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Hi- had a similar experience with British Gas?

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  • Hi- had a similar experience with British Gas?

    Hello- this is my first time posting on the site, so please forgive me if I get it wrong, and for the length of the post. I would really like advice about a huge, unexpected bill from our previous address that British Gas claimed we owed, and about the conduct of BG and their debt-collecting arm.

    In our last house we had dual fuel supplied by British Gas, and paid for this monthly on a direct debit. When we moved out in June 2007 we had both meters read, left our new address for the next occupants and told BG and in due course paid the resulting final bill, which wasn't very large, as we expected. Our new house was supplied by nPower, and since 2007 we have had no communication from BG at all...until March 2010, when a card was slipped through the letterbox by a representative of a debt collection agency who said that they wanted £730 (!!) in respect of an unpaid debt that we owed to BG for electricity from our former address. The card contained threats about legal action, etc. This was absolutely the first inkling we had had that we were alleged to owe anything more to them. I might also add that while my husband had been the account holder and bill payer at our last house, MY name was on the debt collector's note.
    We knew this had to be wrong, so phoned BG who said that they had a record that we had paid our final gas bill in 2007, but not the electricity part. They also claimed that numerous bills and correspondence 'would have' been sent to our present house and that we 'would have' seen it. (We've had nothing! as if they would have let this amount go unpaid for three years even with correspondence and final demands!)We asked for a copy of the bill from 2007 that said we owed over £700, and for copies of all correspondence, but they refused and said the onus was not on them to prove we owed it, but upon us to prove that we had paid it. We had never had a bill for £730, so could not produce proof of payment, only copies of bank statements to show we had paid monthly by direct debit, which they said was not disputed.
    The final bill from 2007 that we had paid has unfortunately been shredded, and BG has failed to send us another copy of this as we requested. A couple of weeks ago I was startled to see a man in our back yard. This was the debt collector, who invited himself in and refused to leave until I had signed my name up to an agreement to pay off the so-called debt at £100 a month. I offered to pay it all straight away by debit or credit card to get Moorcroft off our back but he refused point blank, saying that he only believed in folding money, he needed a signature and a legal agreement and that I was jointly and severally responsible for my husband's debts. Having collected his first instalment there and then in cash he left.
    When my husband got in he was angry about me having to pay anything and rang British Gas explaining that I had never been the account holder and reiterating that we had never had a bill for £730. They went a bit quiet and offered to reduce the amount to £490, which he paid over the telephone in full to Moorcroft, who said that if we disputed it we should still ask for a copy of the final bill and any correspondence, then claim it back off BG if they were found to be in the wrong. We have never ever had trouble like this before- it's not a question of not being able to pay, it's the way they sent in the heavies after 3 years with no correspondence whatsoever- needless to say they've never sent a copy of that mysterious final bill for £730, or the letters they claimed we 'will have' had but haven't. What to do now?? We feel we've been swindled and bullied by BG. By the way, I ought to add that when my husband rang up BG to protest about the debt collector, they offered to reduce the amount partly because they said it was 'poor service' and that what had obviously happened was that the bill might have 'lain dormant' for 3 years. Can they make you pay a bill like that?
    Last edited by idontbelieveinmiracles; 27th April 2010, 15:06:PM. Reason: further information

  • #2
    Re: Hi- had a similar experience with British Gas?

    Hello and welcome to Beagles.
    I presume you have no receipts or a bill of any kind from Moorcroft, but you paid by card over the phone?
    I think first off I would complain to BG this info I have here is from their website and tells you how to go about it.
    For complaints relating to your gas or electricity account, please follow the steps below:
    Step 1


    Contact us by phone: 0800 072 8632, online at British Gas - Complaints Process , or by post: Complaints Management Team, British Gas, PO Box 4804, Worthing, BN11 9QU. We will do all we can to resolve your issue straight away.


    Step 2


    If you are not happy with the resolution of your complaint, please contact Andy Eley, Head of Complaints, by post: British Gas, PO Box 4803, Worthing, BN11 9QT, by phone: 0800 107 0184 or via email: customercomplaints@britishgas.co.uk.


    Naturally we want to resolve your problem immediately. When you contact us to make a complaint we will apologise; provide you with an explanation or confirm what actions need to be taken - this may include a goodwill gesture or compensation.

    If they do not come up with the desired result then you can go to Consumer Direct, they though will not take on your complaint until you have followed the complaints procedure with BG in full.
    You could also (and I think I would ) if they insist they have sent you bills in the past send a SAR (Subject Access Request) The info on this and how to go about it is here http://www.legalbeagles.info/forums/...ad.php?t=14196
    A copy of all letters and bills should come from them on receipt of this request so then you will see exactly has gone on with your account.
    Last edited by Tools; 3rd May 2010, 20:09:PM.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Hi- had a similar experience with British Gas?

      Thanks for sending me the relevant info about where to complain so quickly.
      As far as Messrs. Moorcroft are concerned, the collector agent who came to the house wrote me out a little payment card and filled in the first instalment that I was able to give him, but no, you are correct, my husband paid Moorcroft £490 (the amount BG reduced it to) by debit card over the phone. They gave him a receipt number but despite asking for one we have not had a written receipt.
      To summarize- we paid BG at our last house via direct debit (and I might add we were in credit most of the time we lived there- 10 years!) moved out, we had the final bill sent to our new address, we paid, nothing for 3 years, then Moorcroft came knocking. BG said it was our responsibility to prove we owed nothing and have not been able to send a bill for £730 or any copies of any correspondence they said they'd sent. Moorcroft said I was jointly responsible for my husband's 'debts' and made me sign an agreement.
      I seem to have heard that if BG never sent a bill, or if the one they sent and we paid was wrong, they couldn't send one after so many years. Is this only a myth?

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Hi- had a similar experience with British Gas?

        You are correct it is all in the Billing Code which is here

        http://www.legalbeagles.info/forums/...ead.php?t=1576

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Hi- had a similar experience with British Gas?

          The onus is on BG (and Moorcroft, as their debt collectors) to prove that you owe them, not on you to prove that you don't. If I turned up on your doorstep and said you owed me a ridiculous amount of money, with no proof at all, would you pay it? Exactly. Now that you have paid them, you will have a fight on your hands to get it back.

          Do you have any proof that you paid them the final bill, such as the cheque going through your bank account etc, which would probably have been at around the same time you paid the final gas bill? Send BG an SAR which they are obliged to respond to within 40 days. This obliges them to furnish you with copies of all records, info etc they hold. Tell Moorcroft to sod off (I am dealing with them myself at the moment and they soon back off when they realise that you know the legalities and won't be scared by their bullying tactics.)
          Also point out to BG their errors as outlined in by Enaid above, in the complaints procedure etc.
          Last edited by WendyB; 27th April 2010, 22:49:PM.
          Is no longer here

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Hi- had a similar experience with British Gas?

            Thanks for all your helpful advice. We have sent off for back copies of all the relevant bank statements and are as sure as we can be that when we moved, whatever bills they sent were received and paid, and that our direct debits went out as planned.
            Things have very rapidly got worse here since yesterday. Upon opening the post we found a 'pre-court' threatening letter from BG's central collection arm regarding not the electricity part of our dual fuel bill from 3 years ago (ie the bit we have just had to pay), but for the gas that they have already, and on three separate occasions, assured us that we paid on moving out of our old house. They claimed it was for £1600!!!! i.e. the gas for the entire period 2006-2007. We rang two separate advisers last night- the first one, from central collection, completely stonewalled us and said that BG 'would have' been sending us reminders and bills for three years and that we 'would' owe it, but the second adviser, from the complaints department, said that he was looking at two screens- the main screen confirmed that we had indeed paid our direct debits on time and settled the final bill upon leaving. Furthermore, he also found a £300 refund that was paid into our bank account in early 2008 because we had been over-billed on leaving our house in 2007. He was able to give us dates on which direct debit payments and the final bill payment went through. The other screen was the one from the central collection lot, which showed that we owed £1600. He totted up our various direct debit payments and the final bill we paid and found that the amounts we had paid tallied exactly with what they claimed was owed. He had no explanation at all for the threatening letter and said that he could take no action on it but that we should get back to central collection with the dates and details of payments that he quoted to us and that he 'was sure' they would be able to sort it out. My husband is ringing them today but it now seems to us that we have got on a runaway train that there will be no stopping. We can't think what the hell is going on. We are also now sure that BG, via Moorcroft, extorted hundreds of pounds out of us with no justification whatsoever.
            By the way, we found the code of practice and quoted the bit to the woman from central collections which said that they could not pursue money if they hadn't sent a bill or any communication in three years and she more or less laughed in our faces and said that it was BG policy to hound people for SIX YEARS!!!

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Hi- had a similar experience with British Gas?

              I maybe completely wrong here, but am thinking maybe they have 2 accounts for your address one in each of your names. It just seems so strange that although it seems to be paid in full they are still chasing the same amounts.
              Do not deal with Moorcroft over the phone on any circumstance, if they phone tell them in no uncertain terms you deal with anything of this nature by letter only.
              I know it all seems horrible for you right now but this will be sorted one way or another.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Hi- had a similar experience with British Gas?

                I can see why you might think there are two accounts for our old address, but there never were, because from years before we moved into that last house my husband always paid, and still pays, all the bills himself from his own bill paying account. I have purposely never had anything at all to do with paying either the mortgage or any of the utility bills since I gave up full time work in the mid-90's- I don't even know where my name came from on these latest bills (which by the way have been generated in joint names, not just mine.)
                You are right, it is horrible to believe we are in the clear but are still being pursued by their collection department, while all the time the rest of BG are acknowledging that we don't owe them anything. How they can go against their own code of practice and demand thousands out of the blue after three years is horrifying- the woman we talked to said she was fully aware of the code but their policy was six years, not the one or two as it is written. She couldn't have cared less.
                Hopefully we will never have to deal with Moorcroft ever again- I found the whole experience unsettling and humiliating and the collector agent was patronising and threatening in a horrible chummy way, actually implied my husband was a liar and said how dreadful it must be for me to find this out...you have no idea.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Hi- had a similar experience with British Gas?

                  Have you or can you check the account number they are asking for money for is the exact same as the one you were paying and have paid? They may have duplicated it somehow.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Hi- had a similar experience with British Gas?

                    Good idea, I will tell my husband to have a look through any past BG documentation we might still have, but I have a sneaking suspicion that we won't find owt as we do shred all statements, letters and so on once we know we have not looked at them for two years. This is because other houses in our road have been burgled and documentation taken in the past, and also because otherwise we would drown in a sea of paper.
                    The other thing I meant to say, is that they cannot have been sending alleged bills and letters to our old address (one idea they came up with to justify themselves) because we had mail forwarding for 2 years and also know the people who bought our house and they have been excellent about passing on anything that slipped thro' the net. The man at the complaints dept. was quite helpful and said that he could see it was an error, but we were upset that he also said he could do nothing to prevent it happening and we had to convince the central collection dept.
                    Thanks for making me feel not so alone in this.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Hi- had a similar experience with British Gas?

                      Awww I feel for you I really do and I and a lot more on here have had dealings with Moorcrofts so you are certainly not alone.
                      I was just trying to see if there was a quick possible answer as to why this was happening.
                      As Wendy said it is for them to prove you owe the money and not the other way round, but it's living with what happens inbetwean that is the nightmare.
                      Maybe if you get a chance get in touch with Consumer Direct telling them how badly you have been treated by BG in trying to follow their complaints procedure let alone get a satisfactory outcome.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Hi- had a similar experience with British Gas?

                        Thank you so much.
                        My husband has to ring the BG central collections dept. today and I will certainly let you know the outcome, hopefully we won't have to go down the SAR route as they will admit we paid years ago when they check the dates and payments told to us by the guy in the complaints dept.
                        If it turns out BG shouldn't have set Moorcroft on us re: the so called gas bill we will demand back what we paid them straight away.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Hi- had a similar experience with British Gas?

                          Whatever they say to him when he phones, please demand they put it in writing good or bad news.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Hi- had a similar experience with British Gas?

                            Will do, although they have not been forthcoming so far, despite repeated requests, with anything like receipts, alleged bills, so-called previous correspondence that they claim we'd ignored....that's because there never has been any.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Hi- had a similar experience with British Gas?

                              Well...my OH has just rung BG central collections who said they'd looked carefully at our records and agreed that their latest 'pre-court' demand for £1600 for gas used between 2006-7 is a load of rubbish and that we paid our final gas bill at the time we moved in 2007. So phew, we won't be having to pay that.
                              However, the person at the central collections said that according to his calculations he had discovered that we now owed BG around £200 in 'charges and interest and other bits and pieces' that have accrued during their 'pursuit' of our 'debt'. My husband (I think he was a bit cross by now) read out the relevant portions of the billing code to the man on the phone, who glossed over it completely by saying he was well aware of the code and in this instance it did not apply. This £200 could not be considered part of the original gas charges (paid as agreed in 2007) but were simply their costs in managing our debt. WHAT DEBT??! He'd just agreed we'd paid our gas bill in 2007! The man in central collections said that they were now going to generate a further pre-court action letter reflecting their 'very generous' reduced demand. My OH is going to ring them back tomorrow after he has spoken to our solicitor but it is clear BG have decided that they feel entitled to make free money off us and they are going to get it any way they can.
                              We feel more confident now and thanks for all the support- I will keep you posted. I think we will definitely be writing to Moorcroft under the terms of the billing code to get back what we had to pay them.

                              Comment

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