Thank you once again for all the replies, if there is more advice I will listen to any. The theft / attempted theft in itself was not money and under £50 in goods, really really not worth it. Probably why they have kept it at store level. For the past 3 days I have been to 2 interviews and a dozen agencies, I have applied my heart out and also done the rounds with the CV. Obviously I expect it to be tough, very tough. But I'm hoping my luck is in and I have 2 more interviews a workshop and a trial day next week, one of them is commisson based though, so thats not ideal in a current climate like our own. I know I'm hoping for a miracle and luck but thats all I have. I will still hand in my resignation tomorrow as I really dont want to go through the dismissal and there of course is the chance that the manager might just accept it and call it a day.

[leclerc]

Re: Dismissal for Gross Misconduct

Next question is how do you explain your dismissal? I would probably go for the accidental take out, ie in the bag but not realised but admitted mistake immediately

[the94west]

Re: Dismissal for Gross Misconduct

I didnt think of that. If it does come down to being asked that, then I could say that. Admitted fault but unintentional. I havent been asked so far, as the new roles I have been looking for are in a completely different sector. From retail to customer service/marketing etc. THey seem to all disregard my latest retail employment instantly.

[hobnob]

Re: Dismissal for Gross Misconduct

i feel sorry for your position 94 we have all faced temptation in life


life is the hardest of teachers first come the exam ....the lesson usually follows

[the94west]

Re: Dismissal for Gross Misconduct

Thank you for the kind words. Tomorrow is another day, another day of looking for employment and my options. I will send off both copies of the resignation to my manager - I think i have worded it properly incase someone would like to look? - I can then expect to hear back with whether they want to push for the disciplinary or whether leniency has been shown and I can put this behind me and hope for the best in my job search.

[andyglover63]

Re: Dismissal for Gross Misconduct

Hi

In this siyuation what advice would you give in terms of documenting this matter on a new CV ?

[the94west]

Re: Dismissal for Gross Misconduct

Hi

In this siyuation what advice would you give in terms of documenting this matter on a new CV ?

I would, and I'm guessing I will have to leave it out of my cv. Although I have worked there for 4 years, my family own a post office and I can put down the manager there as a new reference, with having worked there, not at my current place.

I have been to many agencies in the last few days, and as I said, because I am moving sectors to a different business idea altogether, they are mostly not looking at my retail experience as it is non transferrable.

I'm hoping and praying I just get lucky. I shall be sending off my resignation first class special delivery today. That way I have a few more options:

1) the manager takes pity of some sort, and ends my employment immediately. Meaning I can just move on,
2) the manager ends my employment but still wishes to put on record I "resigned pending investigation"
3) they reject the resignation, push on with the disciplinary and I am ultimately dismissed which will ruin references totally for this company.

Ultimately I know its going to be hard looking for a job, but being pro-active will be my only option.