Biomass Boiler System - Constant breakdowns.

[Guest]

<sub>Hi LegalBeagles: Below is a lengthy description of my 3 years of heating hell! I really hope someone can offer some advice for me and my family.

The background: in 2015 a Cornish company approached me with the offer of a free external Biomass Boiler system. The offer was based on the governments Domestic Renewable Heating Initiative (RHI). There were two choices of this system.
1. I pay to have the boiler installed and I could them claim the governments RHI payments which totalled about £18,000 over 7 years (quarterly payments).
2. The company install the system for free with no deposit or costs. The would give a loan for the £18,000 but there is no cost to the me as the company then claim the full RHI payments over the 7 years. The company maintain the boiler for free during this time.

This part of the agreement is all fine and I am only providing this as information regarding the setup.
I chose option 2, I took out a loan with the company (all correctly handled and regulated). I obviously didn't actually receive any money as they then installed the boiler and supporting system and then claim the RHI payments to complete the loan payments.

The problem I have is with the lack of reliability of the system. I have a full log of breakdowns since 28/04/18 when the boiler was first commissioned. To give a summary we have had 160 days without heating since installation 3 years and 7 months ago (12% of the time the system is not working). This is from 22 separate breakdowns. The longest two were 39 days and 32 days (without heating) but more commonly they are 1 - 10 days. We are currently on day 11 of our most recent breakdown and it looks like the fix won't take place until Monday (day 16 or breakdown).

The company who installed and maintained the boiler have always been quick to respond to faults. In August 2017 after a huge number of issues they even replaced the boiler, but the issues still continued with the new one. It's difficult because despite the efforts of the company the boiler kept breaking down again and again. There were a couple of occasions where I feel the company let me down regarding contact, but on the whole they did try, maybe their engineers weren't skilled enough, maybe the boiler was just not appropriate for my old stone house or maybe this is just a poor design of product, either way, despite all their efforts the company just couldn't keep it running reliably. At its best every few months it WILL breakdown.

It October 2017 the company went in to voluntary liquidation. As a result their assets (including my loan and other similar loans) were sold off. My loan along with the contractual demands of maintaining the boiler we sold to an independence investor. A seemingly honest and reasonable man, however, we are still in the same situation regarding breakdowns. He has paid to have a shed built around the boiler to prevent water getting into the system (this was the reason for a few breakdowns), he has responded to all breakdowns to get engineers out to fix problems but we are on breakdown 4 of 2018.

In summary, it seems that the company and new investor have been reasonable in attempting to fix my boiler but unfortunately after 3 years and 7 months of breakdowns and fixes I feel I have reached my limit. The number of cold days we have endured and the cost of trying to provide some relief with electric heaters has gone on too long. Before going into liquidation the installing company did once reimburse me £100 for electric, but I estimate the cost to me for buying coal, wood, electric heaters, electric has been over £550.

I have previously asked the company (on a couple of occasions) to remove this system but they refused. All I am offered is fix after fix. I am hoping that there is now a legal avenue I can pursue to force the new investor to refund me? Remove the system and replace with oil like my original one that was removed (it was a working system)? Or with the installing company going into liquidation am I stuck for another 3 and ½ years with this system?

I can’t just remove it myself and have another installed…. I have a loan agreement which the RHI payments pay.

Thank you for taking the time to read my lengthy explanation, I appreciate any support you can offer.</sub>

[frozone]

Hi, I've registered now. This is my post regarding the Biomass issue. I thought it would be a better idea to register with the site. Thanks again for any support that can be offered.

[des8]

Hi and welcome
What was the exact date that you took delivery of the fully completed and installed system?

Presumably the loan was regulated under the Consumer Credit Act ?

[pipsaholic]

Make a complaint directly to the company for financial compensation for the loss and also make a separate compliant through the financial ombudsman I got 2 separate refunds from each for my solar panels.

[frozone]

Hi, I've registered now. This is my post regarding the Biomass issue. I thought it would be a better idea to register with the site. Thanks again for any support that can be offered.

Sorry for delayed reply people.

Hi des8

28/04/2015 was the date the system installation was completed. It was regulated under the Consumer Credit Act, yes.

[frozone]

Hi and welcome
What was the exact date that you took delivery of the fully completed and installed system?

Presumably the loan was regulated under the Consumer Credit Act ?

Hi Pipsaholic, unfortunately the company who installed the boiler no longer exists.

[pipsaholic]

Did you buy the system with cash or finance? Always buy with finance them pay off in a lump sum of cash rather than cash only as it gives you more protection against companies going out of business or system underperforming.

[frozone]

To update on the latest developments here.

After a number of discussions with the independent investor who purchased my loan we have come up with a potential plan. He seems like a reasonable guy who genuinely wants to sort things. We haven't agreed anything yet but we had a very frank discussion about two potential options.

1) We walk away from the whole thing. He loses his investment and I'm left with a system that doesn't work. This means I no longer have a loan, but the downside is that I used to have a working oil system and I am left with nothing.

2) He pays for the installation of a backup oil system so that the investor could still claim RHI payments. The biomass system would be metered and I would agree to always prioritise using the biomass system so that the usage results in worthwhile claim for RHI payments. In my mind this seems like the way forward. When the biomass breaks down (it will) I switch to the oil system with no worries about how long it takes to fix. When the loan is paid off in 3 years 5months (ish) I throw the biomass system away and I am back to a working oil system.

We both agreed option 2 was best but since the investor has been given a rough gestimate that installation of an oil system could be 4-5k he is a little more unsure. The investor wants me to give it a few more months and see how it goes. The compromise was that we would get quotes while keeping an eye on how the system performs. I have no doubt it will breakdown soon so I guess this is not an unreasonable request?

In addition; I now have a new contract to sign. Originally the contract was a loan with the installation company (properly regulated) and secured on the house for some odd reason. The company then changed the loan to be an unsecured loan, I believe this was to do with the cost of financial registrations if they were offering a secured loan. As I said before this secured loan was then passed on to the investor. The new contract is removing the loan altogether and instead we have a maintenance contract. The investor maintains the boiler and receive the RHI payments but there is no loan on the boiler. I'm guessing this is to reduce costs being a loan provider. My only worry about this is that I'm guessing I have some protection under the Consumer Credit Act, whereas when the loan is gone and it's just a maintenance contract I have no protection, it is just my boiler and a company receives money to maintain this. Am I right?

thanks all for your help

[des8]

At the moment you have a no cost unsecured loan for the biomass plant which is maintained for free, but the investor receives all the RHI payments.
suggestions are 1) continue as is plus an oilfired back up system installed and maintained FOC
2)cancel loan and have a free maintenance contract . investor receives RHI payments

From your viewpoint 1) would seem preferable as 2) could leave you without heating when biomass breaks down and repairs can't be implemented immediately. I wouldn't entertain 2) regardless of protection or otherwise of CCA .

[frozone]

Thanks DES8. I guess option 3 is oil boiler and agree to change contract to maintenance only as delay in repairs won't matter if i have a backup.

Am I right in thinking the CCA does hold the lender responsible for problems i have? I'm just thinking I maybe best sticking with the loan contract until the backup is installed?

[des8]

seems right

[meellis]

I would be interested in any possible outcomes if this went legal because I could see so many potential grey areas and parts that would be untested. You lost a perfectly adequate heating system for this to be installed with no compensation or fall back if the proposed installation wasn't up to the job. Now you are stuck with this heating system stuck on your property. I can totally understand why the investor is trying to sign you up to a different agreement. He has probably realised that he has invested in loans that he isn't actually registered to administer so will probably have no way of enforcing, and the only way to get his investment back is for you to be able to burn biomass because the return is against fuel burnt. He owns the boiler on your property but he as no way of making you use it. If an oil back up system is installed than any assessors from RHI would have to be confident that no heating from the oil system would be metered and hence possibly falsify any RHI claims and you would probably soon get tired of having a tank full of oil sitting there unused (especially if it has cost you £500) and still have to buy wood pellets.
I am a heating engineer and two of the large estates I look after were changed to biomass but I still encouraged them to stick with oil and gas as a back up because I was never convinced that the proposed systems would work reliably, which they haven't. Don't get me wrong, biomass should work well (and in other countries it does) , but the complexities of the RHI and the requirements to be able to administer it meant that a lot of heating professionals who were up to making good installations just didn't get involved. This has meant most of the firms that have been involved are based around money men who sell them on the great returns promised and then get the cheapest labour to work for them, there doesn't seem to be many truly qualified people involved in the installation process. Out of all the people who have been to look into the issues with the system have any of them been from the manufacturers of any of the components that are failing often and hence given a true un-biased view on whether it has actually been installed correctly. A lot of the problems with the systems that I have been involved with seemed to have been lessened since the actual boilers have been down rated on their fuelling which went along with my theory that a lot are oversized for there actually installation.

[frozone]

Hi MELLIS and thanks for your comments.

I'm hoping this doesn't turn into a legal battle but I think it's fair to say that If I don't get an oil backup then it will have too. Since out latest repair on Monday 12th we have had 3 minor breakdowns.

*Error 12 (13/11/18) - failed ignition. No big deal, boiler restarted first attemp but its always the same, by the time I've noticed the error the house is freezing, the buffer tank is cold and we are hours away from getting warmth.
*Error 34 (18/11/18) - 'Vacuum Error below minimum threshold' - Again boiler started first attempt after I woke up to a cold house
*Error 34 (21/11/18) - as above - Again this morning woke up to a freezing house - boiler started up first attempt.

Interesting what you say about other places having problems with biomass systems. I've looked around on the internet and I can't find much information. There are some comments but I was expecting thousands of people to be struggling with them.

With regards to boiler sizes I have always thought mine is undersized. I have a largish 3 bedroom detached house which is very old with stone walls. It's a cold house! My boiler is 18kw. My parents have a similar type house (slightly smaller) and they had a 20.5kw oil system installed a few years before I went to biomass. I'm not sure how it works but in my mind a Kw is a Kw regardless of the system. Just makes me wonder if the source of my problems is the boiler is just too small.

Thanks again.

[Biomassfix]

Hi apologies if this is not in keeping with this site.

I am experienced biomass boiler engineer, I worked for a German boiler manufacturer as the UK commissioning engineer, I have over twenty years experience in the heating industry.

I have much success working with people who have problem boilers or systems. If you would like to send me further information about the boiler and the problems I would be happy to look at the information and see If I can make some suggestions.

Kind Regards

Biomass Boiler Repairs and Services Ltd