Warrant of control against director

[Jenna32]

Hi

Can I get some advice please!
Back in 2018 a former employee won a judgment in an employment tribunal for unpaid wages.
She then added our names to the warrant of control and an order of recovery
(Just to clarify we was unaware of anything due to change of address)
We only found out early this year when an order of recovery was put in our name and we got a call from a bailiff.
To cut a long story short we Appealed to get the judgment set aside and any order of recovery against us personally to be cancelled against us personally as it was a limited company.
On the day of our hearing The judge was a little surprised that She even got our names added to order of recovery and explained to her why he is canceling any orders made against us personally, and made it clear she needs to only Pursues the company (which was struck off, which she now reinstated) only and not the directors, as the original award and explained made by an employment tribunal was against the company and not us,He made it very clear that she can't come after us personally.
However a month later she has appealed this decision and wants our names Once again added to the warrant of control and order of recovery and this time on part p of the civil acts. No evidence to back anything apart from me saying that our company made a loss in the call....she is trying to say we acted fraudently now...which of course is ridiculous and just a malicious claim.
I really need to know does she have a chance to add our names again as why were they were added the first time I don't know how can only say it was done in my absence.
Why is the court entertaining this . And don't we have a chance to defend this as a proper trial if she is going after us civilly, can't just add a ccj to my name when I don't have a judgment in the first place.
Really need some help here anything would be appreciated

[R0b]

I think we need to take a step back and confirm the history behind this. It sounds like this is linked to your previous posts but there are some anomalies between what you said in earlier posts and this one, so I have some questions (for everyone else's benefit this is your earlier post: link).

1. Your previous posts suggested the person was self-employed but now you say they're an employee, which is it?

2. The previous post said that the judgment was obtained (or indicated) in the county court, not the employment tribunal. Can you clarify whether the claim started in the tribunal or the county court?

3. You say the company was struck off but before you said it was liquidated. These are not the same thing, so we need clarification on that - if it was struck off, was this a voluntary strike off or a forced strike off by Companies House because you didn't file accounts?

4. Did she get permission from the judge who set aside the judgment to appeal?

5. You usually have 21 days file an appeal unless a judge gives you longer, so what date was the appeal filed at court? She may be out of time.

6. We need to see the appeal notice she has filed so can you upload it (redact her personal information)?

7. What do you mean by Part P of the Civil Acts, I don't know what this means and not even sure that it exists.

Answers to be above questions would help us assist you, otherwise we would be taking a punt in the dark. Everyone is entitled to file an appeal but just because she files an appeal does not mean she will succeed.

[Jenna32]

Hi Rob,

Thank you so much for replying.

just to answer a few questions, you asked above. The information was a bit vague as some of we didn't know.

1, All staff that came to work for us were supposed to self employed but working for the company- were paid By us at the end of the month with an invoice.
In this instance this employee worked with us for just a short while under 1 months and not longer after our lease was forfeited by the landlord.
We spoke with ACAS at the time explaining she was self employed. We only had a text outlining this. They said she didn't have a contract stating this. But she didn't have a contract stating she was employed either. We did have text evidence where we stated she was self employed and she acknowledged it.

2, The original judgment was made in a employment tribunal court
It was made in April 2018 She didn't tell them she was self employed clearly - we didn't know about any pending judgment as all the previous paperwork went to the business Out landlord forfeited the lease in nov 2017 and wouldn't let us collect mail or our property (that's a different matter altogether) and by March 2018 I was no longer at the address the claimant had found on companies house. But from what I've seen on the paperwork she knew our landlord had forfeited the lease but still was getting correspondence sent to the business. But I've seen the orginal paperwork now and the employment tribunal Award went to my previous address. I was on the electrol roll and my new address in April.

3, We filed out accounts as normal in Jan 2018 as that's what our accountant advised us to do. By March we started proceedings to strike the business off. The claimant appealed this decision( we still had no idea at that point there was a case against the company) companies house suspended the strike off to give her the claimant time to produce evidence. She didn't produce enough evidence and the strike off was successful in our favour.

4, from what I can see we have a different judge on the new case in November and I can't see anywhere where she has asked permission.

5, our hearing was on the 2nd June. Remotely
she filed this case on the 6th August nearly 2 months after.

6, have uploaded her appeal notice.

7, she send me an email on the 21st July telling Please see her email
Whether or not you were operating at a loss by not paying them their wages you commit fraud.
As you then have told the county court that you had no intention of paying them their wages.
Please note this is what you said to judge on June 2ndand which is recorded by the court on the remote hearing that you were operating at a loss. This recording can be retrieved by the criminal system from the county court.
I have therefore had legal advice and been told that I can have your individual names added to the original orders and warrants of control to actively pursue my wages .
Under part P of the civil procedures act.

[R0b]

This sounds like a real mess, I haven't got time to digest everything you've put right now but based on what you've uploaded, she's made an application to add you as a defendant under Part 20 of the Civil Procedure Rules. As far as I'm aware they can't retrospectively add you as a defendant to a judgment once it has been given unless it is appealed or varied or you've had an opportunity to defend yourself.

What's more concerning is that you said the default judgment was made by the employment tribunal, so why on earth did a judge in the county court set aside the original decision from an employment tribunal. I'm not even sure if county court judges have the powers to do that and would have thought it was either the Employment Tribunal or the Employment Appeal Tribunal. Are you absolutely certain she made a claim via the employment tribunal using an ET1 Claim Form (something like this) and not a claim form used for county court proceedings (something like this or similar)?

I'm going to tag the resident employment expert Ula for clarification - Ula, are you able to shed any light on this? Do county court judges have the power to set aside a employment tribunal judgments?

Also, do you have a copy of her witness statement which suggests it has been filed by email to the court? What is this hearing for in November, you must have received correspondence from the court about this and if so, what does it say.

[Jenna32]

Hi rob, I've uploaded the orginal employment tribunal judgement.
I just wanted to add she already had our names added before only to the warrant of control and order of recovery.
I think she did have something varied had our names added by the civil acts part 23 back in 2018.
In June 2020 the judge explained to her she should never have got The order of recovery or warrant of control (the only things in our names) in our personal names as that this was a judgement made by the tribunal. It was also made clear by the judge she's needs to only pursue the company for warrants and orders.
I've uploaded the tribunal award and original judgement she previously had.
hope that helps.

[Jenna32]

I do not have a copy of her statements she sent via pdf. No.
She also got the company restored by a court order! How can she can she ask the court to get a warrants etc Back in my name after we just got the order and warrants against cancelled and set aside. I have to date no judgments against me.
Ccj I had only since January 2020 was also removed.

[Jenna32]

I understand this is a little more complex but any help would be appreciated.
she is receiving legal aid, therefore these applications costing her nothing. Worse thing we don't even owe the the amount in question but that's beside the point.
I don't have thousands of pounds to fight but I don't want to feel constantly threatened n bullied and pay her personally to stop the harassment.

[Jenna32]

Oh the hearing in November is an application asking them county court under the civil acts part 20 is to Have our names added and the companies name added to the original judgment Made by the employment tribunal. And then the companies name added to the enforcement order made in may 2019 and the warrant of control. And is asking the set aside recently done to be reviewed and reinstated.

[R0b]

It is definitely a real mess and I'm still struggling to try and get to the bottom of everything as it seems there's still gaps missing. I still have some more questions.

When you made an application to set aside the employment default judgment, did you do this through the County Court or the Employment Tribunal?

In getting the default judgment set aside, you must have received an order from the court/tribunal, so what does the order actually say? Might be helpful to post that up so we can exactly what the court had stated.

[Jenna32]

Hey Rob,

So I've gone through all paperwork and think I know what happened.
Employment tribunal made a award in March 2018 against the company- (I have sent you the original award and yes go get that award she filled in a ET1 form)
In May 2018 she asked the county court to get a order of recovery. (Rem in our absence) And in my name- the court awarded the order of recovery against me (I've posted the original letter to make sense) based on the fact there was a employment tribunal award, even though it was against the company.
I can only assume how she managed to get it in my name...and that, She may have lied to the county court and said were sole traders or simply The court took her word for everything , and never checked it was a ltd company and added my name only
I can't think how else.
Then some time later she asked for a order of recovery against my business partner (I've also enclosed that letter) and it happened again to my business partner.
Because she had a order of recovery against us she also in 2019 managed to get a warrant of control.
We found out in 2020 I even got a ccj in my name - my business partner did not, which was even more weird -whch has now been removed of course when we had our set aside in June.
We appealed the order of recovery and warrant of control in 2020- we was advised as this was awarded by Watford county court, we had to ask them to set aside the warrant and order.
In June 2020 we had a hearing with a county court judge - who like yourself was a little perplexed as to how and why she had a order of recovery made in my name when the judgement was made against the company by an employment tribunal against a ltd company too.
He was a little baffled as to how she even got this order ....I can only imagine it was in our absence and they took her word. She said that's what she was advised- by her solicitors! The judge explained she was advised wrong and needs to go back to get legal advise.
Based on those grounds he immediately explained to her that she she can't get an order of recovery or warrant in my name as the ET judgement is against the company which is also Ltd. Based on those grounds he cancelled the order of recovery made in our name back in 2018 and set aside the warrant of control against myself n my business partner.
The hearing we have in November Is with the county court only Is a new hearing dated August 6th 2020 2 months after the set aside- and she is asking the county court again, to appeal not only the judges decision made in June she wants the order of recovery etc back in my personal name and want my name added as defendants to the original judgement made my the employment tribunal under the civil acts part 20.
To date just to confirm apart from the original award made in 2018 March by the employment tribunal against the company I have had no dealings with them or any hearings etc.
How can my name be added to limited company debt without a fair trial, so I get a chance to defend myself.
Surely she can't just add my name to a ET award and do the county court have the power.
Can the country court add my name as a defendant. Surely I'd be giving a actual hearing to defend myself.
Can a warrant of control be added in my name again for a ET award.
Whole point in having a limited company is having limited liability.
She had also via email recently said she's going add my name as she feels we didn't act as directors and that we ran the company as a loss. Had the business less then 2 years. Only filed our last years taxes as a loss obv as we lost our business that year.
it's become personal- we can't keep having her making all these claims and we need to know what's our rights.

[ULA]

This does sound very messy and I am not sure how much help I can be.

Sorry the upload photos of the original ET award are so grainy I cannot read them. What was the original ET1 claim for? I presume that the award was not paid by the company therefore the person used one of the options available to them to get the money paid. Did you get any warning notice giving you 28 days to pay the award or risk paying a penalty?