DAY 2 - OFT Test Case - as it happens

[TANZARELLI]

Re: DAY 2 - OFT Test Case - as it happens

Just to throw this into the pot for discussion.

www.consumercreditsupport.co.uk[/URL]]
"The judge said he wants to ‘’establish the principals of current T&C’s and apply those principals to historical terms and conditions‘’. The OFT’s QC who spoke for the first time in the hearing said that ''for the purposes of this hearing, the OFT’s main interest is current T&C’s''. And the bank’s seem to be keen to introduce as many historical T&C’s into the equation as the judge would allow. The judge eventually decided that the banks should choose one historical set per bank. after it seemed that neither party or the judge was keen to make the selection"

- ah, I think that if we break down this part, if my understanding is correct, the judge seems to wants to apply any judgements made on the current T&Cs to the historical T&Cs - the OFT don't want him to do that. Many of the banks have changed their T&Cs so, if the judge views the charges in the current T&Cs as services, it would be in the bank's interests if this view also applied retrospectively.

[TANZARELLI]

Re: DAY 2

Tanz, do you happen to have T & C's for Halifax for 1990 within your collection.

Ta.
DSxx

Hi DS,

All I have re Halifax are:

Cardcash March 1999
Special + Banks Account Conditions May 2002
And some from 2004

[thephoenix]

Re: DAY 2

Hi DS,

All I have re Halifax are:

Cardcash March 1999
Special + Banks Account Conditions May 2002
And some from 2004

Hi Tanz

Would it be possible for you to make the above T&C'S available to all our members???? if they aren't already

[Tools]

Re: DAY 2 - OFT Test Case - as it happens

To add to phoenix`s request, if anyone has copies of their Terms & Conditions for any bank , credit card ,loan agreement etc could they please post them here>>>Banks Terms and Conditions and Standard Contracts

A big thank you to everyone in advance.

Jules

[EXC]

Re: DAY 2 - OFT Test Case - as it happens

One thing I forgot to mention (my memory is a concept of the distant past) that I thought was interesting was that the QC who was told by the judge that he would make a reccomendation to the County Courts on stays, subject to the outcome of the hearing, tried to convince the judge that the hearing had little relevence to the outcome as the current stayed claims had a very narrow focus (?).

The judge then revealed that he had not looked at any County Court claims or defences, ''not one''.

Though it may appear at least a little surprising I wouldn't read too much into it myself as I'm sure he'll need to see some before he makes any reccomendation.

[TUTTSI]

Re: DAY 2 - OFT Test Case - as it happens

I would be happy to supply the judge on my claim which has been stayed -Abbey's defence, which is totally different to the defence for this test case. Maybe then the Judge will see then what we are up against.
DSxx

[EXC]

Re: DAY 2 - OFT Test Case - as it happens

I bet you would TUTTSI !

But I'd imagine he'd consult a few cc judges first.

[TUTTSI]

Re: DAY 2 - OFT Test Case - as it happens

Do you think I could post him a copy of that defence, is that a possibility - Abbey have owned up to the breaches but just they could not be asked to supply a breakdown of their charging regime.

I am sure that the OFT are aware and maybe they will bring this up!!

[Tools]

Re: DAY 2 - OFT Test Case - as it happens

I have the judges fax number if you wish TUTTSI ?

[TANZARELLI]

Re: DAY 2

Hi Tanz

Would it be possible for you to make the above T&C'S available to all our members???? if they aren't already

Yes mate, I have already had a conversation with tools re this and am going to email the over the addy tools provided.

I have been a bit busy with one of my claims and work etc so not had chance yet.

It is in the pipeline mate. :okay:

[TUTTSI]

Re: DAY 2 - OFT Test Case - as it happens

I have the judges fax number if you wish TUTTSI ?

ok pm me with the FAX number, I am up for it!!

But is it admisable!

Dsxx

[EXC]

Re: DAY 2 - OFT Test Case - as it happens

ok pm me with the FAX number, I am up for it!!

But is it admisable!

Dsxx

It probably won't be as far as the hearing is concerned but in consideration of his reccomendation I don't see why not.

Go for it TUTTSI - there's nothing to lose.

[TANZARELLI]

Re: DAY 2 - OFT Test Case - as it happens

Tuttsi did anyone on CCS send info re this to OFT prior to the start of the test case? I know we were going to but didn't here if it got sent.

[TUTTSI]

Re: DAY 2 - OFT Test Case - as it happens

Tanz,
Yes I think they did and as far as I know - no response as yet.

But there are definately some inconsistencies between the ABBEY and one of the other banks but cannot remember which Bank.

As I said if the Judge will read it I am quite happy to FAX to the Judge my Abbey defence if it will help the Judge to see the differences in the defences and help him with his judgement regarding the stayed claims and if anyone wants to do the same or if LB want to send them on behalf of their members with a suitable written letter I am cool with that.

DSxx

[EXC]

Re: DAY 2 - OFT Test Case - as it happens

----- Original Message ----- From: EXC
To: clive.briault@fsa.gov.uk
Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2008 12:26 PM
Subject: CC Stays & Waiver



Dear Mr Briault

During the second day of the OFT test case hearing Justice Andrew Smith made clear his intention to make a recommendation to the County Courts on the status of current stays on bank charge cases, once a judgement had been made on the outcome of the hearing.

He also made it clear that any recommendation would be made regardless of any appeal to his judgement being made.

If, in the event that the judgement is found in favour of the Office of Fair Trading and a recommendation to the County Courts results in the stays being lifted, is it the FSA's intention to revoke the complaints handling waiver?

I would be very grateful if you could take the trouble to reply in person. There are a large number of poor and disadvantaged families who feel their banks have ripped them off and then been afforded the luxury of the cosy shelter your waiver provides them.

I look forward to a prompt and concise reply

Regards

EXC