Enforcement notice from council for replacement fence after neighbour complained

[Aprilla6]

Hi Guys hoping you can help me decide whether to play ball or fight for my rights. Sorry for long post but wanted to give you an image of the lay of the land. As you look into my garden from the house, the rear fence borders 3 rear gardens in the next street. This has always had a high fence approx 7'.6". In one garden is a large shed, middle garden has a 7ft fence and a garage that you can see over my fence and the 3rd garden did have a garage until recently when they demolished it. To the left looking towards the bottom is my semi detached lunatic Neighbour separated by a 6ft fence and to the right a new build with 7'.6" fence. Nice neighbour (Their land is about 2 ft higher than my garden) Lunatic neighbour moved in about four years ago and is my neighbour from Hell. Long Story and needs a separate thread as court is imminent but for now this is more pressing. So the rear fence has been in Situ for 12 years maybe more. It was rotten and broken and has been patched up for the last 4 years but High winds finally saw it off this year and I had to replace the majority of it because House 3 has a very large Newfoundland and he kept escaping and they were worried about losing him. So concrete posts replaced the remaining wooden ones to match the existing. Larger Gravel boards were added and panel size was reduced accordingly. We asked rear neighbours if they were ok with the new fence and they were all very happy with it. We had had several burglaries in our sheds since the fence had been broken and the deterrent was back up. Lunatic neighbour reported it to planning and I had an officer down to view it. I wasn't worried as it was no different to what had already been there so was shocked that he said I had to lower it. I said I was under the impression that as long as I didn't change the height It was ok. He said no its a new fence. I said no its new materials. The fence has always been there in that position and height. I said this isn't fair I need to talk to someone more sensible and I am not lowering it I will appeal as its no different to what its always been and Lunatic was not using them as a weapon against me. The fence doesn't affect him at all. He said you can always appeal but I have to serve an enforcement. So I have received an enforcement that will take effect on 14th may. I really don't see why I should have to lower a fence after all theses years because of a spiteful neighbour and my view will be a concrete garage, sheds and another high fence. The reasons stated are that its height is over dominant ( only to my garden as its lower) and results in an increased sense of enclosure ( Neighbours cant see it behind their sheds and garages) Reduces natural light, (No more than the sheds and garage) creates a sense of overshadowing that is detrimental to visual amenity of neighbouring properties ( again untrue it cant be seen behind the garage and sheds) and amenity now my trees in large pots are back against it is nice. MY QUESTION is do I have a chance in appealing this successfully or should I give way. I am really loath to do this and wish I had just patched up the fence until neighbours complained about how bad it looked! It would also have saved me a lot of money. Any advice would be greatly appreciated

[charitynjw]

Hi Aprilla

Imho, if the fence is not a 'party fence' between you & the neighbour, there is nothing much she can do about it if the proposed new fence is at the same height as the existing one.

Fences, walls and gates do not require building regulation approval.

Although building regulations do not apply, the structures must be structurally sound and maintained.


Garden Walls


*If the garden wall is classes [sic] as a 'party fence wall', and depending on the type of building work you intend to carry out, then you must notify the adjoining owner of the work in respect of the Party Walls Act etc 1996. This does not include wooden fences.

*But the rear fence is not a party fence between you & NfH.

https://www.planningportal.co.uk/inf...garden_walls/2

[des8]

That first post is a bit off putting being a solid block!

To start with, replacement of an existing fence is considered a new build and so subject to planning laws

Bit confusing as to which land is higher than which and where the fence heights have been measured from.
Why is the land at different heights (a slope that has been terraced perhaps? are there retaining walls holding back the higher land?]
Diagrams might help.
Maximum height without PP is 2 metres, usually measured from the side where land is highest.

What is the exact wording of the enforcement notice?

Appealing and losing will probably result in an adverse costs award

[Aprilla6]

That first post is a bit off putting being a solid block!

To start with, replacement of an existing fence is considered a new build and so subject to planning laws

Bit confusing as to which land is higher than which and where the fence heights have been measured from.
Why is the land at different heights (a slope that has been terraced perhaps? are there retaining walls holding back the higher land?]
Diagrams might help.
Maximum height without PP is 2 metres, usually measured from the side where land is highest.

What is the exact wording of the enforcement notice?

Appealing and losing will probably result in an adverse costs award

Hi Des8 .. Yes sorry about the block. I copied and pasted and forgot to split it up. Attached is a rough layout of what is where. garden layout 3.jpg

[Aprilla6]

Des8 the fence in question is 7'6". I know that's over 2 metres but that's what it has always been.

Fence can be seen by Neighbour 1 @ 42 and who wanted it back to original height because of their Large dog being able to scale the temporary 5'6" barrier that was in place.

Neighbour 2 has a garage that backs onto my fence and along side the garage a fence that runs parallel to my fence at the same height.

Neighbour 3 has a shed that blocks the bit of fence that backs onto them and therefore can not see it either.

If I lower my fence all I am going to see is a pebble-dash garage, a high fence and 2 sheds. The letter says MY fence is imposing and gives a sense of enclosure and blocks natural light and views for the neighbours. NOT true their own out buildings do that. The only garden that would be shaded by my fence is mine because of the way the sun moves across the gardens. I just think its really unfair that because I have made good a dangerous and rotten fence they can tell me to take it down even though its situation and height are the same. The gardens also suffered several shed and garage break-ins while the fence was broken.

[des8]

How much lower is your garden to those in H1,2 & 3, and is your fence on the boundary line?

[Aprilla6]

Des8 house 1 is around 6" higher and house 2 approx 12" and house 3 back down to around 6 to 8. The fence is a foot or more onto my property. 14 years ago just before I bought it the owner took down a Hawthorn bush that ran across all 3 gardens and was directly up to the garage. Apparently he moved it in because the ground was too uneven and didn't want to mess with levelling it.

I suppose I could tell Planning that I will move the fence to the boundary that is higher and do away with the gravel boards. I just didn't want to take the extra foot off the other gardens because they needed the space more than me.

Nice neighbours ground level is about 2ft higher than mine. Its a new build and had to be so much above the flood plain. My garden is so much lower than the patio around the house. I believe it has been unintentionally lowered at some point to level out the ground. In 2007 it was a lake and all the other gardens water drained into mine! Luckily the house itself was high enough not to flood, just.

Maybe I should just concede on this one as I have bigger battles to fight. It just seems so unfair that all I have done is repair and improved the fence making it safer for all four houses yet because of one spiteful neighbour who it doesn't affect we all lose.

You say the land should be measured from where the ground is highest. He didnt do that. Should I get him back and ask him to measure from the other side backing garden 2 where it is higher?

You also asked what is the exact wording of the enforcement notice. I am scanning to attached it minus names and addresses Thank you for replying

[Aprilla6]

Des8 here is the enforcement

[des8]

What you could do is to apply for retrospective planning permission.
I note the enforcement notice states the council will not grant PP, but that is not necessarily the councils view.
If you apply for PP the council have to inform all affected property occupiers, and they can give their support.
Get your councillor round and show him what it is all about.

If PP is refused you can then appeal it (although if you lose you could find yourself paying councils costs)

As the awkward s** next door can only possibly be affected by a small section, have you asked the inspector about a compromise such as reducing just that one section?

[Jinxer]

https://www.planningportal.co.uk/inf...d_garden_walls

You will not need to apply for planning permission to take down a fence, wall,or gate, or to alter, maintain or improve an existing fence, wall or gate (no matter how high) if you don't increase its height.

[des8]

In this particular case the original fence was completely removed and a new fence erected.
This would be considered a new structure, and if not covered by permitted development rules, would require planning permission.

To avoid future problems I always advise people to check with their LA before commencing works and even apply for a certificate of lawful development.

[Jinxer]

Maybe I should just concede on this one as I have bigger battles to fight. It just seems so unfair that all I have done is repair and improved the fence making it safer for all four houses yet because of one spiteful neighbour who it doesn't affect we all lose.

The op say's he has repaired and improved the fence. What is concerning is how it's got to the stage of an Enforcement Notice (this must of been ongoing for a long time).

https://www.mylawyer.co.uk/work-on-y...-A76052D35199/
You will not need to apply for planning permission for a fence, wall or gate, if you don't increase its height. In a conservation area, however, you might need conservation area consent to take down a fence, wall or gate.

[Jinxer]

Just one more thing to note, if the fence dividing the houses on either side isn't new and the fence at the rear is attached to these, then would that not prove a repair to the existing fence.

[des8]

The wording used by Aprilla6 strongly suggests that the whole rotten structure was removed and replaced.
I note that in some places tho' the language is such that the poster considers it a repair, but I get the feeling that is using the words somewhat loosely
Perhaps he could clarify for us????
Quote ".....High winds finally saw it off this year and I had to replace the majority of it....
..........So concrete posts replaced the remaining wooden ones...........
...........we asked rear neighbours if they were ok with the new fence...............m
..........it was no different to what had already been there..............
...........He said no its a new fence. I said no its new materials............
.........wish I had just patched up the fence..........."unquote