Hi I am a newby and would appreciate some help

[birdman]

I have an issue wit Marstons.

The debt arises from a ccj awarded after losing a case against the creditor for poor workmanship.

I have paid off a substantial chunk and now owe what is just costs and fees.

I have some experience with bailiffs but this matter is a real problem because:

My partner allowed a bailiff into her house( not mine I live with her) and he claims he has seized goods, I have written to Marstons to tell them non of the goods were mine, some belong to third parties who have removed them.

I was not in when on Xmas eve last year (24.12.11) the bailiff gained access, he left no paperwork, nothing was signed and we were not aware of this seizure until a "prescribed for No 55 arrived on 05.10.12.

I have also informed them that I have no assets, no income and after just losing my business I cannot even claim benefits.

2 main questions,

Does the lack of any paperwork invalidate the seizure, or the right to subsequent entry?
What ultimately happens if the bailiff cannot get any further money from me.

Marstons have made 3 other seizure all of cars that are not mine, 1 loan car, one belonging to my partners friend and my partners car, I do not have a car.

Marstons have sent me a date when they will pitch up with removal contractors, can they/will they do this. If the bailiff who came in did look around he will know there are no easy assets to take.

Although I was sore at losing the case, I have tried to pay the thing, but now I am angry that the legal system is geared to treat people in this way.

Sorry if I have rambled on

Birdman

[miliitant]

Re: Hi I am a newby and would appreciate some help

has this been passed up to HCEO marstons

if so why

did you not make payments to begin with when the ccj was awarded and was the ccj i believe above £600

baliffs is not my area so i am going on what i have read so take with a pinch of salt

[labman]

Re: Hi I am a newby and would appreciate some help

Deleted

[birdman]

Re: Hi I am a newby and would appreciate some help

Hi Great Dane

yes ccj for £2500.00 I had what I thought was a cast iron case against them for poor workmanship so I did not resist the original claim.

I then appealed and applied to set the judgement aside, that is when the legal system went into overdrive. Despite producing clear images of the work the judge would no accept it.

Thanks for your reply

[birdman]

Re: Hi I am a newby and would appreciate some help

Hi Labman

Thanks for your reply, sorry unclear.

I live with my partner where everything I own is, however I actually own nothing save the clothes I stand up in, just lost my business after a 5 year struggle.

Yes it was xmas 2011 when they came in.

Please expand on your Statutory declaration if this is still relevant.

Birdman

[ploddertom]

Re: Hi I am a newby and would appreciate some help

May I step in Labman?

[ploddertom]

Re: Hi I am a newby and would appreciate some help

Before going on to advice I wonder if you would mind answering some questions first as they may have a bearing on the advice to give.

When was the CCJ made
Did the CCJ state you had to pay in full (Forthwith) or did it give so much per month
Were there any gaps in your "payment schedule"
You say the Form 55 arrived 5/10/12 - can you see when it was forwarded from the County Court where Judgment was made.
When they seized the 3 cars did they leave you a Notice of Seizure, did they then accept the cars were not yours
Since the initial visit last year how many other times have they visited
Since the original CCJ was made have you been back to Court with any application to do with it

[birdman]

Re: Hi I am a newby and would appreciate some help

Hi Ploddetom

Thanks for your detailed reply.

CCj made 31.10.11
ccj started pay "£2900.00 ish forthwith
No payments were made as I contested it with a set aside and counter-claim. I was fully and emotionally occupied saving my business and did not give it my proper attention.
It was transferred from Derby County Court, no date entered in the date space. Hand written "goods as listed in the Marstons group Ltd inventory" no list supplied.

On 3 separate occasions they came and found cars, non of them mine, they have been told, they have not sought evidence or replied.

3 other visits

Since the original ccj , I as above applied for set aside and a counter-claim for poor workmanship to the equal value, but lost.
The debtor is now insolvent and I think it is the receiver who is pushing?

For your information.

Given my financial circumstance a ccj in itself was not to serious a matter, however,

I received the ccj and relied on evidence from 3 separate sources. I tried to convince them not to proceed to execution but they out solicitor, d me and I lost.

Birdman

[ploddertom]

Re: Hi I am a newby and would appreciate some help

Thanks for that. Do you know roughly how much you still owe - solely on the CCJ? Have Marstons left a note detailing their costs each time they have called? When was the last time they came & have they said they will be coming again? Is there anywhere on your Form 55 a date of when the Writ was obtained - very important?

[birdman]

Re: Hi I am a newby and would appreciate some help

I received a letter dated 09.11.12 stating I owe 1864.74 and that they will attend my premises on Monday 21.11.12 with "in bold" REMOVAL CONTRACTORS

They have not given a letter with costs after each visit.

Checking my records I have 2 no form 55s the first not dated stating "goods as listed in the Marstons Ltd inventory"

The second dated 23.08.12 seizing a car that was neither mine or my partners. Marstons have been told but have not acknowledged.

I have a Marstons own form dated 23.12.2011 stating :

I have recieved a High Court Writ against you in respect of the above matter made up as follows :

Judgement debt £2160.37
Judgement costs £22.00
Execution Costs £111.75
Interest to £3.83
Officers fees £430.73 (no break down)
Total levy £2728.67

The above document may? have accompanied the first form 55 I cannot be sure, it was not attached


Birdman

[ploddertom]

Re: Hi I am a newby and would appreciate some help

My view of this is that they will attend on that date and will use the excuse that as they had gained entry previously they would be entitled to force an entry. Sounds drastic but I also think their first visit served no purpose as they levied no goods internally or externally and the paperwork they left alludes to a "global levy" which is a definite no no. Therefore you are entitled to deny them entry. There appear to be quite a few inconsistencies with the paperwork they are leaving you as on each visit they should detail the charges made and the reasons for them.

To move forward I would make 2 applications to the Courts, one of which is more important than the other. The first and least important should be for a Variation Order, as you say you have no income this should ensure payments are set at a minimum level - as low as £1 per month even. To apply for this you need Form N245 from the HMCTS website, application fee for this is £45 but if on certain Benefits or low/no wage this may be waived - see Forms EX160a & c for details. You do have to fill I&E for this and should include your OH's income but also show the same amount being spent out - otherwise they will fail to see how you can live. This Form should be sent to the last Court the original case was heard at which I imagine will be your local Court as you previously applied for Set Aside. Make sure you print 3 copies of the N245.

The second & most important application should be for a Stay of Execution against the HCEO which if granted will halt all further enforcement & charges. The grounds you need to apply on are:
a - pending determination of a Variation Order application
b - you cannot afford the fees charged
Again I would submit I&E to back this up. This application is made on Form N244 and the cost is £80 but again you may apply for Fee Remission again as described above - you will need to submit another form. This application has to be heard in the High Court but can be submitted to a County Court that also acts as a District Registry of the High Court to which there should be one reasonably local to where you live.

The application is best taken in person - preferably on a morning. You explain the urgency of the application and in many cases a spare Judge may be found who will hear the application immediately. There are also some Courts who will produce the paperwork within 30 minutes. If granted you must notify the HCEO ASAP and be prepared to tell them which Judge, Court, date & terms it is granted on. When you receive the paperwork this also must be passed on ASAP - do NOT rely on others doing it for you. Again you will need 3 copies of the N244. I cannot stress enough how important this application is & have included a guide in another post for you.

[ploddertom]

Re: Hi I am a newby and would appreciate some help

N244 Form:

Name of Court - where original CCJ was awarded
Claim No - CCJ number
Warrant No -
Claimants Name - name of Claimant as entered on CCJ
Defendants Name - name of Defendant as entered on CCJ - yourself
Date - when you filled this in
Q1 - put your name in here
Q2 - tick relevant box
Q3 - a brief description - you are applying for a Stay of Execution on the following grounds:
i - you have no means of paying the Fees demanded because (explain why)
ii - pending determination of a Variation Order
Q4 - tick no
Q5 - tick at a hearing
Q6 - leave blank
Q7 - leave blank unless relevant
Q8 - District Judge
Q9 - Claimant & Defendant & HCEO
Q10 - needs expansion of Q3 - better done on sheet(s) of paper with each point bulletted. Include I&E. Remember to copy Statement of Truth on to last sheet & sign + date. Tick statement of case on form and again sign + date
Q11 - fill your details in

[birdman]

Re: Hi I am a newby and would appreciate some help

Hi Ploddertom

I went to my local court this morning and found them completely unhelpful, and worse had know knowledge and even disputed what I was trying to do until the penny dropped with a senior member of staff. They are insistent that I pay the fees up front, or jump through all their hoops, meanwhile action would continue.

Could you clarify for me the validity of the levy they claim to have, your earlier post said this may be a Global levy.

Bailiff gained access to my home while I was not there, but was let in by responsible adult. (24.12.11)

He made a list of asset's (10 number) without our knowledge

He left without giving us a copy or signing anything or any guidance on what to do with these items.

Non of these asset's belong to me, they have been told.

We were unaware of this list until almost a year later 05.10.12

We have an undated "form 55" which states in hand writing "goods as stated in the Marstons Group Ltd inventory" we do not know when we received this.

A subsequent letter states that the list of goods seized is not exhaustive.

I keep hearing about a statutory declaration that can be sworn that no items in this house save for my personal items, clothing etc, has this merit.

My urgent concern is to prevent Marston gaining access to my partners home, I can tough it out if I have a chance.

Do they need an order from a magistrate to break in if I am not there.

Birdman

[alham]

Re: Hi I am a newby and would appreciate some help

Hi Ploddertom

I went to my local court this morning and found them completely unhelpful, and worse had know knowledge and even disputed what I was trying to do until the penny dropped with a senior member of staff. They are insistent that I pay the fees up front, or jump through all their hoops, meanwhile action would continue. Can you just clarify this - they refused to accept an application and E160 (remission of charges)?

Could you clarify for me the validity of the levy they claim to have, your earlier post said this may be a Global levy.

Bailiff gained access to my home while I was not there, but was let in by responsible adult. (24.12.11)

He made a list of asset's (10 number) without our knowledge

He left without giving us a copy or signing anything or any guidance on what to do with these items.

Non of these asset's belong to me, they have been told.

We were unaware of this list until almost a year later 05.10.12

We have an undated "form 55" which states in hand writing "goods as stated in the Marstons Group Ltd inventory" we do not know when we received this.

A subsequent letter states that the list of goods seized is not exhaustive.

I keep hearing about a statutory declaration that can be sworn that no items in this house save for my personal items, clothing etc, has this merit.

My urgent concern is to prevent Marston gaining access to my partners home, I can tough it out if I have a chance.

Do they need an order from a magistrate to break in if I am not there.

Birdman

It is not unusual for court staff to have no knowledge or understanding of the process they are meant to run. BTW, have you been in touch with CAB (citizen's advice)?

[birdman]

Re: Hi I am a newby and would appreciate some help

The person who knew nothing about the process I was trying to undertake, suddenly became a world authority on form E160.

I even managed to find myself separated from the great British taxpayer who`s money she had a duty to protect.

She did refuse to accept my form E160 as she wanted more information regarding bank accounts of both myself and my partner, assuring me that until all this was recieved, she would not accept the form.

She further stated that Emergency hearings are only for certain circumstances such as eviction, children, etc.

No I have not yet tried the CAB

I just want to be able to deny them access.

Birdman