No Justice

[MIKE770]

Re: No Justice

Not forgetting section 69 = good order & military discipline = always the Catch22

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This was a serious miscarriage of just Wales a court martial is vastly different from a normal trial.
Many thousands of serving and retired military personnel supported this bail application and feel how wrong the verdict was.

nem

Anybody who has been involved on occasions of preparing evidence etc for court marshals will know there can be ambiguous differences.

[Diana M]

Re: No Justice

I just thought it was a bit odd of the BBC if they had already broadcast it, so they are asking to be allowed to broadcast the rest of the footage that was recorded and used in the CM which might put the actual shooting part in more of a context? or was the shooting video broadcast in breach of the original order?

I see no reason for reporting restrictions to be lifted in regards to the video footage. Despite my background (as a BBC Producer) I'm against Trial by TV before the court has done its job free from the influence of public opinion when that public is not in possession of the full facts. There has also been mention of the possibility of any further trial (re-trial for manslaughter) being before a jury.

Not granting bail seems harsh under the circumstances. However I can't really comment since just like the general public I'm not privy to the whole story which seems to have become a moral/political argument instead of a legal one.

If there is or has been a miscarriage of justice let's hope it's dealt with swiftly.

Di

[Amethyst]

Re: No Justice

Nope I'm with you completely Di, I see no reason to lift reporting restrictions until afterwards - the video shouldn't be out there at the moment IMO - I was simply confused why the BBC were applying for a lift of reporting restrictions when they had already broadcast the video ( although I think it was broadcast in between their application and the judgment ) but they would have know that in broadcasting it they would be in breach of the order.

[nemesis45]

Re: No Justice

I'm not convinced that that video should be published at all.

nem

[MIKE770]

Re: No Justice

serve no purpose,

[nemesis45]

Re: No Justice

serve no purpose,

None whatever Mike.

nem

[PAWS]

Re: No Justice

Just my tuppence worth…..
This is a tricky one and certainly not straightforward. I have to admit that when it comes to a war situation and all the variables that implies the use of the word ‘murder’ has to be carefully considered.
If not for such trials we would all be happy enough to let our soldiers make our world safer. We would not want to know what conditions they operate in and turn away from the more unsavoury details. We are just happy they are there (and don’t get me started on the ‘but why are they there' argument) We are happy to let the armed forces police themselves but every now and then something strays into the mainstream and opinions run high.
During conflict s**t happens. We have all heard the stories of Vietnam etc. But there were also the stories of WW1 and WW2 allied POWS being mown down and we are appalled by this and rightly so. Having been brought up on a diet of biased war films we are used to seeing our immaculately turned out soldiers swaggering in saintly style and playing by the marquis of Queensbury’s rules. When you actually read some of the released statements of WW2 soldiers you realise how fictitious this is -imagine what the ‘still classified’ stuff would reveal. We cannot even begin to appreciate the strain they were under and remember most were conscripts with basic training and not the professional soldiers of today.
Having said all that I just want to know this; imagine that wounded man is lying on the ground and someone strolls up to him and fires into his undefended body. Now picture the chap on the ground is wearing a British army uniform and the man firing into him is a Taliban fighter?
What do you think the headlines would read?

Oh yes, in big bold print ‘MURDER’.

Of course they are under unimaginable strain and they have seen horrific atrocities carried out by this evil enemy but are we not there to prevent this type of behaviour. Are those soldiers not out there to stop this cold blooded attitude to human rights?
Surely all people who commit murder are either insane or suffering from a temporary loss of sanity due to unbearable pressure? Is it not reasonable to expect a Soldier to be trained to control his emotions and one would hope his mental state is properly monitored.
I think any Armed officer, Army, police whatever, should be allowed to use their weapons without fear of recrimination because that second of hesitation could cost many lives but we must also depend on appropriate training and ensure those entrusted do not suffer ‘a momentary lapse of judgement’ because when they do people die and not always the right people or in a justified manner.
We may have a romanticised view of the honourable British Tommy but descending to a level where we are expected to understand or even accept the shooting of an injured man who is no longer a threat is, I think, a ‘reality check too far’.